Posted on 01/06/2009 11:18:06 AM PST by neverdem
MARTIN COUNTY — We entrust teachers with the lives of our children and give them enormous responsibility.
We expect them to not only teach "reading, writing, 'rithmetic" and a dozen other subjects, we increasingly expect them to handle responsibilities like sex education and "anger management" and other issues that used to be dealt with in the home.
Why then do we deprive teachers of their basic right to self-defense?
Take the question further. If it involved self-defense at a school campus, the lives of our children are probably at stake as well — and we're going to expect teachers to protect our children with what? A textbook?
It's a valid question as the Martin County School District and other districts re-write their policies prohibiting firearms at schools to be in line with Florida's "bring your guns to work" law that lawmakers approved last April and took effect in July.
The law allows Florida residents with concealed weapons permits to keep firearms in their cars at work, even if employers have a policy prohibiting firearms.
Except at schools.
Other workplaces where you can't have a firearm in your car are correctional facilities, nuclear power plants, military and government buildings and anywhere explosives are stored.
The exception for teachers, especially, does not make sense.
"Why is it that a person can be trusted on one side of a school parking lot and not on the other side?" Stuart attorney Jeff Kirsch asked.
Kirsch is an advocate for responsible firearms ownership, as I am. He's handled firearms-ownership cases and is chairman of the National Rifle Association Foundation's Martin County chapter annual dinner and fundraiser.
"I think teachers ought to be treated like anyone else. Schools used to be like any other job and for whatever reason we've now carved out some kind of 'safety zone,' and it just doesn't make sense," Kirsch said. "We don't trust teachers to make the right kinds of judgments? Isn't that what they're paid for?"
Superintendent Nancy Kline calls it "a tough issue."
"Should there be adequate security? Absolutely, and we're reviewing with the (Martin County) sheriff's office the levels of security at all campuses," Kline said.
"But should that be something teachers are involved in? I don't know," Kline said.
I do.
We don't like the idea of guns on an airliner but today's reality means pilots are packing heat.
So, teachers should be allowed to have firearms in their cars even at school. I'll take it further: Considering how vulnerable our campuses and our students are, if teachers are trained and have concealed weapons permits that require background checks and training, they should be allowed to carry them wherever they go.
Even in the classroom.
Martin County columnist Geoff Oldfather can be reached at (772) 221-4217 or geoff.oldfather@scripps.com. Plus, catch Geoff Sunday mornings from 8 to 9 a.m. for live talk radio on The Coast, 101.3 FM, or the Coast Forum.
Should teachers with concealed weapons permits be allowed to keep firearms in their cars even on school campuses under the state's "bring your guns to work" law?
Should teachers with concealed weapons permits be allowed to keep their firearms on them wherever they go, even in the classroom?
Yes and Yes!
Why can’t my 16 yr old son take my Ruger 45 semi auto hand gun to school? He is trained to shot it and my other guns and is quite a good marksman. He attends a private Christian school. I asked the headmaster to allow the teachers that want to to be armed. The headmaster said it was against North Carolina state law for guns in school zones. I replied that AII states in part that the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. He had no reply.
I don't think many teachers would want the responsibility, they are way overloaded already with all the social engineering that is supposed to be accomplished in the home. Maybe some parental accountability is more in order than armed teachers in our schools.
Parental accountability didn't stop the school shooting in Pearl, MS. An armed Assistant Principle did.
” and we’re going to expect teachers to protect our children with what?”
The answer is simple and obvious. Through our educational system, we’ve already empowered our children to defend themselves, using the skills they’ve been taught in sensitivity, tolerance and the unquestioned embracing of alternative lifestyles. What more do they need?
Looking at the big picture, education in the US is about changing society, forget the three R’s. If a lone lunatic happens to get a firearm into a school undetected, and manages to eliminate a few students, that is just one school out of thousands and they are, after all only a few students. Compared to the numbers of useful citizens being created through public education, these few students are just a small sacrifice society can certainly afford to accept in the quest for the larger goal.
And, the loss of these students through the immoral proliferation of firearms use can be exploited for the larger good. The grieving parents can turn to the many fine government support programs to help cope with the situation. And, as far as their loss of a tax-deduction, the new practice of unlimited economic stimuli for every season will help them recover financially.
