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GOP civil war: Herman Cain calls for third party
Salon ^ | November 7, 2012 | Alex Seitz-Wald

Posted on 11/09/2012 5:24:02 PM PST by 2ndDivisionVet

It’s been less than 24 hours since the polls closed and already the first shots in an emerging civil war within the conservative movement are being fired. Right-leaning pundits have been taking turns beating up on Mitt Romney and blaming him for the loss last night. Donald Trump just tweeted, “Congrats to @KarlRove on blowing $400 million this cycle. Every race @CrossroadsGPS ran ads in, the Republicans lost. What a waste of money.” And GOP leaders are already taking to the barricades on either side of the divide, which basically comes down to this question: Were Romney and the GOP too conservative or not conservative enough?

Steve Schmidt, a top Republican strategist who ran John McCain’s 2008 campaign, invoked the term on MSNBC this morning. “When I talk about a civil war in the Republican Party, what I mean is, it’s time for Republican elected leaders to stand up and to repudiate this nonsense [of the extreme right wing], and to repudiate it directly,” he said.

But on the other side of the fight, Herman Cain, the former presidential candidate who still has a robust following via his popular talk radio program and speaking tours, today suggested the most clear step to open civil war: secession. Appearing on Bryan Fischer’s radio program this afternoon, Cain called for a large faction of Republican Party leaders to desert the party and form a third, more conservative party.

“I never thought that I would say this, and this is the first time publicly that I’ve said it: We need a third party to save this country. Not Ron Paul and the Ron Paulites. No. We need a legitimate third party to challenge the current system that we have, because I don’t believe that the Republican Party … has the ability to rebrand itself,” Cain said.

Fischer, a social conservative leader, noted that he predicted this summer that if Mitt Romney loses, evangelical conservatives would start a third party. “If Barack Obama wins this election the Republican Party as we know it is finished, it is dead, it is toast,” Fischer said in September at the Values Voter Summit in Washington.

Rush Limabugh, two months ago, echoed the sentiment. ”If Obama wins, let me tell you what it’s the end of: the Republican Party. There’s gonna be a third party that’s gonna be oriented toward conservatism,” he said.

“It is more viable today than it has ever been,” Cain told Fischer today of a third party.

After the GOP’s crushing 2008 loss, there was lots of talk about a new third party. When the Tea Party emerged, this talk almost became a reality. Instead, the conservative activists opted for a hostile takeover of the GOP. It’s still very unlikely that Cain or anyone else could start a viable third party, but his comments underscore the cleavage within the conservative movement in the wake of the defeat last night.


TOPICS: Issues; Parties
KEYWORDS: gopcivilwar; hermancain; rinos; ronpaul; rushlimbaugh; steveschmidt; sublamation; talkradio; teaparty; thirdparty
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1 posted on 11/09/2012 5:24:14 PM PST by 2ndDivisionVet
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Well - just goes to tell ya, Herman isn’t very bright.


2 posted on 11/09/2012 5:25:34 PM PST by Ron C.
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Agree. If bonehead dork Boehner doesn’t committ suicide in the next three weeks, I am no longer a Republican.


3 posted on 11/09/2012 5:26:25 PM PST by Da Coyote
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
Don't just talk about it; do it!

Get this started NOW, and ready for 2014 Congressional and State Elections.

Of course, the Establishment OWNS all the Media, and the facts won't get out.

We'd see NOTHING but the constant, 24/7 bullshit against it/smears like Palin, Cain, Santorum, etc. recieved in the Primaries.

We are done....

4 posted on 11/09/2012 5:26:54 PM PST by traditional1 (Don't gotsta worry 'bout no mo'gage, don't gotsta worry 'bout no gas; Obama gonna take care o' me!)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Agree. If bonehead dork Boehner doesn’t committ suicide in the next three weeks, I am no longer a Republican.


5 posted on 11/09/2012 5:27:03 PM PST by Da Coyote
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

I agree with Herman!


6 posted on 11/09/2012 5:27:36 PM PST by Yaelle
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Sign me up!

Now.


7 posted on 11/09/2012 5:28:29 PM PST by Cringing Negativism Network (America doesn't need any new laws. America needs freedom!)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Its going to happen eventually.

The trick is to avoid thinking it will spring to power and replace the GOP. You’ve got to build small, pick off a seat here and there and caucus with conservative republicans. Over time you can start pulling the conservative republicans into the fold.


8 posted on 11/09/2012 5:28:51 PM PST by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Rove and Schmidt should come out of the closet, and switch parties.


