Posted on 11/11/2005 9:07:04 AM PST by SirLinksalot
When torture is the only option ...
DAVID GELERNTER
SEN. JOHN MCCAIN's proposed legislation incorporating into U.S. law the Geneva Convention ban on mistreating prisoners. The bill, which bans cruel, inhumane or degrading treatment, passed the Senate 90 to 9. To say it's got momentum is putting it mildly.
But President Bush says he will veto the bill unless the CIA is exempted. Vice President Cheney has led the administration's campaign for the exemption. It's a hard sell; pro-torture politicians are scarce around Washington.
But of course you don't have to be "pro-torture" to oppose the McCain amendment. That naive misunderstanding summarizes the threat posed by this good-hearted, wrong-headed legislation. Those who oppose the amendment don't think the CIA should be permitted to use torture or other rough interrogation techniques. What they think is that sometimes the CIA should be required to squeeze the truth out of prisoners. Not because the CIA wants to torture people, but because it may be the only option we've got.
McCain's amendment is a trap for the lazy minded. Whenever a position seems so obvious that you don't even have to stop and think — stop and think.
SNIP
Michael Levin published an article challenging the popular view that the U.S. must never engage in torture. "Someday soon," he concluded, "a terrorist will threaten tens of thousands of lives, and torture will be the only way to save them."
Suppose a nuclear bomb is primed to detonate somewhere in Manhattan, Levin wrote, and we've captured a terrorist who knows where the bomb is. He won't talk. By forbidding torture, you inflict death on many thousands of innocents and endless suffering on the families of those who died at a terrorist's whim — and who might have lived had government done its ugly duty.
(Excerpt) Read more at latimes.com ...
Pray for W and Our Troops
The "tools" of torture.
I'm not "worried", I'm absolutely furious that our government has sunk to the levels of Stalin, Gorbachev, Mao and Saddam.
Pray for W and Our Freedom Fighters
Pray for W and Our Freedom Fighters
Since they insist on doing their deeds in secret prisons we never will know exactly what is being done. That's the whole point of using secret prisons so there is no accountability, just more of the "trust me" crap. I damned sure don't trust them at all anymore.
Iraq has never been a Communist country, it was a dictatorship. Get your facts straight.
Pray for W and Our Troops
Very well put. I have heard the criticisms that the Pres. "shouldn't have made it political" on Veteran's Day and I don't agree. You said it as well as it could be said. The Dem's made this political and what they have is all distortions and lies. If I had my way these traitors would be tortured before they were killed. Just as an object lesson.
Which means that you don't have the slightest idea what is or isn't being done there. All of your Chicken Little ranting is just so much uninformed hot air.
Once again, TigersEye....I have to agree with you...
IF these secret prisons have been SECRET all of this time...we have no idea how anyone has been treated...
and for posters to say they are sick of what our country "has done" is being purposely misleading and without merit.
Pray for W and Our Freedom Fighters
And people are purposely misleading because they have an agenda that can't stand the light of day. Nothing wrong with an agenda per se but one that has to be hidden and automatically presumes the worst of our country is bogus.
Training. They did they very little least they could to give you an idea of what torture was going to be like. More than likely, you are going to get your nose broken, and maybe a rib. If they are serious, you are going to give up what you know.
The REALITY of the situation is that if you are captured, and you are American, its a pretty sure bet you are going to be tortured for information, especially if you are an officer.
All this horse hockey about us renouncing torture is just the media trying to tie another hand behind our back.
I'll say this: If the President doesn't decide to really take the gloves off and go after the moderates in Congress and the media over the war, we are going to lose it as surely as we are sitting here.
That has nothing to do with our current discussion. Are you on the correct thread?
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