Snapshot - Smoking Ban Impact on Bars/Bowling Centrs

congress.org ^ | 28 September 2006 | Darnet Dawn

[SheLion]

Following are actual statistics reflecting examples of the negative impact upon individual businesses following the recently instituted smoking ban ordinances, effective in Springfield, Illinois and surrounding unincorporated Sangamon County this September 15, 2006 (less than two weeks ago).

When small businesses account for about two-thirds of our country's economic growth and new jobs, it is difficult to comprehend elected officials' reasoning in voting to implement an intrusive ordinance which will hurt those same business owners.

A restaurant owner who does not permit smoking will see it as a violation of his property rights if a coalition uses the political arena to create legislation forcing him to permit smoking. It is no less a property rights violation in reverse. If a restaurant owner wishes to permit smoking, he might put up a “Smoking Permitted” sign and let potential patrons decide whether they wish to enter. Similarly, if an owner doesn’t permit smoking, he might put up a “No Smoking” sign and again let the customers decide.

SNAPSHOT OF SMOKING BAN IMPACT ON BARS & BOWLING CENTERS IN SPRINGFIELD AND UNINCORPORATED SANGAMON COUNTY:

D.H. Browns—business down more than 50%

- The last time Brown’s had a Monday as low as the first Monday of the ban was 8 years ago during a snowstorm.

- Brown’s will likely have to lay off their doormen—on top of the lost employment, this will increase the chances of underage drinkers violating the law.

- Two (2) waitresses informed management that they will have to give their notice and try to get a job in one of the neighboring communities that permit smoking because they are no longer making any money.

Track Shack—business down 42%

- For the first time, the owner had to draw money out of his personal funds to pay Track Shack’s bills.

American Legion Post # 32—business down more than 50%

Floyd’s—business down, but not substantially

JW’s Lounge—business down over 40%

Stadium—business down 40%

- 10 people in bar, 43 in Beer Garden on Wednesday night, numbers similar on the other nights.

Cheers—business down more than 50%

- $400 to $500 previous average daily sales—haven’t had one night over $200 since the ban went into effect.

Bernie & Betty’s—business down 40%

Knuckleheads—business down 40%

Mac’s Lounge—business down more than 25%

- Customers who were regulars prior to the ban have been calling Mac’s to tell them what a great time they were having at the Curve Inn in Southern View where smoking is permitted.

Sammy’s—business down, but not substantially

VFW Northender—business down, but percentage is unknown

- Waitress made a total of $14 in tips during her shift on Monday, and $17 on Tuesday—substantially lower than past experience.

Spillway Lanes—bar business is down more than 25%

- Lost 10 bowling teams since ban, gained only 1.

Black Dog Saloon, Winner’s Circle & Teasers had to close over 2 hours early this week due to lack of customers
 
______________________________
Garnet Dawn - The Smoker's Club, Inc. - Midwest Regional Director
The United Pro Choice Smokers Rights Newsletter - http://www.smokersclubinc.com
Illinois Smokers Rights - Illinois Smokers Forum - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/illinoissmokers/

[supercat]

The same old property rights squeal from people who like to pollute other people's air, stink up other people's hair and clothing, and then throw their butts and ashes on other people's property (most of them anyway).

If I want to run a bar where people can smoke, just whose property rights are the smokers supposedly not respecting? I decided I'd rather put up with the smoke than have them take their business elsewhere. Most of my employees probably smoke, but any that don't have decided they'd rather put up with the smoke than seem employment elsewhere. About half my customers smoke, and those that don't have decided they'd rather put up with the smoke than go somewhere else.

So exactly whose property rights are being infringed?

Note: I don't smoke, personally, and don't particularly like smoke. But I find the stench of nanny-statism to be far more offensive.

[SheLion]

Well they're screwed. People that don't smoke don't normally hang out in bars. I know around here folks just started having house parties. Everyone BYOB and BYOC.

Can't tell a man that he can't smoke a legal product in his own home. At least not yet.

That's what we have been doing here in Maine.  Going to each other's homes to party.  And we are quite comfortable.  Doesn't feel like a reform school setting.  Plus, we say money.

[supercat]

No one said you can't go there, you just can't smoke there.

People spend money in bars, restaurants, etc. with the intention of having a good time. When the smoke gnatsies interfere with a person's enjoyment of a bar, restaurant, etc. why should the person spend money if he's not going to enjoy himself?

[SheLion]

The same old property rights squeal from people who like to pollute other people's air, stink up other people's hair and clothing, and then throw their butts and ashes on other people's property (most of them anyway).

Gosh!  You must be SO proud to be a Republican!!!!!!!!!! 