9 posted on 11/09/2012 5:29:08 PM PST by who knows what evil? (G-d saved more animals than people on the ark...www.siameserescue.org.)
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To: Yaelle

The Libertarian party got one percent for the presidential election — in real terms that is huge — they did so spending fractions of a cent compared to republican and democrat advertisement.


10 posted on 11/09/2012 5:30:26 PM PST by OneWingedShark (Q: Why am I here? A: To do Justly, to love mercy, and to walk humbly with my God.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

After Christmas Herman...

Lets get through Thankgiving and Christmas and then we’ll talk next year...

But I think that the GOP types just might listen to reason and be willing and eagar to try something else...

like good sense and Conservatism...


11 posted on 11/09/2012 5:31:11 PM PST by Tennessee Nana
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

“It’s still very unlikely that Cain or anyone else could start a viable third party,”

Ever hear of Sarah Palin? Many of us would be pleased to have her head a ticket.


12 posted on 11/09/2012 5:31:40 PM PST by txrefugee
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To: Da Coyote

Adios.


13 posted on 11/09/2012 5:33:38 PM PST by Jacquerie (Welcome to arbitrary government.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Herman Cain felt some heat and left the kitchen.

A third party requires a Master Chef - Not a Dishwasher.


14 posted on 11/09/2012 5:33:51 PM PST by KittenClaws (You may have to fight a battle more than once in order to win it." - Margaret Thatcher)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
I'm beginning to consider this may be the way to go. Not that I think a third party can win on its own, it wouldn't be able to for decades. It would have to form a coalition with the GOP to win.

But I think there's strength in numbers - the GOP wouldn't be able to take conservatives for granted anymore and expect to keep the coalition intact. It would guarantee us a seat at the table selecting candidates, making policy, etc.

On the other hand, it may cause the GOP to finally just up & form a public alliance with the democrats. But then at least everyone's cards would be on the table.

15 posted on 11/09/2012 5:34:10 PM PST by skeeter
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
Oh ya... third parties always out juuuuusst great.

The socialist party and the communist party stopped trying to be third parties because they wanted results more than principled voters so they took over the democrap party.

It is strange that he is upset at a narrow loss and is proposing and idea to loose by even greater numbers. Genius.

16 posted on 11/09/2012 5:34:32 PM PST by GregoTX (Federalist)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

I hear GW’s nephew has filed in Tx to run for office. NO MORE BUSHES


17 posted on 11/09/2012 5:34:38 PM PST by freekitty (Give me back my conservative vote; then find me a real conservative to vote for)
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To: txrefugee

Sarah, TEA party. I can’t think of anything with more potential. The trick would be to get alot of the elected conservative to switch from GOP to the TEA party.


18 posted on 11/09/2012 5:35:11 PM PST by PhiloBedo (You gotta roll with the punches and get with what's real.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Just run as part of the Independent Party the way the stealth democrats run. It works.


19 posted on 11/09/2012 5:36:05 PM PST by Bronzy
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To: PhiloBedo

“Sarah, TEA party. I can’t think of anything with more potential. The trick would be to get alot of the elected conservative to switch from GOP to the TEA party.”

This is what I like to read...:)


20 posted on 11/09/2012 5:37:52 PM PST by antonico
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

21 posted on 11/09/2012 5:38:41 PM PST by mikrofon (Allen West for Speaker of the House .... for Revenge!)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

LOL, Herman Cain has become quite a clown.

There are already a bunch of dopey 3rd party’s and they aren’t ever going to amount to squat. It’s just not going to happen.


22 posted on 11/09/2012 5:39:00 PM PST by Longbow1969
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To: cripplecreek

Agreed. With some early successes early on, I think it can work. What did Perot pull in, 20%. I think we could get somewhere around a 30/30/30 split.


23 posted on 11/09/2012 5:40:24 PM PST by riri (Plannedopolis-look it up. It's how the elites plan for US to live.)
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To: PhiloBedo

I would join in a minute.

Romney lost because he was a liberal and the liberal RINO’s picked him.

I am hearing talk of the RINO’s wanting to recruit by buying votes like the Democrats do.That is not my party.


24 posted on 11/09/2012 5:41:17 PM PST by Venturer
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To: antonico

Perot proved with an essentially unlimited budget you can get 20% nationally - and elect Dems with a Clintonian plurality.


25 posted on 11/09/2012 5:41:17 PM PST by nascarnation (Baraq's bankruptcy: 2016)
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To: Venturer

If there is to be a new Party, here is how it happens, the Texas GOP pulls out of the National Party, and other State delegations join them to create a new movement, I believe that is the only viable way to start a new Party.


