ARMORED WARFARE: Hummers Getting Worked to Death

StrategyPage.com ^ | March 15, 2004

[John Jorsett]

The U.S. Armys hummer vehicle was not meant to be a combat vehicle, or a power generator, but that's what it is turning into during the continued Iraq operations. Of the 10,000 hummers in Iraq, over 40 percent of them will be armored. Moreover, it has become more common for troops to run numerous electronic devices off the hummers power supply. As a result, a growing number of the vehicles are breaking down. The engines are being worn out prematurely, and the extra weight of armor, and additional weapons, is doing more damage to suspensions and tires. Nearly ten percent of the hummers in Iraq are out of action waiting for repairs. Getting sufficient spare parts to Iraq is also a problem. Moreover, the hummer was not designed to be quickly repaired, especially for things like engine replacement. It takes 62 man hours to replace the engine. The M-1 tank, which was designed for ease of repair, can have its engine replace much more quickly. As a result of this experience, the first time hummers have been used in a sustained combat operation, design changes for the vehicle are being made for the future models.

[taxed2death]

The next batch of Hummers should have the new Cummins 600 ISB engine in them. 300 horsepower and 600 foot lbs of torque at 1600 rpm, 300,000 miles between rebuilds. These cummins will be available in Dodge pick-ups in late 1004. They are available in Ford F-650 medium duty trucks as an option.
Whoever made the decision to put that crappy GM diesel in them should be drawn and quartered.

[taxed2death]

....oooops, late 2004. The GM diesels are essentially throw-aways.....the Cummins have 3 different overbore pistons available. You could keep 'em running for over a million miles.

[taxed2death]

Oh yea, the ISB powered F-550's have a GVW of 38,000 lbs. The Cummins powertrain is designed for this. The crappy GM diesels would "prematurely wear out"....pulling a bass boat.

Some one somewhere along the line made a bad choice in engines......

[bondjamesbond]

I'd rather have them worked to death in Iraq than parked on the tarmac, all neat and pretty, back in North Carolina.

All the same, going with a more robust design makes a lot of sense.

[blanknoone]

I believe I was saying something along the lines of, "If we want a cheap armored vehicle, we should design and build one, not try to turn the HMMWV into something it is not." This is but one of many reasons.

[af_vet_rr]

I believe I was saying something along the lines of, "If we want a cheap armored vehicle, we should design and build one, not try to turn the HMMWV into something it is not." This is but one of many reasons.

That's what happens when a bunch of bureaucrats design something in committee meetings instead of engineers designing something based on actual needs.

[bmwcyle]

Oh no not that many polluting the Iraq people's clean air. /sarsacm

[BartMan1]

This of course is what happens when you put a peace-time Army into continuous combat for a year or more -- stuff wears out, and you quickly discover that equipment that was adequate for garrison duty doesn't hold up in the field.

I expect that the design changes instituted in the next generation of hummers will make them that much better.

Yankee know how on the move....

[BartMan1]

This of course is what happens when you put a peace-time Army into continuous combat for a year or more -- stuff wears out, and you quickly discover that equipment that was adequate for garrison duty doesn't hold up in the field.

I expect that the design changes instituted in the next generation of hummers will make them that much better.

Yankee know how on the move....

[kahoutek]

"Nearly ten percent of the hummers in Iraq are out of action waiting for repairs."

1 in 10 vehicles is not too bad....in a war zone.

I guess the kinks still haven't been worked out of echelon maintainence

[Monty22]

"Dodge pick-ups in late 1004"

King Arthur will want one.

[Former Proud Canadian]

I would guess that GM had something to do with choosing GM engines.

[B4Ranch]

"If we want a cheap armored vehicle, we should design and build one, not try to turn the HMMWV into something it is not."

No such vehicle has ever been designed. Cheap and armored will not smoothly fit in the same engineering design.

The idea to get the military to buy anything today is to come out with a stripped down model that is cheap. This will encourage them to buy it.

Then when all the modifications have been completed and it now weighs and costs three times the original econo model, they have what they were looking for at twice the price of the intended vehicle.

Government efficency at its best. We can't hope for any better.

[blanknoone]

No such vehicle...

See the SISU. Cheaper, and more capable, than the armored Humvees. And they aren't falling apart.

[B4Ranch]

The only SISUs I know of are forklifts. Norway or Denmark, I believe. Saw a few in Minnesota.

[blanknoone]

http://www.vcorps.army.mil/surg/photos/pics_armor/pages/SISU_JPG.htm

Cheaper than an armored humvee.

[Cannoneer No. 4]

Textron Systems, Wilmington, Mass., announced in late January that its Marine and Land Operations, based in New Orleans, was awarded a contract by the U.S. Army Tank-Automotive & Armaments Command (TACOM), to manufacture the Armored Security Vehicle (ASV) for the U.S. Army. The contract was valued at over $11.4 million and is for the production of 20 Armored Security Vehicles (ASV).

11.4/20 = $5,700,000 a piece

[B4Ranch]

One too many zeros.

[American_Centurion]

The SISU looks good, and is adequately armored, but overall I give the vehicle a thumbs down.

I worked with Swedes in Macedonia, we sometimes patrolled in the SISUs, they do not have the mobility nor visibility required for urban patrols.

The Hummers are for the most part fine, the troops patroling in known danger areas are in the armored ones, or in tracks. The soft-top Hummers are still needed for logistics, maintenance, and similar missions. The SISU isn't capable of properly carrying those out.

Yes, we have soldiers getting injured and killed, but for the most part what we are doing is working fine.