So, it’s all win-win.
It is only through the systematic infringement by our government(s), of the God-given rights guaranteed us in the U.S. Constitution, that teachers are currently NOT allowed to arm themselves.
It is unclear to ME what part of “...shall not be infringed.” our local, state and federal governments are not understanding.
Because gun grabbers have passed laws that ignore the Second Amendment. How dare this Oldfather speak so much common sense?
We don't like the idea of guns on an airliner but today's reality means pilots are packing heat.
That legislation was passed in the aftermath of September 11, 2001. Imagine trying to get that passed today. Happy New Year!
VERY good sarcasm. Thank you.
One approach is very simple, deputize selected teachers and empower them with law enforcement authority.
One approach is very simple, deputize selected teachers and empower them with law enforcement authority.
That term grates on me like fingernails on a chalkboard. I'm thinking about SHOOTING the next reporter who speaks/writes the phrase "packing heat".
;^)
You know, I support having ordinary citizens given concealed carry permission and support the Second Amendment.
But I’m not sure I support allowing teachers to carry guns in the classroom or out of it.
Most of them are anti-Second Amendment left-wing fascist who teach anti-western anti-American socialist propaganda in their classrooms.
I don;t trust them with our educational system and I don’t trust them with guns.
I can’t see any teacher of sound mind bringing a gun into the classroom.
The teacher in in loci parenti responsibilities would be put in a liability situation that is untenable in comparison to the pay scale.
20 to 30 pairs of grubby inquisitive hands at a time, there is just tragedy waiting to be written.
Schools would need to retrofit classrooms to provide secure storage.
Schools will be forced to renegotiate property and casualty, health, and life insurance premiums with insurance carriers.
Schools will be bankrupted in court if there is just one incident of a student acquiring a qualified and insured teacher’s firearm on school grounds.
And further, the more likely a school district is in need of armed teachers, the less likely the school district is financially able to cover the increased liability costs to do so.
So even if in favor of this, it would take a very large reworking of the American school systems to make it work in practice. The legislature can pass any law they want, but unless the law includes liability waivers for school districts, the practical applicatoin of the law is going to maintain the current status quo.
“One approach is very simple, deputize selected teachers and empower them with law enforcement authority.”
This is the only path forward I see, it moves the liability issues to proper law enforcement agencies for the jurisdiction, provides a framework for criminal proceedings for firearms discharge in response to commission of a crime, and allows proper protection of the teacher/deputy in cases of civil lawsuits.
That’s actually a very good idea. When we were at church last weekend, we spotted four armed LE officers and two security guards. I feel fairly safe there, particularly when we noticed that the LE officers each have a specific patrolling pattern. Why shouldn’t our schools have something similar with a handful of teachers trained to respond in case of emergencies.
With proper concealed carry measures, no one will ever know who’s armed or not...besides which, a firearm out of arm’s reach is useless when TSHTF.
1) Yes
2) In most cases, yes, but it should be up to the school if private, or the public school district deciding on a school-by-school basis. There are some big city public high schools where the classrooms are filled with and controlled by young thugs with long rap sheets and short fuses. Some of them are quite capable of overpowering a teacher, grabbing his/her gun, and shooting somebody, without giving a cr&% about the consequences. Such schools should, of course, have armed guards patrolling the hallways and ready to jump into a classroom when needed, but having the teacher (often a woman with little physical strength) armed and alone in a room with a bunch of street thugs and their pals is asking for trouble.
Not the teachers I know.
You have every other john, dick, and harry complaining how the teachers are the problem and how their son would never do such a thing. Let a teacher break up a fight between students, see what happens to that teacher if he as much as lays a hand on either student; trying to pull them apart; give you a clue lawsuits.
Raise taxes, employ armed & trained security personel; and finally hold parents financially responsible when their kids break the rules.
When I went to school, you respected, almost feared certain teachers; that's all gone for the most part in many schools. Look right at your elected school boards; they impose regulations and never support a teacher when parents stick the blame.
Something else. I have seen guns in schools several times, usually a problem kid, having problems at school. The one thing administration never wants to happen is word get out to the public. They handle most guns in school issues very discretely when possible.
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