26 posted on 11/09/2012 5:43:23 PM PST by dfwgator
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Have to get rid of the Electoral College for that to work.


27 posted on 11/09/2012 5:44:50 PM PST by Mike Darancette (Think 2014)
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To: cripplecreek

Yup. If they do it thoughtfully and strategically, it could grow over time.


28 posted on 11/09/2012 5:46:58 PM PST by Moorings
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To: dfwgator

Possible, or there may be a new party any number of ways.

Bring it.

What matters is it starts now. Now.

Now.


29 posted on 11/09/2012 5:48:09 PM PST by Cringing Negativism Network (America doesn't need any new laws. America needs freedom!)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

It should be a registered party, that supports Conservative Republicans in each race, if there is no conservative Republican running - we don’t vote in that race, we skip that candidate. This is the only they will learn without actually jeopardizing the whole country.
Kind of like what happened in 2010, except an organized, registered Tea Party.


30 posted on 11/09/2012 5:50:17 PM PST by PMAS (All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing)
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To: dfwgator

I agree.

And for all the chumps who keep pulling the “R” lever and then venting after every election where the GOP pulls a Lucy Van Pelt on conservatives, well, you’re chumps and you’ll likely always be chumps, because you’re not learning the obvious lesson being laid out in front of you.

The way to start a new party is at a state or regional level, and then start picking off everything we can get, from county commissioners to House seats. This can be done and it can be done on a fairly limited budget.

Once enough seats in the House are taken that the GOP has to deal with a third party in Congress, then the GOP can be given an ultimatum.

For those who think that a new political party can’t arise: Tell that to the Whigs.

The fact is, we’re broke as a nation. We have two spendthrift political parties in power and both of them are liars when they say they’ll cut spending. Anyone who knows even basic mathematics can see that the problem with the federal budget (and state budgets) is on the spending side. That the GOP cannot find one program to eliminate completely - zero out the budget, eliminate the employees, sell off the buildings that house them - is an indication that they’ll never be serious about cutting spending.

The debt and spending issue is as big or bigger than the slavery issue of the 1800’s. It is an issue that will define who we are as a nation for decades and decades to come. It is an issue with financial as well as moral/ethical ramifications, just as slavery was.


31 posted on 11/09/2012 5:51:42 PM PST by NVDave
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To: Mike Darancette

Only for the presidential race.

For Congress, state and local races, the EC matters not a whit.

And most spending issues are decided at levels much lower than the POTUS or EOP.


32 posted on 11/09/2012 5:52:46 PM PST by NVDave
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To: Yaelle
I agree with Herman!

Ditto.

33 posted on 11/09/2012 5:52:54 PM PST by Gluteus Maximus
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Conservatism is our last best hope while the GOP will continue moving left compounding their failure. They are doomed


34 posted on 11/09/2012 5:53:54 PM PST by Manic_Episode (Some days...it's just not worth chewing through the leather straps....)
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To: freekitty
I hear GW’s nephew has filed in Tx to run for office.

DOA.

35 posted on 11/09/2012 5:56:01 PM PST by dfwgator
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To: OneWingedShark

I have spent yers as a Libertarian Party activist. The biggest expenditure we always encountered in presidential election years was access to the ballot. The elstablishment parties have monopolized the ballot with requirements for the number of petition signatures, regulated periods in which we were allowed to gather those signatures, and the inevitable challenges we faced when we finally had more than enough to deliver to the state agencies that ruled over these things. Every time we achieved so-called “permanent ballot status”, the legislators would simply change the rules and we would have to start all over again. The sheeple are absolutely no help whatsoever. You could appeal to their sense of fairness, asking them if they would prefer another choice on their ballot and the majority of them would simply cower at the idea. It was the most frustrating thing I had ever been involved in politically. I just could not believe the level of brainwashing these people displayed. The idea of having a CHOICE on the ballot was simply beyond their comprehension. Some of them even believed that the Constitution had established the two-party system. Unbelievable.


36 posted on 11/09/2012 5:56:01 PM PST by SkiKnee
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To: Ron C.
And that goes to show ya, Republicrats ain`t very principled.
37 posted on 11/09/2012 5:56:14 PM PST by nomad
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To: nascarnation
Perot proved with an essentially unlimited budget you can get 20% nationally - and elect Dems with a Clintonian plurality.

