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Relating our (LDS) faith to the rest of Christianity
Mormon Times ^ | May 28, 2009 | Orson Scott

Posted on 05/28/2009 5:33:11 AM PDT by svcw

How do you plan to spend your summer vacation?


TOPICS: Chit/Chat
KEYWORDS: antimormonthread; lds; mormon
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We don't talk much about "the Great Apostasy" anymore, mostly because it annoys our Catholic and Protestant friends. But the fact remains that if authentic Christianity had been available, Joseph Smith's mission would not have been necessary.
1 posted on 05/28/2009 5:33:12 AM PDT by svcw
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To: svcw
Just another interesting article.
2 posted on 05/28/2009 5:33:40 AM PDT by svcw (The prerequisite for receiving the grace of God ... is knowing you need it.)
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To: svcw; informavoracious; larose; RJR_fan; Prospero; Conservative Vermont Vet; ...
+

Freep-mail me to get on or off my pro-life and Catholic List:

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Please ping me to note-worthy Pro-Life or Catholic threads, or other threads of interest.

Obama Says A Baby Is A Punishment

Obama: “If they make a mistake, I don’t want them punished with a baby.”

3 posted on 05/28/2009 5:45:47 AM PDT by narses (http://www.theobamadisaster.com/)
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To: greyfoxx39; Pan_Yans Wife; MHGinTN; Colofornian; Elsie; FastCoyote; Osage Orange; Greg F; ...

Ping


4 posted on 05/28/2009 5:50:01 AM PDT by colorcountry (A faith without truth is not true faith.)
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To: svcw
Mormons -- especially those who have read Hopkins's How Greek Philosophy, etc. -- will be keenly aware that the time period Stark explores, with checkpoints at 100 and 180 CE (A.D.), is exactly the era when Christian doctrine and authority were being lost.

Sheesh!

5 posted on 05/28/2009 5:52:44 AM PDT by colorcountry (A faith without truth is not true faith.)
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To: colorcountry

Yep


6 posted on 05/28/2009 5:59:31 AM PDT by svcw (The prerequisite for receiving the grace of God ... is knowing you need it.)
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I don’t think the Trinity denying cult of Mormonism relates much to my reformed Protestant faith at all.


7 posted on 05/28/2009 6:16:41 AM PDT by crghill (You can't put a condom on your soul.)
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To: svcw

Sure. . .and if authentic faith in God had been available, Mohammed’s mission would not have been necessary.


8 posted on 05/28/2009 6:37:11 AM PDT by Hootowl
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To: svcw; colorcountry
Great find, SVCW!

From the article:

Because Hopkins has to explain the neo-Platonic philosophy that pervaded the Roman intellectual world in order to show how Christianity differed from it, then adapted to it, and finally became it, this is not an easy read. Especially because it is the neo-Platonic idea of God that gives us all the nonsensical paradoxes that have long contorted Christian theology. But Hopkins does a superb job of making things as clear as they can be, and Mormons who read it will no longer have the misconception that Constantine and the Nicene Creed marked some kind of watershed. The apostasy was complete long before Constantine was born.

The scary thing about this book is to realize how the identical processes are at work today, as many Latter-day Saints try to twist the gospel to make it fit one or another of the worldly philosophies of today.

9 posted on 05/28/2009 6:58:43 AM PDT by greyfoxx39 (If Pelosi knew of torture and did nothing to stop she is admitting to being W's accomplice.)
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To: crghill
Well, America has been a fertile spawning-ground for a number of cults predicated on the notion of deus abscondicus. At a certain point in history, these cultists assert, Jesus turned His back upon His church in disgust, stomped out, and left us to fumble and stumble around in the Dark Ages. Until Our Man showed up to turn on the lights again!
10 posted on 05/28/2009 7:02:24 AM PDT by RJR_fan (The day a marxist becomes president, is the day that pigs will fly. Well, Swine Flu!)
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To: svcw
Relating our (LDS) faith to the rest of Christianity

The REST???

11 posted on 05/28/2009 7:07:19 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: svcw
 
We don't talk much about "the Great Apostasy" anymore, mostly because it annoys our Catholic and Protestant friends. But the fact remains that if authentic Christianity had been available, Joseph Smith's mission would not have been necessary.
 
 
Temple Recommend Questions:

 1 Do you have faith in and a testimony of God the Eternal Father, His Son Jesus Christ, and the Holy Ghost?

 2 Do you have a testimony of the Atonement of Christ and of His role as Savior and Redeemer?

 3 Do you have a testimony of the restoration of the gospel in these the latter days?

 4 Do you sustain the President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints as the Prophet, Seer, and Revelator and as the only person on the earth who possesses and is authorized to exercise all priesthood keys? Do you sustain members of the First Presidency and the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles as prophets, seers, and revelators? Do you sustain the other General Authorities and local authorities of the Church?

 5 Do you live the law of chastity?

 6 Is there anything in your conduct relating to members of your family that is not in harmony with the teachings of the Church?

