[PatrickHenry]

Dan Hooker, obviously a patriot, was honest enough to declare the faith-based nature of his proposed legislation. I think it's a first.

Everyone be nice.

[PatrickHenry]

Evolution Ping The List-O-Links

A conservative, pro-evolution science list, now with over 380 names. See the list's explanation, then FReepmail to be added or dropped. To assist beginners: But it's "just a theory", Evo-Troll's Toolkit, and How to argue against a scientific theory.

[Jeff Gordon]

The Creationism mutation known as Intelligent Design is quite weak. The Science anti-virus is defeating it on a massive scale.

[samtheman]

I have a problem with legislation that would mandate:

instruction would include information about "intelligent design and information effectively challenging the theory of evolution."

It's wrong to say that there's any science today that is "effectively challenging the theory of evolution"; it's important for the public schools to go with the scientific concensus on things like a sun-centered solar system and the fossil/DNA records of evolution.

However, I'm not against legislation allowing a discussion of the critics of evolution, even in science class. Too many people misunderstand what evolution is, how it works, and what evolutionary science is, and how that works (they say things like "it can't be falsified, therefore it's not real science").

It's important, in my opinion, in order to promote the understanding of evolution, to allow the debate about evolution (no matter how un-scientific on the other side) to proceed in public schools, even in science class. As long as the motives for allowing the debate are plainly stated: we're showing you these unscientific critiques, kiddies, so that you can contrast them with how science actually works.

[samtheman]

And you're right. Dan Hooker is obviously a patriot. I'd rather have Dan Hooker in the legislature than some leftist who happens to agree with me about evolution (and probably doesn't understand it any better than a creationist does, just knows it's a position he's got to take).

[Vaquero]

I couldn't imagine it getting a foothold in NY unless you took out the NYC equation. Then again the Buffalo, Binghamton, Ithaca (city of evil....of course), Syracuse, Albany, Rochester, etc equation would still be in play and I still think even without NYC it would be a non issue. (if I left out your liberal bastion, forgive me...you are lumped in with the etc. contingent)

I truly hate agreeing with liberals on anything. I personally dont consider it a liberal/conservative issue. I consider it a science issue.

Unfortunately folks on both sides of the fence DON'T.

[ml1954]

If enacted, the bill would have required that "all pupils in grades kindergarten through twelve in all public schools in the state ... receive instruction in all aspects of the controversy surrounding evolution and the origins of man."

Kindergarten? He wanted kindergarteners to "receive instruction in all aspects of the controversy surrounding evolution and the origins of man." LOL.

[Blackirish]

Science wins one.

[Alama]

Good for him...

And good the bill died...

[JCEccles]

Stifle debate, suffocate science, all in the name of the liberal state religion.

When will you and the ACLU learn that all such heavy-handed tactics are destined to fail? Legislated "truth" is a brittle and hollow thing. The more you seek to protect it from scrutiny, the more brittle and hollow it becomes.

And your fervor for it makes you all look like petty Stalinists drawing plans for a gulag to warehouse and segregate the enemies of the state where they won't challenge or annoy the "true science" party apparatchiks.

[longshadow]

A later provision specified that such instruction would include information about "intelligent design and information effectively challenging the theory of evolution."

[emphasis added]

A vacuously satisfied condition....

[<1/1,000,000th%]

Jehovah's Witnesses everywhere are saddened.

[freespirited]

This is silly. The early grades (and especially kindergarten) are not an appropriate time for the abstract concepts involved in evolution and ID. The kids will have no idea what the teacher is talking about.

At this age a lot of children don't understand that if you change the shape of something, it still has the same mass and volume. Yet this assemblyman wants to introduce abstract concepts to them like descent with modification and "irreducible compexity" (whatever that might be).

Dumb.

[shuckmaster]

These "designed" idiots never cease to amaze me.

[steve-b]

If enacted, the bill would have required that "all pupils in grades kindergarten through twelve in all public schools in the state ... receive instruction in all aspects of the controversy surrounding evolution and the origins of man."

"The theory of evolution offends some people's religious sensibilities. Since religious opinions are not relevant to scientific inquiry, some people have constructed spurious "scientific" objections. The problems with these arguments are... [insert some of the points hashed out ad nauseam on these thereads]."

There. A nice succinct "instruction in all aspects of the controversy".

[tortoise]

Good. The last thing we need is yet more social engineering in the classroom, be it from the left or the right. And the whole "intelligent design in the classroom" controversy is a social engineering movement no matter how you package it.

This is no different than the people who don't mind activist judges so long as they are "conservative".

[DoctorMichael]

Praise the Lord!

[RightWhale]

all aspects of the controversy surrounding evolution and the origins of man

It is probably beyond the ability of most schoolkids to get all aspects of the controversy. Even the reading list-o-links is more than most have time for.

[DennisR]

"Intelligent design" legislation in New York dies

Not surprising - their two senators are Schumer and Clinton.