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DeLay Raises Possibility of Trying to Impeach Some Judges in Schiavo Case
AP ^ | 3/31/05 | Jesse J. Holland

Posted on 03/31/2005 3:11:22 PM PST by Crackingham

House Majority Leader Tom DeLay on Thursday blamed Terri Schiavo's death on what he contended was a failed legal system and he raised the possibility of trying to impeach some of the federal judges in the case. "The time will come for the men responsible for this to answer for their behavior," said DeLay, R-Texas.

But a leading Democratic senator said DeLay's comments were "irresponsible and reprehensible." Sen. Edward Kennedy, D-Mass., said DeLay should make sure that people know he is not advocating violence against judges.

DeLay, the second-ranking House GOP lawmaker, helped lead congressional efforts 10 days ago to enact legislation designed to prod the federal courts into ordering the reinsertion of Schiavo's feeding tube. He said the courts' refusal to do just that was a "perfect example of an out of control judiciary."

Asked about the possibility of the House's bringing impeachment charges against judges in the Schiavo case, DeLay said, "There's plenty of time to look into that."

President Bush expressed sympathy to Schiavo's parents.

"I urge all those who honor Terri Schiavo to continue to work to build a culture of life where all Americans are welcomed and valued and protected, especially those who live at the mercy of others," he said.

White House spokesman Scott McClellan refused to join DeLay in criticizing the courts. "We would have preferred a different decision from the courts ... but ultimately we have to follow our laws and abide by the courts," McClellan said.

Joining DeLay in taking issue with the judiciary was Sen. Rick Santorum, R-Pa., who said, "The actions on the part of the Florida court and the U.S. Supreme Court are unconscionable." Also, GOP Rep. Patrick McHenry of North Carolina said the case "saw a state judge completely ignore a congressional committees subpoena and insult its intent" and "a federal court not only reject, but deride the very law that Congress passed."

DeLay said he would make sure that the GOP-controlled House "will look at an arrogant and out of control judiciary that thumbs its nose at Congress and the president."


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; Front Page News; Government; News/Current Events; Philosophy
KEYWORDS: allterriallthetime; anotherterrithread; delay; delaypulledtheplug; goodmoreterrithread; terri; terrisciavo; ushouse; yeskeepthemcoming
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To: sinkspur

It appears that the grant of de novo review might be close to a slam dunk as being held unconstitutional based on reading Birch's opinion on the 11th circuit. I don't know enough to have my own opinion, but in the face of that, the impeachment thing is going nowhere. Well, it was going nowhere anyway. Delay is just throwing red meat at the wolves. The ethics charges against Delay appear to be serious based on my reading of a WSJ editorial blasting Delay on the matter. I suspect he is going the way of Newt, and in the not too distant future. Thank heavens he is not Speaker, or he really would reap substantial dividends for the Dems.


281 posted on 03/31/2005 7:07:46 PM PST by Torie
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To: TheHound

Yes, it is.


282 posted on 03/31/2005 7:08:26 PM PST by RecallMoran (The left would RATHER lie)
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To: Ghost of Philip Marlowe
We're going to need to be patient. Many of us feel deep rage and sorrow at what has transpired over the last two weeks. A key for us - the electorate - is to excercies self control and not become like the kooks at MoveOn.org.

Your senators are my senators and will probably be nay-voting deadweight, but we can encourage others, and (depending on how close to the city we live) our reps.

283 posted on 03/31/2005 7:19:25 PM PST by Lexinom (You can easily judge the character of a man by how he treats those who can do nothing for him.)
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To: Torie

The impeachment issue is an idle threat, and doesn't address the real problem anyway. The problem with the judiciary is far deeper than one or two or twelve or twenty judges. Until this specific case, there was not much interest in doing something about it. There still might not be much interest. See post 271. The reason Congress should assert itself has to do with the judiciary's decision to tell COngress to pound sand on the de novo hearing requirement but also on the subpeona. Judge Greer and federal judges (including Birch) told Congress that the legislative branch has no powers other than what the judicial branch grants it. THat position is a natural outgrowth of the last thirty years of judicial activism.

The ethics charges against DeLay are a red herring and merely personalizes the issue. Whether DeLay is in Congress or not does not change the nature of the problem between the legislative and judicial branches.


284 posted on 03/31/2005 7:25:52 PM PST by RecallMoran (The left would RATHER lie)
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To: Cboldt
"Sorry for being short with you. This case bothers me deeply."

Appology accepted.

This case has really brought to the forefront to me that the medical profession really does kill patients before their bodies and brains are ready to go. I suspected it with my mother, my stepfather, and my stepmother.

Everybody says this just shows the importance of having directives. The only problem with directives is if you write you want no life support what if you just had pneumonia (still young age) where you were not able to breath. In that situation a lung machine would keep you alive long enough to get over the pneumonia. If you had said no artificial help then they would let you die.

My parents all had directives. This made it simple for the medical profession to start the process. All of them at the end didn't really want to die.

Speaking of process. Did you hear Felos today in his grandios appearance in front of the media, say that the hospice nurses came to him and Michael and said; "You need to come now as we are ready to start the final process?"

285 posted on 03/31/2005 7:32:41 PM PST by Spunky ("Everyone has a freedom of choice, but not of consequences.")
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To: RecallMoran
judiciary's decision to tell COngress to pound sand on the de novo hearing requirement

That is not what happened. Congress did not purport to change the rules of federal court procedure, and if they had, the law would never have made it out of the Senate. The Whittemore case acceped de novo jurisdiction, at least for the moment, and then applied the unchanged law and rules to consider an injunction motion. You may not like it, but that was and remains the law. I suspect in time the law would have been deemed unconstitutional, but that was not in play here, and will not be, because the case is now moot.