 7 Do you support, affiliate with, or agree with any group or individual whose teachings or practices are contrary to or oppose those accepted by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?

 8 Do you strive to keep the covenants you have made, to attend your sacrament and other meetings, and to keep your life in harmony with the laws and commandments of the gospel?

 9 Are you honest in your dealings with your fellowmen?

10 Are you a full-tithe payer?

11 Do your keep the Word of Wisdom?

12 Do you have financial or other oblgations to a former spouse or children? If yes, are you current in meeting those obligations?

13 If you have previously received your temple endowment:

     Do you keep the covenants that you made in the temple?

     Do you wear the garment both night and day as instructed in the endowment and in accordance with the covenant you made in the temple?

14 Have there been any sins or misdeeds in your life that should have been resolved with priesthood authorities but have not been?

15 Do you consider yourself worthy to enter the Lord's house and participate in temple ordinances?
 
 
The bishop WILL hear about this!!!

12 posted on 05/28/2009 7:12:07 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: svcw
 
We don't talk much about "the Great Apostasy" anymore, mostly because it annoys our Catholic and Protestant friends. But the fact LIE remains that if authentic Christianity had been available, Joseph Smith's mission would not have been necessary.

13 posted on 05/28/2009 7:14:46 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: RJR_fan

And here I thought He promised to nver leave us or forsake us. Silly me.


14 posted on 05/28/2009 7:18:34 AM PDT by crghill (You can't put a condom on your soul.)
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To: crghill
And here I thought He promised to never leave us or forsake us. Silly me.

I suggested this to a Mormon missionary once and he told me that was why God sent Joseph Smith. I then asked him if that promise applied to the people who lived during the time that the church disappeared from the earth and Joseph Smith appeared. He didn't have a response to that nor did his partner.

15 posted on 05/28/2009 7:28:47 AM PDT by CommerceComet
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To: Elsie
I love and respect my Mormon friends and neighbors. But when their young men knock on my door and ask to come in, they have no idea what they are in for.

It ends with them leaving 30-45 minutes later, hastily trying to get away and me following and imploring that they do not know the Christ I know and what peril they face.

16 posted on 05/28/2009 7:36:59 AM PDT by dersepp (Orwell Was An Optimist)
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To: crghill; RJR_fan
And here I thought He promised to nver leave us or forsake us. Silly me.

(And here we thought He said in Matthew 16:18 that the gates of hell would ne'er prevail against the church...silly us for actually taking Jesus Christ @ His Word...or considering Him a True Prophet.../sarc)

17 posted on 05/28/2009 9:16:33 AM PDT by Colofornian
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To: RJR_fan; crghill
At a certain point in history, these cultists assert, Jesus turned His back upon His church in disgust, stomped out, and left us to fumble and stumble around in the Dark Ages. Until Our Man showed up to turn on the lights again!

What's "interesting" is they claim to be a restoration of the original church. Yet when you look @ the "second-generation" apostles of the original church -- the one who seeded many "first-generation" churches in regions beyond (the apostle Paul)...what did Paul prophesy about this?

Now to him who is able to do immeasurably more than all we ask or imagine, according to his power that is at work within us, to him be glory IN THE CHURCH and in Christ Jesus THROUGHOUT ALL GENERATIONS, FOR EVER AND EVER! Amen. (Ephesians 3:20-21)

What part of "glory IN THE CHURCH...THROUGHOUT ALL GENERATIONS" do Lds not understand? (And why can't Mormons just say up front, "Apostle Paul, you're a false prophet...because we don't believe what you said in Eph. 3:21 came into fruition"???)

And, boy. I thought "For ever and ever" met exactly that...
At least I did until I met Joseph Smith followers.
'Cause they're among the few who twist eternal "damnation" to mean temporarily "damned up" in spirit prison.
To a Mormon, "for ever and ever" doesn't mean "for ever and ever" and "eternal" doesn't mean "eternal."

When you can't even deal with basic words at face value, that is when you know you're dealing with cultists.

18 posted on 05/28/2009 9:27:27 AM PDT by Colofornian
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To: Colofornian; RJR_fan; CommerceComet

By stopping at the office of prophet you deny His Lordship. You therefore deny the Trinity. Without the Trinity you cannot explain unity, diversity and harmony. Without the Trinity you cannot account for epistemoloy. Without the Trinity you cannot account for logic. Without the Trinity you cannot know anything. Without the Trinity you are left with absurdity.

That’s why the article that started this thread is in error. You want to destroy logic so you can have your faith. The true God is the author of logic. That God is triune....Kiss the Son lest he be angry with you and you perish along with way.

Jesus Christ is God...to deny that is to deny Him. To deny him is to perish!


19 posted on 05/28/2009 9:33:13 AM PDT by crghill (You can't put a condom on your soul.)
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To: Colofornian

That’s one thing that I always have fun with when they knock on my door....definitions.


20 posted on 05/28/2009 9:37:04 AM PDT by crghill (You can't put a condom on your soul.)
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