[blondee123]

Soon most bars will be forced to close. If only the 1920's prohibitionists could have been as smart. They didn't need to outlaw booze in bars, all they needed to do was outlaw smoking.

No, no way will they ever ban alcohol, what would old Teddy do without his booze! Of course, he'd say his drinking isn't hurting anyone, like our smoking is.

Of course, maybe if he hadn't been drinking all those years ago, he wouldn't have gone off the bridge, but he didn't get hurt, so it's OK!

[SheLion]

I'm a non-smoker. I don't like to be covered in that smell. So I dont go places that allow smoking. It's someone's PRIVATE business. Not the governments' and not some anti-smoking socio-nazi.

There you go.  When non-smokers don't want to be around cigarette smoke, they choose to go to another place.  No one is holding a gun to their heads, right?

I know smoking isn't for everyone, but there are quite a few of us that love it.  And we are FREEPERS!

In fact, the Freeper cruise they had not to long ago was a smoking cruise.  I sure wish I could have gone!!!

[SheLion]

But to listen to you guys I thought smokers were the champions of small business owners...No one said you can't go there, you just can't smoke there.

Hey business owner, selfish crybaby smokers are not your friends.

AND ANOTHER ANTI-SMOKER FREEPER HEARD FROM!

[SheLion]

Note: I don't smoke, personally, and don't particularly like smoke. But I find the stench of nanny-statism to be far more offensive.

[SheLion]

No, no way will they ever ban alcohol, what would old Teddy do without his booze! Of course, he'd say his drinking isn't hurting anyone, like our smoking is.

Of course, maybe if he hadn't been drinking all those years ago, he wouldn't have gone off the bridge, but he didn't get hurt, so it's OK!

LOL! Gawd, I can't STAND that idiot!!!

   

[SheLion]

Oh brother

US fast-food chains sued over carcinogenic chicken
Yahoo! ^ | Sep 28, 2006 | Associated Press

Posted on 09/29/2006 12:53:21 AM EDT by bamahead

WASHINGTON (AFP) - A US doctors' group has sued seven leading fast-food chains including McDonald's and Burger King over their use of a "dangerous carcinogenic" in grilled chicken.

The Washington-based Physicians Committee for Responsible Medicine (PCRM) filed suit in California Thursday "to compel the restaurants to warn unsuspecting consumers".

The group said every sample of grilled chicken products from the seven national chains "tested positive for a dangerous carcinogenic compound called PhIP" during analysis at an independent laboratory.

PhIP is one of a group of carcinogenic compounds called heterocyclic amines (HCAs) that are found in grilled meat. In 2005, the US government officially added HCAs to its list of cancer-causing agents, the doctors' group said.

"Grilled chicken can cause cancer, and consumers deserve to know that this supposedly healthy product is actually just as bad for them as high-fat fried chicken," PCRM president Neal Barnard said in a statement.

[freekitty]

"Everything is going exactly as planned. Soon most bars will be forced to close. If only the 1920's prohibitionists could have been as smart. They didn't need to outlaw booze in bars, all they needed to do was outlaw smoking."

I was wondering the same thing, Isn't this just like prohibition?

[freekitty]

Yeah, where's he going to find a bar?

[383rr]

"You'll still be able to take them to gay bars though as long as smoking is not allowed."

Good point. Hey, anything goes, as long as there isn't a wisp of killer smoke around, I guess.

[383rr]

The pool of wisdom grows ever deeper.......

How do you do it?

[383rr]

"It must suck to be a smoker."

Nah. It would suck harder to suck like you do.

[thile44]

"Can't tell a man that he can't smoke a legal product in his own home. At least not yet."
Coming soon to a neighborhood near you.

[Raycpa]

Just like my research proved on another thread Shelion used as an aexample of businesses that went belly up, most of these bars will open under new management who understands how to make a profit off of nonsmokers. When you builed your business on smoking drunks, its tough to attract nonsmokers looking for quality.

Smokers are easy to serve, just give them an ashtray. Nonsmokers demand and get more from their bars and restaurants.

[383rr]

Wow. You could teach Donald Trump a thing or two about business, it seems.

[383rr]

"Nonsmokers demand and get more from their bars and restaurants"


Uh, Ok, yeah, whatever.

I guess new curtains would be in order.

[Kharis13]

Hi Fairview,

I think you raise a valid point. Smokers don't have to "throw the baby out with the bath water".

On a side note, this summer a local bowling alley was offering kids 17 and under one free game every day, for 100 days, shoes included! I took my daughters, ages 14 and 10, bowling there everyday and we had a hoot. While I can't stand government sticking its nose in where it doesn't belong, I can honestly say I would've never taken my kids there while it was filled with smoke.

Just my .02

Brian