Posted on 07/22/2007 4:39:17 AM PDT by Alas Babylon!
The Talk Shows
Sunday, July 22nd, 2007
Guests to be interviewed today on major television talk shows:
FOX NEWS SUNDAY (Fox Network): White House homeland security adviser Frances Fragos Townsend; Sens. Kit Bond, R-Mo., and Evan Bayh, D-Ind.; British entrepreneur Richard Branson.
MEET THE PRESS (NBC): National Intelligence Director Mike McConnell and Sen. Russ Feingold, D-Wis.
FACE THE NATION (CBS): Sens. Harry Reid, D-Nev., and Olympia Snowe, R-Maine.
THIS WEEK (ABC): Pre-empted by coverage of the British Open golf tournament
LATE EDITION (CNN) : White House homeland security adviser Frances Fragos Townsend; Pakistani Foreign Minister Khurshid Kasuri; Sens. Dick Durbin, D-Ill., and Mitch McConnell, R-Ky.; David Bonior, John Edwards' campaign manager, and Rep. Artur Davis, D-Ala., Barack Obama supporter.
placemark
Oh, when she gets a mind to she can get things done quickly...
14 Years Later, Mystery Still Remains in the Death of Vince Foster
Remember the Stone Age Press saying the Taliban was preparing for a Spring/Summer offensive in Afghanistan? Remember how doomed out troops were going to be? Wrong again Pravda.
Pray for W and Our Troops
Just go out and run around the house two or three times — that will take care of that donut!!!
I am hearing a lot of discouragement lately from, otherwise up to this point, stalwarts. I am concerned.
The fact that the Republican party has not gotten out in everything from local newspapers up to beating the doors down of the big three broadcasters in support of this war and harping on its successes is killing us. In shouldn't have to be just the Pres and his administration doing this. Where are our Representatives and Senators? Compare their silence with how the democrats everywhere protected Clinton during his impeachment. What mattered more to this country?
Still, the number one dealer in our defeat has been the DBM. Damn them straight to Hell! I said it right after the Nov 06 elections. Others might disagree, but I’ll say it again. The DBM is doing more to lose the war on terrorism, worldwide, as well as in Iraq, than even the enemy. By their constant harping on atrocities by US (so unfair, if anything our military often gets itself killed to avoid atrocities—something no other military has barely bothered with) and their profound hatred of George W. Bush, they're willing to see us lose rather than a political enemy protect us (and look good in the bargain).
I don’t know how we can truly sustain our efforts to support the Pres in Iraq with this biased group of “gatekeepers of what’s occurring in the world”. We truly have very limited access to the minds and hearts of most people to let them now what’s really going on.
I am sad to say I think we’re going to lose this thing. Unless some spectacular successes happen in the next two months, and then they might never be reported, when Gen David Petraeus makes his report come September more people we’ve relied on to keep their chin up will drop it and want out.
The NATO force in Afghanistan is a historic first and it belies the falsehood that we are on the outs with all of our allies. Those who didn’t join in Iraq have gracefully and bravely taken up the Afghan cause.
Alot of this may be moot after tomorrow. That is the 9th of Av which is said to be when the Arabs will come after Israel (again). Historically this is the day the First and Second Temples were destroyed 656 years apart. If this unfolds, maybe Paris, Britni, Posh and dog lover Vick will take back seats in the DBM for awhile.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tisha_B’Av
Good morning all! Many thanks to AB for this thread, which continues to be WAY better than the Sunday talk shows. Congratulations to last week’s winners, and to all the informed posts on this thread. I—and probably most FReepers—would much rather read the ongoing debates between MNJohnie and Kabar than watch a phony “debate” between ‘rat Harry Reid and “Republican” Olympia Snowe.
That said, I have incredible problems, trying to understand this “war weariness” phenomenon. It’s everywhere. Even, as AB states, in Alabama. I see NO civilian sacrifices, low casualty rates, full employment, a 14,000 Dow, a soaring ecomomy, etc. etc. But “critics” are “tired of this war.” Until you remind ‘em of the points that AB does such a good job of stating.
The ‘rat’s Congressional approval rating in lower than NIXON’S—on the day he left office (thanks, Anita, for the link to the blogger who pointed this out). As pointed out on this thread week after week, the ‘rats sound just like the terrorists defense lawyers. The ‘rats criticize everything the Bush Administration does—or they simply don’t report the good stuff, like the truth about tax cuts, rising revenue flows, a fantastic economy, etc. Americans don’t like being told (by the ‘rats and the MSM/LSM/DBM) that good things for America are “really” bad things, because they aren’t good for the ‘rats. A 14% Congressional ‘rat approval rating? The MSM/LSM/DBM will probably ignore this, too, like the do all positive economic news.
I disagree. I see groups like this forming.
Vets for Freedom
http://www.vetsforfreedom.org/
I hear the Talk Radio hosts FINALLY getting off the bench on Iraq.
The vote totals in Congress are moving against the Democrat Leadership.
