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To: CHARLITE

Kelly repeated shows she does not know her Bible very well.

(Gen 1:1 KJV) In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

(Gen 1:2 KJV) And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

water came before anything, or at least, was the only visible form of any matter.

For her to state that God used light to form matter, she is ignorant of the very first 2 verses of the Bible and their implications to Creation.


11 posted on 06/18/2005 7:23:06 PM PDT by RaceBannon ((Prov 28:1 KJV) The wicked flee when no man pursueth: but the righteous are bold as a lion.)
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To: RaceBannon
And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

Notice it says "waters" not "water". The latest theory is that all those subatomic particles, before being transformed into nuclei... exhibited the physical properties of liquids... therefore they could be the waters that Gen. refers to. First came the subatomic particles in the form of waters, next came light... Just as described!

32 posted on 06/18/2005 8:07:50 PM PDT by Former Fetus (fetuses are 100% pro-life, they just don't vote yet!)
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To: RaceBannon

Here is an interesting analysis of the beginning passages of Genesis":http://www.hope-of-israel.org/solars.htm

"In the pages of the Bible, we read in the opening words of the book of Genesis: "And God created the heavens and the earth. And the earth was [the Hebrew word can just as easily be translated "became"] without form and void" (Gen.1:1-2). This word usually translated "was" as it is in this verse in the King James Version, is translated "became" in Genesis 19:26 regarding Lot's wife: "and she became a pillar of salt."

The words translated "without form and void" are from the Hebrew tohu va vohu, and mean, "empty, chaotic, confused." The word tohu is #8414 in Strong's Exhaustive Concordance, and is defined as "be waste, a desolation (of surface), i.e., a desert," figuratively "a worthless thing," "in vain, confusion, empty place, waste, wilderness." The word vohu is #922 and means "to be empty, a vacuity, an undistinguishable ruin."

But did YEHOVAH God create the Earth originally in such a condition? Or did it become that way due to some ancient cosmic event, which could have included a collision with another celestial body, such as a massive planet with an elongated orbit, such as that of a comet?

In the book of Isaiah, we read:

"For thus saith the LORD that created the heavens; God himself that formed the earth and made it; he hath established it, he created it not in vain, he formed it to be inhabited: I am the LORD; and there is none else" (Isaiah 45:18).

In this verse we see that YEHOVAH God did NOT create the Earth "in vain." The Hebrew word here, also, is tohu, and means -- as above -- "a waste, desolation, desert, a worthless thing, empty place," etc. So we see that originally YEHOVAH God did NOT create the Earth in a condition of tohu! Therefore, the logical explanation is that somehow, in the process of time, at some point after it was originally created, the Earth BECAME tohu -- a vain, empty, wasted desolation and ruin!

The logical question is -- what happened?"

I tend to believe that when one tries to determine what God didn't do by what he did do one often ends up forcing God into a very small box. Just because someone tells you they went to the movies does not mean they didn't stop off to get gas on the way. Many Christians seem to fall into the trap of limiting themselves and God by immediately rejecting anything that isn't KJV. I personally believe that there is some evidence that suggests that life is an expression of a deep order in the universe. God's signature so to speak. Many scientists would reject this outright but the fact is clear that the universe is a highly ordered place and from that we can either say that order is just a byproduct of the way things are with indifference much like crystals forming out of a solution and conscious thought is just a mirage that fools us into believing we are more than just complex lumps of matter that just happenned to develop the novelty of being able to understand the basic physics of the universe and our own biological foundation built in DNA. Humanity out of all the creatures on this planet has the ability to imagine and on intuition postulate ideas that it has no direct way of observing. Many of the great leaps in Science were great leaps of intuition based upon the smallest bits of evidence. Whether we are talking the movement of the planets, the existence of atoms, or the increasingly abstract world of high energy physics and quantum reality all began with flights of intuition. Not that mankind has not been wrong, but even the idea that a creature would come to believe in "God" and the idea of an afterlife is so highly abnormal and unique when all of the daily life of humanity especially primitive humanity would've suggested otherwise. One could say that because humanity has such a creative capacity that our memories of our loved ones are the "real" ghosts and that our ancestors were deceived by themselves and their grief but even that requires some deeper analysis because grief is not logical. Why would one develop such a trait and what benefit to one is it? Of course the use of "Why?" in a world without a God is really without much use because without God no matter how far we go in our exploration of our universe the answer we will utimately find to everything is "That is just the way it is". The wanting to go on is what fuels the drive in humanity, and fuels us to care about future generations because we can imagine them, do apes think of their grand children's grandchildren? We do and that sets us apart, why out of all the animals on this small planet are we set apart? Maybe "its just the way it is" is an adequate answer or maybe its because we are more and we do go on beyond the sunset.


57 posted on 06/18/2005 10:33:09 PM PDT by Maelstorm
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