Posted on 09/07/2012 6:59:04 PM PDT by Ken H
“Did it ever occur to you that maybe it’s just that LA, itself, is a sh*thole full of anti-social criminals to begin with? “
These problems in my neighborhood began with the legalization of drug collectives. So, no. You’re wrong. And thanks for insulting my city.
And you’re welcome, Northern California, for all the tax money Southern California supports you with, so you can sit around stoned all day in your oh-so-civil, problem-free drug dens.
Oh, wait. No, you’re not welcome.
“61% in Colorado Favor Legalizing, Regulating Marijuana (27% against)”
Polls don’t count; elections do. And the last time legalizing pot outright was on the ballot in California, it lost. As it always does.
CA will not get fooled again by the “medical” camel’s-nose-under-the-tent liars who couldn’t get their way honestly. The ones who promised doctors making house calls, dispensing eyesight saving pot pills to old ladies with glaucoma.
And what’d we get instead? Countless eighteen-year-olds getting their “medical marijuana” cards as a Rite of Passage. Unemployable career criminals selling out of storefronts next to Subways. Decent people forced to flee decent neighborhoods — if they could get anything for their houses. Crime increased 1000 percent.
Rage against the machine all you want, losers. LA is getting rid of this scourge. Put that in your bongs and toke it,
“If doctors see some value in prescribing it, I would not oppose its legalization for that purpose.”
Doctors do NOT see value in pot. That they do is another lie propagated by libertarian potheads.
You will not be able to find a reputable physician, one educated in the United States at an accredited medical school, who will “prescribe” marijuana. Which is still illegal, by the way. To prescribe it. It’s banned.
Some hack sawbones from the University of Guam who’s hanging onto their medical license by a thread and can’t get work elsewhere will write you a ‘note’ saying how you ‘need’ it, because you’re just so anxious. But you won’t get a legal prescription. And not from a reputable physician.
May I have your source on crime increasing 1000%?
As a paralyzed veteran who has experienced pain on a daily basis, and knows many other quads and paras who do also, I can tell you for certain that there are doctors who believe that pot helps alleviate the pain and muscle spasms associated with muscular atrophy.
Now they do not prescribe it, mostly because Pennsylvania still lives in the prohibition era when it comes to marijuana.
FWIW, more people now die annually from prescription drugs than from illegal drugs.
"A sedated population is an easily controlled population."
Take rights away from the Federal government and give it back to the individual States?
What a revolutionary idea! I like it!
The cleanest answer would be to get a federal law stating that it would be a state decision. Barring that, you would have to craft the state law to strictly ban the transport of marijuana across state lines.
The Federal government usually steps in if it can claim that interstate commerce is involved.
The biggest problem I have with the whole legalization argument is this: Where do you stop? Ok, fine, many people think that Marijuana is a relatively harmless drug. I don’t believe this, but I will concede the point for argument’s sake. Do you then, also legalize heroine? How about meth? Crack cocaine? Some substances are so dangerous, I don’t see how they can be legalized. Drugs are a scourge on American society, including the overuse of legal prescription medications. Hard drugs are even worse than alcohol in the destruction they bring to one’s health and social order. Yes, legalizing drugs would remove a lot of the criminal element associated with the drug trade, but not completely. Criminal gangs would just manufacture or import even more destructive drugs to replace that revenue stream. So, where does it stop? I would like the country to be more socially conservative like the 1950’s and less like Haight-Ashbury. I don’t see how adding one more legal drug to the already extensive list of legal drugs available accomplishes that personal wish.
If people decide through the electoral process to legalize a drug(s), so be it. However, overall, I don’t this will do anything to make our society better or make us any more competitive in world trade, quite the opposite IMHO.
Actually your bullshit statistics you used simply to prove your lies prompted me to actually look at crime statistics prior to the introduction of medical marijuana in 1996 in California and post introduction. There has been a consistent decrease in crime every year. So I don’t quite understand your point on crime is increasing due to medical marijuana.
Your argument about some people abusing the system to get their cards and smoke might be true, but these people would just buy from a dealer if it was illegal. Or do you actually think it being “illegal” would stop them from doing something they really want to do? Did it stop people drinking in the prohibition? No, it did not.
And doctors, do see value in marijuana. Are you a doctor? I don’t think you are, so please refrain from giving “doctors” opinions on marijuana. If anything, the problem is that it will be smoked, and that is what is bad for the health, the smoke. Which is why there are methods like vaporizing and eating that are less harmful than smoking.
