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To: Darksheare
Hmmmm...time to break out the reloading data for the .30 carbine cartrige. As I remember, it's a real weakling. But I'll confirm it shortly. :-)

That's a hefty price tag though.
16 posted on 06/11/2005 10:17:26 AM PDT by hiredhand (My kitty disappeared. NOT the rifle!)
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To: hiredhand

I believe it about teh paintball guns, found them as well.
*chuckle*

Hmm.. I know a few woodchucks I could scare the living daylights out of with it.

$639 is kinda hefty.


20 posted on 06/11/2005 10:26:42 AM PDT by Darksheare (Hey troll, Sith happens.)
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To: Darksheare
Here's the basic scoop on balistics for the .30 carbine cartrige.

The only load data I could scratch up was from an older (Speer #10) reloading manual, and the only projectiles they list are 110gr of various configurations...(round nose, FMJ, and Speer Varminteer - a jacketed hollow point). Sectional density only varies slightly between all the projectiles.

Max velocity is JUST under 2000FPS on all load tables in this manual. Ballistic coefficients are LOW! Between .124 and .144!

So...having a fondness for punching holes in "things" at a bit of a distance....let's look at just what this little beasty can do for us. :-)

I'll use the highest BC which is .144 for the round nose (soft tip). It also has a slightly higher sectional density of .166.

The max load for this projectile using 15 gr of "296" (WHATEVER type of propellant that is!), is 1945FPS.

According to the handy-dandy charts in the back of my book...This load will cause the 110 gr projectile to impart 8.88 Ft lb per grain at muzzle. At 250 yards, this drops to 2.37 Ft lb per grain. Also, IF the weapon is zeroed in at 50 yards, it will drop 30.6" below LOS at 250 yards.

So far, this is sounding a LOT like a pistol round...figuratively speaking.

Without copying all the techo-garble I've been perusing through, the .357 Magnum cartridge using a 110gr JHP is just a tad behind the .30 Carbine ballistically speaking.

I think that for in terms of versatility, I'd go with the .357. For starters, you can ALWAYS shoot regular ole .38SPL out of it. Ruger made one model (can't remember it off the top) that had a cylinder for 9mm too!

Now...I'm going to jump to the .223 Rem (5.56MM NATO) only because I "believe" (IMHO) that the experience of shooting one is very similar to the M-1. Before even going into the ballistics, lets not forget that .223 ammo is PLENTIFUL! I don't think the same can be said for .30 Carbine. .30 Carbine is also a little more expensive. Magazines for most ARs come in everything from 5rd, up to 200rd (a drum mag...I might be a little off on capacity on it though). Mostly though (as we all know), most AR mags are 30 rd. I've been poking around the net looking for different sized M-1 mags, and it seems to be 15 rd and that's about it. I didn't spend a long time looking though, so it won't surprise me if somebody finds something strange like a 200 rd drum mag. :-)

Now..as for the .223...

Data for the 55gr FMJ is telling me that this projectile in front of 26.5gr of IMR 4320 will exit muzzle at a tad over 3000FPS (MID RANGE load data...under MAX though). There's a BIG difference in ballistic coefficients between spitzer and FMJ though! Spitzer is .255. FMJ is .189! I'll use FMJ anyway.

So again...according to the charts, this .223 Rem casing, firing a 55gr FMJ round produces 18.67 Ft Lb per gr of torque at muzzle. At 250 yards, it drops to 7.11 Ft Lbs. Zeroed in at 50 yards, this particular load will cause the projectile to drop 9.2" below line of sight.

I hate to say this...but unless I had an EXTREME fondness for this particular rifle (which seems to me that it fires a handgun cartridge), I'd go with a decent AR. Especially for the price of this thing!

...and if I were looking for something to poke holes in potentially dangerous "targets" I DEFINITELY wouldn't choose this particular weapon/cartridge combo. I'd stick with a short AR.

...and lastly. The last time I had to shoot an M-1 Carbine with no "ears" on, my ears rang for a week! The last time I had to shoot an AR with no hearing protection, it didn't bother me much. I think the M-1 is a LOT louder.
21 posted on 06/11/2005 11:00:39 AM PDT by hiredhand (My kitty disappeared. NOT the rifle!)
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