Indiana Libertarians fight proposed smoking bans

www.lp.org ^ | 2 20 05

[writer33]

:) Hehehe!

[secretagent]

Are you proposing secession from the US - state, local, or individual? Carrying the "free state" idea another step?

How about starting with dropping out of federally funded programs?

[mugs99]

The trend is already upon us. Big changes are always unexpected and sudden. Partisan politics over judges and SCOTUS decisions will lead to Constitutional Chaos before 2008 rolls around. The cost of big government is going bring the economy to a halt in places like California and New York. People won't be concerned about dope and prostitutes. They'll be fed up with both Democrats and Republicans. All the LP has to do is have a candidate with charisma ready to go...A good old fashioned Barry Goldwater type will win by a landslide.

Only half the people register to vote, and only half of those do vote. There will be a complete change in government when those apolitical types who don't normally vote go to the polls. A good Libertarian candidate will have them in the bag.
Or...So says my crystal ball!
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[MarkL]

Looking forward to a Libertarian in the White House in 2008!

Realisticly, at the rate things are going, a closer date would be 8020!

Mark

[mugs99]

LOL!
Things change. Remember your reply, 2008 isn't that far away and I will enjoy reminding you of that 8020 comment when the Libertarian candidate wins!
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[jackbob]

No, I am not proposing secession, and thereby "carrying the 'free state' idea another step." I do however stand by my party, the Libertarian Party, where in its Platform it recognizes the right of states, local governments, and even individuals to secede from the United States, from states, as well as from local governments. However, I would not support any such recessions, as I see them almost as potentially harmful to the cause of liberty, as is the "free state" strategy.

The limited liberty we now have, will not be advanced, nor even maintained, by any strategy of withdrawl. Attempting to clean out a small corner in a sewer, will only last until the next rain, when the rest of the sewer runs over on it. The challenge Libertarians have is not how to become a majority in any particular jurisdiction. The challenge is how to become a super majority in all jurisdictions. That will only occur by carrying the libertarian message to those who today most likely oppose liberty. They have to be beaten on their own ground.

As far as dropping out of federally funded programs, fine if you can afford it after paying your share into it. Same goes for state and local governments. But we should remember that any share that is not taken, leaves more to be divided by those who want such programs, thereby increasing the political/financial capitol for such programs.

[E.G.C.]

BTTT!!!!!

[MarkL]

Things change. Remember your reply, 2008 isn't that far away and I will enjoy reminding you of that 8020 comment when the Libertarian candidate wins!

For what it's worth, for the last three presidential elections (I think... It goes back to Andre Marou sp?) I voted Libertarian... However, I just couldn't take the chance this time, since MO was a "Swing State." This last time, I voted for President Bush.

Mark

[Capitalism2003]

woot...Go Libertarians. We need you in Kentucky! Our idiot (R) governor is breaking his no new taxes pledge and trying to raise the cigarette tax .80 a pack. I don't smoke but I'm against all big government and these tax hikes that pay for it.

[mugs99]

This last time, I voted for President Bush

You and just about every other Libertarian...Kerry would be president today if not for Libertarians voting for Bush.
I think the theory that you have to win local and state offices before going national just doesn't apply in this new internet age. Dean did a pretty good job using the internet. I think the LP can do better.
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[Da Bilge Troll]

Dean did a pretty good job using the internet. I think the LP can do better.

Dean made a splash but I wouldn't say it was a "pretty good job".

I consider myself a Republican for more reasons than just being anti-Kerry. Our nation's founders went to great lengths to ensure a two-party system. That, plus the few planks of the LP platform that I consider too radical even for me have convinced me that the best way to advance liberty is to work toward making one of the major parties more libertarian. The Rats are a lost cause, so the GOP is our best hope.

[mugs99]

Dean made a splash but I wouldn't say it was a "pretty good job".

Considering Dean has no charisma at all, I think he did an excellant job. The LP grows as the Republican party moves to the left. The evangelical right did not turn out in greater numbers in 2004 than in 2000. Libertarians voting against Kerry put Bush in the White House. I too am a lifelong Republican, but I can see the writing on the wall. My party has moved so far to the left I may as well call myself a Democrat. When the LP gets rid of that silly loyalty oath, I like many other Republicans will be joining them.
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[Da Bilge Troll]

I too am a lifelong Republican, but I can see the writing on the wall. My party has moved so far to the left I may as well call myself a Democrat. When the LP gets rid of that silly loyalty oath, I like many other Republicans will be joining them.

Actually, you and I are passing in opposite directions. Before 2000, I voted Libertarian other than for Barry Goldwater and Ronald Reagan. The two Klintoon elections convinced me that a third-party vote, though not "wasted" exactly, was counterproductive and only succeeded in electing the more extreme of the leftist authoritarians running for office.

Liberty has been forgotten in America. People speak of freedom but never liberty - as if the words (and the concepts) were interchangeable synonyms! People today assume that liberty is whatever the government allows us to do, that liberty means equality (especially equality of result), having food on the table, a roof over your head and free health care (not to mention smoke-free bars and restaurants).

But I do not despair. In fact, it is because I do not despair that I am now a Republican!

[mugs99]

But I do not despair. In fact, it is because I do not despair that I am now a Republican!

That's cool. Whatever works for you. I don't quite understand how a Liberty loving conservative could identify with this new big government RP though.

Are you planning on Libertarianizing the RP?
I'd certainly like to see that!

[Da Bilge Troll]

Are you planning on Libertarianizing the RP?

I thought that's what I said! LOL! ;-)

[mugs99]

ROFL!
I just wanted to make sure I understood you correctly.
Good Luck! I really do hope you're successful.
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[cgbg]

I love the LP--when they don't do stupid stuff like forcing Ohio to do a recount when there was exactly a zero chance of any change in the result. Deciding to become anti-war after 9-11 was another big-time loser. Leading with your chin is not a very good strategy.

The LP needs to add "The Art of War" to its required reading list. :-(