May I ask where you went to medical school?
Of course. It's not a sure thing in CO either.
CA will not get fooled again by the “medical” camel’s-nose-under-the-tent liars who couldn’t get their way honestly.
Then why don't they get a petition to ban MM and put it on the ballot? They've had 16 years to do so.
Rage against the machine all you want, losers. LA is getting rid of this scourge.
So be it. That's between Los Angeles and the State of California, and NOT the federal government. Agreed?
Please refer to my last post for a more complete explanation of my opinion on the matter. You would see that I am not entirely persuaded by the Libertarian legalization stance.
I am not a doctor and I don’t know what percentage of doctors advocate the use of Marijuana for medicinal purposes. I know of one deceased relative who used to smoke it for pain-relief during the advanced stages of cancer. In his opinion, it gave him some much needed relief and it allowed him to eat which was something most of his other pain medication did not. I am glad he was able to have some relief from that horrible, and in his case, fatal disease.
Nevertheless, I do not advocate or support the recreational use of marijuana as I stated before.
Correct. The murder rate in CA has fallen by better than half since 1995. See:
http://www.disastercenter.com/crime/cacrime.htm
There has also been a substantial decline in the LA murder rate over the last decade or so. See:
http://www.city-data.com/city/Los-Angeles-California.html
“Legalized” medical pot is nonsense. Smoked marijuana has toxic and carcinogenic ingredients; smoked pot contains more than 400 different chemicals, including large doses of the hazardous chemicals found in tobacco smoke.
Medical marijuana already exists. It’s called Marinol.
A pharmaceutical product, Marinol, is widely available through prescription. It comes in the form of a pill and is also being studied by researchers for suitability via other delivery methods, such as an inhaler or patch.
Alcohol is a drug, caffeine is a drug, nicotine is a drug, aspirin is a drug, ibuprofen is a drug.
Maybe we should have stopped before we let any citizen have access to any potential harmful material? Gasoline, paint thinner huffing. Narcotics and hallucinogens including morning glory seeds, jimsonweed, wild fungus, ergot, hops, peyote, nutmeg, daffodil roots, wild lettuce, bay berries, belladonna.
You ask “Where do we stop”? I ask the same question. Where do we stop?
We can all live in government boxes and consume only government provided food and drugs and go outside with government supervision so we don’t hurt ourselves.
Well, when you see libertarians promoting the legalization of kiddie porn on FR (or anywhere else), please give us a ping.
Until then, most folks on FR recognize your post for the idiotic strawman that it is.
Whereas NM had pretty stringent guidelines all along to qualify, and you don't see dispensaries all over the place and you actually have to have a significant medical condition - confirmed by two doctors in most cases - to get a license.
And guess what? Different states, different approaches, different results, learning what works and what doesn't. Isn't that what federalism is supposed to produce? Experimentation in fifty states, with success and failures - a much better approach than the top-down one-size-fits-all-and-badly approach of the feds imposing their will upon everyone?
There are several doctors in New Mexico who will work with patients to get them a medical marijuana license - and their actions are regulated heavily by the state, and the license application and all accompanying medical documentation has to be approved as well.
You are falling back on semantics. Yes, doctors cannot prescribe marijuana per se, but many see benefits to pot use under specific conditions and will work with patients to where patients can legally buy their own marijuana.
Your straw men are duly noted! Your premise is totally incorrect. The drug discussed in this thread is marijuana, and I compared it to alcohol in it's damage to society....
Alcohol is the #1 drug abused... IN THE WORLD!
Nov. 1, 2010 -- Alcohol abuse is more harmful than crack or heroin abuse, according to a new study by a former British government drug advisor and other experts. -WebMD
This chart is from a DIFFERENT study and source...
Even an Eskimo in Alaska can get all the hemp he wants, any time he wants, in under the time it takes to get a pizza.
If you want your world to be a hemp-free environment, try living on the Moon.
I did not make the rules or decide how to categorize substances as controlled, the “government” did. The laws were created, ostensibly, because there was some perceived social benefit from controlling them at the time, If you want those controls lifted, lobby or advocate for a change in law. Convince enough people and you will see a change or just disregard the law as many choose to do. I, for one, don’t feel enslaved not being able light up a joint. I am more concerned about government’s encroachment in other areas of my life such as health care coverage, taxes, free speech, freedom of religion, and gun rights.
I may not agree with legalizing some drugs, but I support the right of others to argue in favor of it.
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