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Conservatives Must Oppose Collective Guilt
Leo McNeil ^ | December 22, 2014 | Leo McNeil

Posted on 12/22/2014 5:41:57 AM PST by LeoMcNeil

Over the weekend two New York City police officers, Rafael Ramos and Wenjian Liu, were executed by Ismaaiyl Brinsley in apparent retribution for the deaths of Michael Brown and Eric Garner. Mayor Bill de Blasio had previously encouraged leftists to protest the city’s police department. Before a press conference on the death of these two officers, police turned their back on the Mayor. They Mayor in turn attacked the actions of the police. It is obvious there is no love lost between the Mayor and the police department. The police union has so much as declared that blood is on the hands of the Mayor due to his support of protests against the police department.

When Congressman Gabrielle Giffords was shot by an evil lunatic the left and the media tried to bin the blame for the attack on Sarah Palin. Palin had innocently created a list of Democrat Congressmen who were in her “cross hairs.” Not for actual shooting of course but rather Palin believed that these Congressmen could be defeated by Republican candidates. No one other than a Democrat intentionally misconstruing Palin’s list could interpret it any other way. In the very least, Giffords shooter never saw Palin’s list and didn’t particularly like her either. Still, the media and the left declared that Palin created the conditions wherein an evil psychotic might think it’s acceptable to shoot a Congressman. Particularly so if they can pain the shooter as a conservative.

We on the right shouldn’t be so quick to blame Mayor de Blassio for the evil acts committed by Brinsley. When it comes right down to it, the only person responsible for the murder of the two officers is the man who pulled the trigger. We on the right should not buy into the notion of collective guilt, wherein anyone in power who supported protests against the police are somehow guilty of what Brinsley did. Mayor de Blassio, Al Sharption, Jesse Jackson, Eric Holder and Barack Obama are not responsible for the murders of Ramos or Liu. They may be responsible for encouraging protests against the police, they can even be held responsible when those protests became violent or destructive shortly after they encouraged protest.

The Eric Garner decision was handed down a couple weeks ago. Brinsley’s acts didn’t occur on the night of the decision, they didn’t occur shortly after the Mayor tried to whip up the mob against the cops. Instead, Brinsley decided to pick out two officers and punish them for Garner’s death. It’s entirely possible that Brinsley was working as part of a group devoted to murdering cops in retaliation. However, absent a link between de Blassio, Holder or any of the other leftists mentioned, there’s no point in including them in on Brinsley’s actions. While de Blassio may be encouraging New Yorkers to oppose the police and while it’s entirely understandable why the police there would turn their backs on him, for conservatives we need not pile on. The Mayor may be creating conditions wherein people oppose or the police but he isn’t in any way responsible for Brinsley’s actions. If we believe in individualism we have to extend that to criminal justice as well. Collective guilt is the creation of the left, we conservatives have no business joining in.

There appear to have been a number of other policemen murdered over the weekend. It is unclear whether their murders are in any way connected with the New York City killings. There may be a leftist group out there plotting the murder of police but until we discover whether or not such a group exists, guilt must remain with the shooter and his conspirators, if any, alone. Mayor de Blassio and other leftists are not responsible simply because they encouraged protests against the police after the Brown and Garner Grand Jury decisions. Especially so when this shooting happened weeks later. This is not an example of a politician whipping up a mob into a further frenzy which then results in a murder. Instead, this is an example of an evil man deciding weeks later to murder two policemen in retaliation. No one is responsible but him.


TOPICS: Government; Politics; Society
KEYWORDS: ericholder; nyc; police; sarahpalin
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1 posted on 12/22/2014 5:41:57 AM PST by LeoMcNeil
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To: LeoMcNeil

All men are guilty of rape.
All whites are racist.
All Christians are hypcrites.

I’m tired of collective guilt — but it will not stop until we say “All Muslims ...” “All blacks ...”

The left needs to be on the receiving end until they grasp the essentual fact of INDIVIDUAL responsibilty.


2 posted on 12/22/2014 5:52:31 AM PST by ClearCase_guy (Democrats have a lynch mob mentality. They always have.)
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To: LeoMcNeil

Anyone who accepts this argument is a fool. The reality is that Obama and De Blasio are part of a movement that views police as racist occupiers that enforce an unjust system and commonly refer to them as pigs. They clearly used the deaths of Garner and Brown to advance their political narrative. Paid operatives like Sharpton organized well publicized marches where the participants loudly chanted for the death of police officers. De Blasio and Obama did nothing to disassociate themselves from these people who are in fact their core base. elections have consequences and these events did not happen in a political vacuum. Obama was elected twice and De Blasio was elected with over 70% of the vote. There have been significant demographic and cultural changes in America. It is not unreasonable to state that the country is entering a post Christian, neo pagan era of decadence. Rational people will have to make appropriate accomadations.


3 posted on 12/22/2014 5:52:43 AM PST by allendale
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To: allendale

While I agree that de Blassio and Obama are associated with leftists who support anti-police protests and even support the protests themselves, there’s a big difference between supporting protest and being responsible for the execution style murder of two police officers.