The 1st bill they managed to pass but could not over ride a Presidential veto. Now they cannot even get the votes for cloture and lost votes in the US House.
You are seeing more and more positive coverage leaking thur the DNC directed media’s censorship. You are even starting to see Repulican Congress critters, like Kit Bond today, get off their butt.
Pretty soon the Democrats are going to have to get off the pot and actually try to pull funding. When they do that they will lose all the “moderate” votes.
Time is on our side, not theirs. It always is. The more information that gets out there, the worse it is for the DC Propagandists message.
From Hillary Care, to Immigration to Iraq, the Elites can only win when they can move quick. The longer the debate drags out, the worse the DC Noise machine does.
I think the problem is most of your peer group are Vietnam Era vets. So they tend to run everything thru the “Lessons of Vietnam” rule book.
Get the American people behind you.
Win quick.
Don’t take many casualties.
Get the heck out.
Only problem is this rule book is written for a completely different sort of war. Vietnam and Iraq are not at all compariable. Here is why.
Vietnam did not start out with a 09-11 style attack on the US homeland.
There is no Watergate scandal to cripple the Administration.
The PC Media does not control the flow of information to nearly the extent they did in 1974. Both Talk Radio and the Internet provide just as many people with their information as Big Media.
The Talk Radio hosts are FINALLY starting to get into this fight.
The activist base on the Right is much larger, better organized and more activist then Nixon’s “silent majority”.
The Anti American movement on the Left is much smaller, more wacko and not being funded and actively aided by our enemies like their were during the late 1960s-early 1970s.
Iraq is not Vietnam Redux.
Vietnam was a Cold War proxy war bettween the conventionally armed Superpower proxies that the American people could not understand why we were fighting. It was fought with a draftee army thus giving an overwhelming personal “cause” for the petulent brats of the “anti War” movement.
Iraq is not a proxy war. It is a war against a clearly deadly foe. It is being fought with a volunteer military. And despite some patetic PR performances by those on our side, that message is out there and being communicated.
Forget the polling data. You can structure a poll to get almost any result you want. The fact is the Democrats did not even dare run against Iraq in 2006. They did everything to avoid having to clearly state a position.
Then they went to DC and got seduced by the rabid “Anti War” crowd that controls the US PC Media into beliving the 2006 results were all about Iraq. NO they were not.
And the proof is in the pudding. For 6 months, the Democrats have done NOTHING but grandstand on Iraq. NOW the ONLY support they have is the same rabid Leftist 10-15% that even after 09-11 did NOT support the President or the US in any poll.
No sir, time is on OUR side, not theirs.
I sure hope so Johnnie.
Thanks for that. I am discouraged today, not because I believe the cause is wrong, but from my eyes, so many seem to be falling away.
But I’ll go on hoping!
Question for the FReepers on this thread:
What do you think?
Are folks getting War Weary? Are they ready to throw in the towel?
Are the dems blowing their wad on the antiwar minority?
Are we going to win in Iraq?
Are we going to pull out of Iraq?
What is the future of this war on terrorists? (har, and buy me a winning lottery ticket!)
"They (Rats) think of this WOT as Bush's war, not America's war-RichardMiniter, respected OBL author"
As the tide turns Americans/Republicans will get back on board. There is not one war in our histoir that we did not become war weary.
Pray for W and Our Troops
Winning in Iraq.
Even rabid whiners like Savage and Ingraham cannot stomach the Democrats Cut and Run dogma.
You are confusing real supporters of the war with the DC Old Boy like like Warner, Alexander etc who were never really on our side. They had to be dragged kicking and screaming to do something after 09-11, and merely found the quickest way to get back to their per 09-11 Neo Isolationists (aka “Realist”) world view. Why do you thing the Republican Old Boys in the Senate pushed so hard for the ISG to be formed? Because they knew with the right people on it it would give them the political coverage they needed to surrender on Iraq
The “Falling away” in DC is the posturing of politicians who merely found it convent to ditch a position they never really wanted to have to embrace in the 1st place.
That one of the interesting things. The old boys in the Establishment, on both sides (i.e. the Appeasement Now Left and the Isolationist Right) have a lot more in common with each other then they do with the American people.
For them 09-11 was just a chance thing that now that they have passed some laws and spent some money they don’t ever have to worry about. To the DC Machine 09-11 is no reason for them to give up the political dogmas they have spent their whole lives defending.
Like most people living in a bubble world, the DC Political-media machine simply tunes out all uncomfortable facts to cling to their comfortable self satisfied existence.
Not even a catastrophic event like 09-11 can really get the DC Dinosaurs to fundamentally alter their world view and their pat political dogmas. They can be forced for a time by an overwhelming response by the America people to pretend to change but in the end they always revert to form.
That is one of the reasons Term Limits makes so much sense. By about the 3 or 4th term they have become so isolated by their staffs, and the DD Media machine, from reality they simply stop being the people’s Representatives.