286 posted on 03/31/2005 7:36:48 PM PST by Torie
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To: sinkspur
According to Congressman Steve King

However, the judge ruled against her case with only a few hours of consideration and without hearing the necessary evidence.

287 posted on 03/31/2005 7:37:15 PM PST by Mind-numbed Robot (Not all things that need to be done need to be done by the government.)
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To: AlbionGirl

Tell me where I can sign up.


288 posted on 03/31/2005 7:37:42 PM PST by Pelham
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To: Torie
but in the face of that, the impeachment thing is going nowhere

The legislature can impeach for any reason it jolly well pleases. They have no dog on the courts' side of the fight.

289 posted on 03/31/2005 7:38:10 PM PST by The Red Zone (Go to Florida, the sun-shame state, to be schiavoed, to greer someone, and to felos a patient.)
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To: Mind-numbed Robot
However, the judge ruled against her case with only a few hours of consideration and without hearing the necessary evidence.

The judge can only deal with what's presented to him.

Blame lawyer Gibbs for being clueless in a federal court.

290 posted on 03/31/2005 7:39:05 PM PST by sinkspur (I'm in the WPPFF)
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To: The Red Zone

Yes, it can, but it won't, nor should it.


291 posted on 03/31/2005 7:39:48 PM PST by Torie
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To: Crackingham
Any move by Congress to tell the Courts how to conduct in-court procedures is a direct violation of the Constitution.

That doesn't seem to be a twoway street. The courts often tell the legislature what to do. In Mass. they ordered the legislature to pass a law allowing same sex marriage. Is that kosher?

292 posted on 03/31/2005 7:40:11 PM PST by Mind-numbed Robot (Not all things that need to be done need to be done by the government.)
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To: Spunky; Cboldt
Among other things, Spunky told Cboldt:
1) "According to my dictionary SHALL is the same as SHOULD, meaning 'OUGHT to'";

2) "The Congress did not say 'You will' or 'You must'"; and,

3) "The wording of 'Shall' gave them permission to do so.

Don't know what dictionary you're using, Spunky; but here's the legal definition of "shall"--from Black's Law Dictionary:
Shall. As used in statutes, contracts, or the like, this word is generally imperative or mandatory. [emphasis added] In common or ordinary parlance, and in its ordinary signification, the term "shall" is a word of command, and one which has always or which must be given a compulsory meaning, as denoting obligation. [emphasis added] It has a peremptory meaning, and it is generally imperative or mandatory. It has the invariable significance of excluding the idea of discretion, and has the significance of operating to impose a duty which mnay be enforced, particularly if public policy is in favor of this meaning, or when addressed to public officials, or where a public interest is involved, or where the public or persons have rights which ought to be exercised or enforced, unless a contrary intent appears. People v. O'Rourke, 124 Cal.App. 752, 13 P.2d 989, 992.

But [emphasis added] it may be construed as merely permissive or directory (as equivalent to "may"), to carry out the legislative intention and in cases where no right or benefit to any one depends on its being taken in the imperative sense, and where no public or private right is impaired by its interpretation in the other sense. Wisdom v. Board of Sup'rs of Polk County, 236 Iowa 669, 19 N.W.2d 602, 607, 608.

After reading all of that definition, doesn't it become much less difficult to why it all depends on what the legal definition of "Is." is?
293 posted on 03/31/2005 7:41:32 PM PST by Longwalled Newbie
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To: Crackingham
"we have to follow our laws and abide by the courts"

Pick one. You can't have both. The courts pay no attention to our laws. If you abide by whatever they say despite the blatant fact that they ignore our laws, then we have no laws. Only rulers. And if they want to be our rulers without law, we have no reason whatever to abide by anything they say.

294 posted on 03/31/2005 7:44:55 PM PST by JasonC
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To: Torie

Who's the only one to give the shoulds but the legislature itself?


295 posted on 03/31/2005 7:45:10 PM PST by The Red Zone (Go to Florida, the sun-shame state, to be schiavoed, to greer someone, and to felos a patient.)
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To: Fitzcarraldo

"Two words: DO IT"



My bet is they won't.


296 posted on 03/31/2005 7:49:34 PM PST by kalee
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To: The Red Zone

Nobody.


297 posted on 03/31/2005 7:49:46 PM PST by Torie
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To: Poohbah
After getting the Republicans to put the nuclear option and Social Security reform on permanent hold to meet their demands,...

Perhaps you don't recall, but this happened over a long Easter weekend when they weren't considering anything, period. They were called back for this, they weren't interrupted in anything but their vacations. Many didn't even come back. Perhaps they were considering the nuclear option and SS reform in their heads. If so, maybe you are right.

298 posted on 03/31/2005 7:50:12 PM PST by Mind-numbed Robot (Not all things that need to be done need to be done by the government.)
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To: wasp69

You know what? I am so sick and tired of being attacked when I make any sort of moderate stand or indicate that I don't totally believe one way or the other. I attempted to go on a liberal group as well and brought up points made here. Attacked as well, but not personally as some people do here. I guess you gotta be one way or the other, and you can't believe your "side" is wrong, or inconsistent, on any issue at any time. This includes moderation or being "in the middle."

Do you have a link so that I can be on a MODERATE newsgroup?


299 posted on 03/31/2005 7:52:52 PM PST by followerofchrist
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To: Longwalled Newbie
Since there's no way to edit a post once it's up there, please note that the last sentence in my previous post should have read:
After reading all of that definition, doesn't it become much less difficult to understand why it all depends on what the legal definition of "Is." is?

300 posted on 03/31/2005 7:55:21 PM PST by Longwalled Newbie
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