No, Trump did not cave

http://donsurber.blogspot.com/ ^ | 9/14/17 | Don Surber

[apocalypto]

Good points.

[fortheDeclaration]

No, they didn’t break any laws, they were brought here by their parents.

[fortheDeclaration]

That would be a punishment if they were raised here and considered themselves Americans.

[fortheDeclaration]

So, now you want to change the argument.

If they came here on their own as teenager's they did break the law.

But if they were brought here as children, they didn't.

If they were brought here as children and were raised here, they did nothing illegal.

Your view is simply a knee jerk reaction to a complex problem.

[apocalypto]

They are here illegally. And that is enough to send them to their own country.

[kabar]

So, now you want to change the argument. If they came here on their own as teenager's they did break the law. But if they were brought here as children, they didn't.

I am not changing the argument. It doesn't matter how they got here, they are in violation of 8 U.S. Code § 1325 - Improper entry by alien. It doesn't matter if they came here voluntarily or involuntarily. The could be forced to come here thru human trafficking or brought by their parents. They have no right to stay here.

The very purpose of DACA was to legalize illegal alines and prevent their deportation under the law. The USG issued ID cards to them to defer their deportation

You are hung up with the idea that to be in violation of the law, you must intentionally take an overt action. Your use of "breaking the law" misses the point. They are here illegally and are subject to deportation. They are in violation of the law. The objective of the unconstitutional Obama executive order was to legalize their presence as a distinct class or group of illegal aliens who could not be deported and be allowed to work legally.

Your view is simply a knee jerk reaction to a complex problem.

LOL. That is the point I was making to you. Setting the legal precedent that any child brought here by their illegal parents has some inherent right to stay here is bad public policy. I have lived in and traveled to many third world countries. I can assure you that there are literally billions of parents who would do anything to bring their children here to obtain a better life. Currently, they are living in obscene poverty with no hope of escaping their fate. If we say that any child brought to the US by illegal alien parents can stay here, then you will invite millions more to come similar to the flood of unaccompanied "children" that came across our borders two years ago. When you reward something, you get more of it.

We cannot take in every person who wants to come here. In fact, we are taking in far too many people now. In 1970 one in 21 was foreign born (9.7 million); today, there are 42.5 million with less than one in 8 foreign born, the highest it has been in 105 years; and by 2023 it will be one in 7, the highest in our history. Immigrants, legal and illegal, use welfare to a far greater extent than the native born. They take American jobs and depress wages. We have a huge surplus of labor, especially those with a high school diploma or less.

87% of legal immigrants are minorities as classified by the USG. Minorities and immigrants vote more than two to one Dem. The Dems want more immigration and amnesty to make them the permanent majority party. By 2050 the demography of the US will be same as CA today. That is our future.

DACA is just the first step towards a blanket amnesty for the 12 to 30 million illegal aliens here now. You can make similar arguments for why they should be allowed to stay and work here as the DACA recipients.

[fortheDeclaration]

It matters very much how they got here and that is the entire issue!

So, the notion that you are going to send someone back to his family's nation, when he has been raised here his entire life is just idiotic.

It represents a complete breakdown in the understanding of the letter and spirit of the law.

[fortheDeclaration]

Not if they have been raised as Americans it isn't.

They have not committed any crime and shouldn't be punished with the parents!

[apocalypto]

Nonsense. They are not being punished. Above all, this country should not become the dumping grounds for foreigners, young or old.

[kabar]

It matters very much how they got here and that is the entire issue!

Exactly. You either got here legally or illegally. If you are here illegally, you are in violation of the law.

So, the notion that you are going to send someone back to his family's nation, when he has been raised here his entire life is just idiotic.

Raised here his entire life? You don't understand DACA. You just had to get here by the age of 15. And being raised here makes you the winner of life's lottery. What about those who came here thru the legal process? Their children had to wait their turn to come here.

So who gets to stay here? What are the rules? Are you saying that the standard for staying in the US is that you have been raised here? Going forward, as a matter of public policy, you are saying that all illegal alien children who have come here before the age of 15 should be allowed to stay. You are providing the incentive for more illegal aliens to bring their children to the US along with encouraging unaccompanied children to come. And what about the parents? Should they be allowed to stay with their children?

You have no respect for the Rule of Law. You are operating out of pure emotion not understanding what kind of precedent is being set. In 1986 we had a "one-time" amnesty. The proponents said there would never be another. The USG estimated that 1 million would apply, but the real number turned out to be 2.7 million. Thirty one years later we are again debating another amnesty for 11 to 30 million illegal aliens.

So what is your solution? Do we legalize the 900,000 DACA recipients and give them a path to citizenship? There are another estimated 2 million DACA eligible "children" who did not apply. Should they also be treated the same as the existing DACA recipients? And what about the illegal alien parents who have spent many years in the US? And when do you stop this rolling amnesty or will this continue indefinitely into the future?

It represents a complete breakdown in the understanding of the letter and spirit of the law.

You don't understand the law. There should be equal treatment under the law. You want to give DACA recipients advantages and priorities not accorded legal immigrants to this country.

[kabar]

This was so predictable. The DACA recipients want all 12 to 30 million illegal aliens legalized. It was always the objective of the Dream Act. The camel's nose under the tent.

Illegal Aliens Crash Nancy Pelosi’s DACA Press Conference: ‘All of Us or None of Us!’

Others held up signs, including: “Fight 4 All 11 Million,” referring to the estimated total of all illegal aliens in the U.S.

As if to support her point, activists chanted: “All of us — or none of us,” meaning that they would only accept full amnesty for all illegal aliens, not just DACA beneficiaries.

[caww]

'ALL' Illegals are demanding they legally be allowed to remain here despite DACA being TEMPORARY.........DACA was the 'leverage' Obama handed to them 'to use' against our immigration laws.

For 'ALL' illegal aliens, what the laws are, as well as inforcements on immigration are nothing more than 'WALLS' to get through or climb over in order to take what is not theirs....just as they did in coming here and bringing their family members here illegally.

..."Get out of jail free card..."

[caww]

.........”The notion that you are going to send someone back to his family’s nation, when he has been raised here his entire life is just idiotic.”........

Not at all or even close. The family of course can return with them and take all they’ve learned with them and do something wonderful for their own countrymen, and build their own country up. That is the deal the parents struck for their children ‘knowing Daca was temporary’....and in most cases the parents are illegals to begin with and should not be rewarded for breaking our laws.