However, I meant falling away by locals, not DC politicians. I can tell you I am one of the few in my town who fully support our war in Iraq, for the reasons you so masterfully laid out on your Homepage, among other things.
My discouragement stems from this nosedive of public support I’ve been witnessing. At my church this morning, many agreed with the deacon’s prayer for the “safe and immediate return of out boys fighting in Iraq”. I told him outside, after services, that I’m for their return as soon as they’ve won. Many (who agreed with me before) stopped to argue with me then. I brought up all the points I mentioned in post # 56, which mostly shut them up, but I’m saddened I had to do so with some of them.
MUST SEE video of Sec.Def. Gates speaking at the Marine Corps Association dinner this week .. he breaks down, very emotionally describing the heroism and gallantry of Capt. Doug Zembiec (promoted to Major posthumously), the Lion of Fallujah. It’s very moving.
http://video.yahoo.com/video/play?vid=1116938120&fr=yfp-t-501
His whole speech is on the left just under the Pentagon Channel logo ... it’s VERY worthwhile to hear his inside the beltway/political slamming, and most especially: his assessment of the scope and nature of this WOT.
The written version is here:
http://www.military.com/NewsContent/0,13319,143017,00.html
Rest in peace, brave warrior. God bless and protect our awesome troops!
~~~~~
“Killing is not wrong if it’s for a purpose, if it’s to keep your nation free or to protect your buddy.”
Maj. Doug Zembiec, The Lion of Fallujah
Well I am sorry to hear that Alas. Thank you for standing with our guys in Iraq and Afganistan despite the peer pressure at your church.
Question I have for you. HOW many of these people are likely to change who they vote for in 2008 over Iraq?
A - Yes, and yes if you listen to the polls. However, anecdotal evidence from my perspective (at work) indicates more and more people are more and more “vocal” about leaving Iraq.
Q - Are the dems blowing their wad on the antiwar minority?
A - I don’t know about that, but Harry Reid is taking positions and that seem to dovetail quite nicely with positions espoused by the anti-war coalition. Pelosi has always been cut from the antiwar cloth. What you DON’T
hear is the other side, at least from the DBM. They need to report news that shows the war in Iraq in an unfavorable light - that is what many citizens read and hear.
Q - Are we going to win in Iraq?
A - It depends how you define “win”. I define win as:
1) an Iraq that is not partitioned and can defend itself against an external aggressor;
2) has a stable government that can make decisions of a strategic nature and support/protect a sustainable national economy;
3) has a workable form of democracy that can be used as a springboard for Iranian dissenters;
4) allows the US to maintain a military presence in Iraq.
and this will take some time (~5 years) to complete. Do I think the U.S. can do that? Yes, but the national will of our elected leadership in Congress appears to be lacking - including several Republicans.
Q - Are we going to pull out of Iraq?
A - If a Democrat is elected President - absolutely. Within 1-2 years, I would expect all but a small number of military and civilian personnel to be pulled from Iraq. If a Republican is elected President - we will stay - but there need to be some solid conservative gains in the Senate as well.
Q - What is the future of this war on terrorists? (har, and buy me a winning lottery ticket!)
A - A concern. Programs (e.g. TSP, etc) that are used to detect and deter terrorism seem to be at the mercy of disclosure via the DBM and also angry government employees (e.g. Department of State, CIA, etc). Career employees who stay regardless of who is President are the machine of these agencies, and they have worked at odds with President Bush and his goals these past six years. Additionaly, the President needs to be more concise and direct in what his goals are in regards to Iraq and terrorism - sometimes I get the impression that his speech or other prepared remarks are too wordsmithed, ostensibly by his staff.
Of course, the real test is - will there be another terrorist attack in the U.S? All that has been done that we know and do not know about - will be measured against that event either occurring or not occurring.
I feel in Britain a lot of people are not really connected with the war at all, it is rarely spoke about apart from pundits on TV the everyday people I come in contact with rarely mention it.
When they do they feel somewhat anger towards Iraq and feel that the Iraqis have not stepped up to the plate as they should have. Whether this is the case or whether it is bias reporting but to an extent I can understand this point of view.
I do not think win is the right approach this war IMHO has been going on in one form or the other since the crusades and I think we are naive to think we are going to win but what I hope for and I am sure this is what is meant by the administration by winning that the WOT will move on to another venue which is a form of winning and would be classed as winning.
I think that what may happen certainly in Britain as far as pull out is concerned and I think this could also be the same for the US that in certain places it will be announced that the Iraqis are trained and ready to take over. So I think there will be a sort of pull out and maybe earlier than would have been the case had not the Dems taken congress. I think the fact that the dems took congress has influenced Britain as well especially with Gordon Brown as PM as he will see this as the opportunity to distance himself from the Republican Administration and realign the Labour Party with their natural allies the Democrats.
The WOT on terror will continue in one form or another whatever happens in Iraq it is a war that will IMHO go on until the end of time whatever you believe that will be. And no I do not want start a religious debate on that :o).
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