Yup. 3rd party's fail utterly in the United States. We hear this nonsense about forming new ones around election time every year and nothing is going to come of it. Our winner take all system with no possibility of coalition government is just not suited for 3rd party's.

38 posted on 11/09/2012 5:56:19 PM PST by Longbow1969
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To: Longbow1969

Bunk.

Things are different, and things are broken.

We need a new approach.


39 posted on 11/09/2012 5:59:17 PM PST by Cringing Negativism Network (America doesn't need any new laws. America needs freedom!)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

A 3rd party will occur the day after Texas withdraws from the union.

And all my hair grows back.

It’s sublimation.


40 posted on 11/09/2012 6:00:36 PM PST by NoLibZone ("When the people find they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic")
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To: dfwgator

hope so


41 posted on 11/09/2012 6:01:44 PM PST by freekitty (Give me back my conservative vote; then find me a real conservative to vote for)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

The way things are going the GOP WILL BE the third party.


42 posted on 11/09/2012 6:02:02 PM PST by dfwgator
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

I wouldn’t follow Cain into a third party. There are a couple of other names that could get me there, though.


43 posted on 11/09/2012 6:02:05 PM PST by marron
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To: Longbow1969
Yup. 3rd party's fail utterly in the United States. We hear this nonsense about forming new ones around election time every year and nothing is going to come of it.

See Post #36.

44 posted on 11/09/2012 6:03:33 PM PST by OneWingedShark (Q: Why am I here? A: To do Justly, to love mercy, and to walk humbly with my God.)
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To: NVDave

I can see problems with a third party challenge however. It would likely end up the same way that the ‘Dixiecrats’ did. We might win South Carolina and Alabama with effort, but we’d lose places like Montana.

The issue we have is that the Republican party is a coalition of different people. The religiously active conservatives who want pro-life and traditional marriage amendments pursued, and the more moderate, casual conservatives, who are mainly focused on fiscal issues, worry about the debt etc. One of the problems is candidates voted in by the latter group never serve as fiscal conservatives anyway. Look at Boehner.

The challenge for us is patching together social and economic conservatives in a strong way, whether that means starting a new party and doing some very careful planning, or simply working like hell to completely overthrow the GOP-E in 2014. Getting rid of Boehner would be symbolic.


45 posted on 11/09/2012 6:03:42 PM PST by Viennacon
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To: Ron C.
Well - just goes to tell ya, Herman isn’t very bright.

Sorry Ron, I don't disagree with you often, but this time you are wrong.

We, as conservatives are not going to get any traction anymore within the GOP.

Now is absolutely the time to focus on a third-party, if nothing else, to force the GOP to listen.

They appear to have the same character flaws visible with the adherents of Islam, they only understand force.

As for this conservative, they've taken me for granted for the last time.
46 posted on 11/09/2012 6:04:58 PM PST by SoConPubbie (Mitt and Obama: They're the same poison, just a different potency.)
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To: Viennacon

The way the GOP has been going, we would Win in Montana by a mile.


47 posted on 11/09/2012 6:05:19 PM PST by Cringing Negativism Network (America doesn't need any new laws. America needs freedom!)
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To: dfwgator
The way things are going the GOP WILL BE the third party.

Couldn't have anything to do with the talk of Jeb Bush for 2016, could it? [/sarc]
Hell, I think I'd be a better candidate for president.

48 posted on 11/09/2012 6:05:59 PM PST by OneWingedShark (Q: Why am I here? A: To do Justly, to love mercy, and to walk humbly with my God.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
I do not blame Romney, I think he ran a fine campaign. I blame the RNC for not putting pressure on the States to quit with the cross lines voting during the primaries and the early primaries. And they can do it by refusing to recognize the votes of those States. In the last two Presidential elections the candidates were chosen by mostly left leaning States with early primaries and cross line voting. How can we expect to get a candidate that is cohesive with this kind of garbage going on? Answer: we can't! I live in Oklahoma, a completely red state, not one county went to Obama. States like mine should be the first primary States, if we have to have firsts, better would be one day for all primaries and no early voting. The current goat rope is senseless and will never produce a Republican President!
49 posted on 11/09/2012 6:17:35 PM PST by pepperdog ( I still get a thrill up my leg when spell check doesn't recognize the name/word Obama!)
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To: Cringing Negativism Network

Sign me up too!

We wouldn’t win for a while, but ‘winning’ with RINOs isn’t winning anyways...and we haven’t won much during the last 20 years.


50 posted on 11/09/2012 6:21:05 PM PST by Mr Rogers (America is becoming California, and California is becoming Detroit. Detroit is already hell.)
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