The Folly of a Free Trade Pact with Central America

AmericanEconomicAlert.org ^ | Wednesday, April 07, 2004 | Alan Tonelson

[Toddsterpatriot]

Yes, Todd, they will buy something from America, eventually: T-bonds, as I posted above.

And when that t-bond matures it turns into.....dollars. Sounds like they hold dollars which are worth what, exactly?

[ninenot]

Whatever they will buy in oil that day.

[ninenot]

Whatever they will buy in oil that day.

[Havoc]

There are other choices and I ain't talkin Nader.

[Toddsterpatriot]

Whatever they will buy in oil that day.

Great. The oil seller uses the dollars to buy what?

[american spirit]

Isn't it also interesting that since this free trade idiocy came on the scene roughly 20 yrs. ago that personal, corporate and fedgov debt has skyrocketed and along with that the loss of whole industries to foreign competition that has no problem using child or slave labor. With NAFTA we've seen a flood of illegal immigration when we were promised a much different result for the Mexican economy. With these illegals coming in here we now see employers around the country letting go Americans so that they can pay illegals under the table and EVADE a whole bunch of payroll taxes. Now if you're unable to see the linkage in these nation destructing policies then I strongly suggest some reverse rectal cranial inversion exercises.

[Toddsterpatriot]

Isn't it also interesting that since this free trade idiocy came on the scene

Yeah, those countries that restrict trade have much better economies. Can you name some of those countries doing better than the U.S.?

[american spirit]

We're running huge budget and trade deficits plus it's now estimated the fedgov has over 40 TRILLION $ (and counting) of unfunded liabilities (that's a debt we'll have to confront down the road), millions of jobs lost in the last two decades and you actually want to compare that track record with someone else? You've got to be joking!

[Toddsterpatriot]

Yeah, thanks for that list of countries doing better. Very helpful.

[monday]

"But you don't have the balls to come up here and try, do you?"

Threats and dares, the debating methods of the schoolyard bully. You don't mind if ignore you do you? I expect you are used to it.

[monday]

"We're running huge budget and trade deficits plus it's now estimated the fedgov has over 40 TRILLION $ (and counting) of unfunded liabilities (that's a debt we'll have to confront down the road), "

Our Govt would have 40 Trillion in unfunded liabilities even if it completely shut down trade with other countries. Politicians are responsible for that, not foreign companies or countries.

[american spirit]

Didn' think you had any stones to debate the issue.

[american spirit]

Who do you think created these idiotic trade policies that has resulted in so many lost industries, jobs and incredible amounts of debt.....the tooth fairy?

[Toddsterpatriot]

Didn' think you had any stones to debate the issue.

Forget stones, how about some facts?

Give me some countries that are practicing what you preach and are doing better than the United States.

Shouldn't be hard for you to do.

[american spirit]

Keep bobbing and weaving skippy, when you get a clue I'd like to see you defend how current policies are so beneficial to our country.....I won't hold my breath.

[Toddsterpatriot]

I'd like to see you defend how current policies are so beneficial to our country.....I won't hold my breath.

Well, all I can point to is the success of the American economy versus economies that restrict trade. Is America the greatest economy in the world or not?

[american spirit]

Right now we're the world's largest debtor nation, our dollar has lost significant value, we've become increasingly dependent on foreign capital and products to even keep the system afloat. Is there anything that can be read into these aspects of our current situation that we can point to as being postive for our future?....obviously not.

My point is we are still the world's greatest nation in many ways but the sad facts are we've sized up, set up and are in the process of being sold out by the political/fedgov elite and their multinational corporate masters. NAFTA & GATT were just the beginning....I highly suggest you study the ramifications of this upcoming 'FTAA' and think about how it will impact our constitutional and legal rights. The FTAA is nothing more than the American equivalent to the EU and everything that implies.....if it goes through, we'll be reduced to nothing more than a banana republic.

[american spirit]

Right now we're the world's largest debtor nation, our dollar has lost significant value, we've become increasingly dependent on foreign capital and products to even keep the system afloat. Is there anything that can be read into these aspects of our current situation that we can point to as being postive for our future?....obviously not.

My point is we are still the world's greatest nation in many ways but the sad facts are we've sized up, set up and are in the process of being sold out by the political/fedgov elite and their multinational corporate masters. NAFTA & GATT were just the beginning....I highly suggest you study the ramifications of this upcoming 'FTAA' and think about how it will impact our constitutional and legal rights. The FTAA is nothing more than the American equivalent to the EU and everything that implies.....if it goes through, we'll be reduced to nothing more than a banana republic.

[Toddsterpatriot]

Right now we're the world's largest debtor nation, our dollar has lost significant value, we've become increasingly dependent on foreign capital and products to even keep the system afloat.

You bash free trade and yet you worry about the value of the dollar. So, basically, these foreign companies and countries have all these dollars. And the value is dropping. I'd think you'd be happy. These evil foreigners are losing.

So, we buy a lot of foreign products. What can the foreigners do with the dollars they get? Sit there and watch them drop in value?

If they hurry and buy American goods, that's good for us, right?

As far as FTAA impacting our Constitution, exactly how?

The threat to America is uncontrolled illegal immigration and uncontrolled government spending, not free trade.

[InABunkerUnderSF]

All the free trade pact I have seen this country make have been total pants downers for the middle class.

In this case, you are more correct than you may know. Honduras and Costa Rica make most of the underwear worn in the US today. Most of the garment companies in Honduras, Guatemala, El Salvador and Nicaragua are Chinese owned. This was China's way of getting around garment quotas. The irony is, many of those plants are owned by the PLA and were first established during Reagan's Caribbean Basin Initiative - an attempt to stem the flow of communism in Central America by beefing up their economies in the 1980s.

The plants in Costa Rica tend to be US owned, unionized and have decent health and safety environments. Their counterparts in the rest of Central America are often just big tin sheds surrounded by razor wire fences, with their own diesel generators, a few overhead lights and a lot of sewing machines.

If you support CAFTA this kind of treatment for workers, along with higher profits for the PLA, is what you are supporting.

The good news for the US economy is that, with the exception of Costa Rica, the business climate in Central America is so corrupt and the economies are so week that I don't think any free trade agreement could make them a threat to the US economy.