4 posted on 12/22/2014 5:55:23 AM PST by LeoMcNeil
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To: LeoMcNeil

I had a different definition to collective guilt. One should not blame the entire police department because of one individual officer

Blaming certain individual in media and politics for murder is justified because they actually DID incite violenxw. They constantly call for innocent police officers to be harmed and how justice was denied

Theres totally no linkage between Gifford shooting and Palin


5 posted on 12/22/2014 5:56:55 AM PST by 4rcane
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To: LeoMcNeil

The author is correct to state that de Blasio is not responsible for the murder of the two cops in Brooklyn;
however the author misses the real reason the right and others want the mayor removed.

By caving in to the demands of the protesters, de Blasio abrogated his responsibility as Mayor of New York City.
His job is to run the city and ensure that its laws are enforced: he failed to do so and should therefore be removed from his post.


6 posted on 12/22/2014 5:57:31 AM PST by txnativegop (Tired of liberals, even a few in my own family.)
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To: LeoMcNeil

Everyone who advanced the ‘hands up don’t shoot’ narrative contributed to the deaths of those officers.

Perpetuating a lie... that a reasonable person could anticipate would lead to violence against the police does create culpability on the part of the Mayor, the CBC, & Sharpton.


7 posted on 12/22/2014 5:58:39 AM PST by rwilson99 (Please tell me how the words "shall not perish and have everlasting life" would NOT apply to Mary.)
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To: LeoMcNeil

“Collective guilt is the creation of the left, we conservatives have no business joining in.”

I disagree with this statement. Of course there in and always will be collective guilt, it is human nature. Not only that, but it is necessary for the survival of any species.

Ask yourself why people fear pit bulls or rattle snakes? Collective guilt needs to be tempered with logic, but it is necessary. Why do you suppose you can’t just walk up to a bird or a squirrel in your yard? It’s because they instinctively know that there are predictors out there. And they are not willing to find out, up close and personal, if you are one...


8 posted on 12/22/2014 6:03:06 AM PST by babygene
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To: LeoMcNeil

Gee Leo when people in your movement call for the death of police officers and you applaud or register no objection (remember to remain silent is to give assent), you share responsibility when those deaths occur exactly as the “protesters” demanded. Rethink your rant.


9 posted on 12/22/2014 6:03:33 AM PST by allendale
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To: LeoMcNeil
While I agree that de Blassio and Obama are associated with leftists who support anti-police protests and even support the protests themselves, there’s a big difference between supporting protest and being responsible for the execution style murder of two police officers.

And there's an even bigger difference between those two POS liberal scum supporting the protests and refusing to tamper down or at least attempt to quell the increasing calls by the protesting vermin for the retaliation and "death to police officers". Neither said a word, which to the average braindead urban feral, represents tacit approval.

10 posted on 12/22/2014 6:04:02 AM PST by Common Sense 101
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To: txnativegop

I didn’t touch on other reasons conservatives might oppose de Blassio or why people might want him removed for office. Those issues stand on their own, separate and distinct from the murder of the two cops over the weekend.


11 posted on 12/22/2014 6:04:04 AM PST by LeoMcNeil
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To: LeoMcNeil

No, the author is wrong. He gave draw false equivalence. When a Muslim preacher goes around calling for violence using lies. He is part of the problem and not an innocent bystander. Someone who cry FIRE in a crowded cinema when there’s NO FIRE that led to someone getting killed, should take responsibility for it. Sharpton, OBama, Blassio, certain members of the media are constantly crying FIRE in a crowded cinema and ppl are getting killed from it


12 posted on 12/22/2014 6:06:28 AM PST by 4rcane
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To: ClearCase_guy

It is not collective guilt when you blame a specific person for inciting a crime. They didn’t commit it themselves, but they encouraged the one who did to do it. And when a crowd of people yell “Pigs in a blanket” or “death to cops” they share guilt when cops are then murdered.


13 posted on 12/22/2014 6:07:48 AM PST by The Ghost of FReepers Past (Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light..... Isaiah 5:20)
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To: LeoMcNeil

fair enough.


14 posted on 12/22/2014 6:08:06 AM PST by txnativegop (Tired of liberals, even a few in my own family.)
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To: LeoMcNeil

I would like to ask Leo, is Osama Bin Laden guilty of terrorism even though he didn’t commit the crime himself. Leo incorrectly define “collective guilt”


15 posted on 12/22/2014 6:12:29 AM PST by 4rcane
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To: 4rcane

There’s a difference between heading up the organization that commits a terrorist act and supporting a particular cause or protest. Osama is guilty of the 9-11 attack (and presumably others) because he helped orchestrate and finance it. Bill de Blassio may support protest against police brutality but without a link between him and the shooter, he cannot be guilty for the shooter’s actions.


16 posted on 12/22/2014 6:20:02 AM PST by LeoMcNeil
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To: The Ghost of FReepers Past

I don’t believe the people yelling “pigs in a blanket” or “death to cops” share guilt when a cop is murdered weeks later. I agree that if the NYC protests had turned into full blown riots and that resulted in the death of a cop that then the protesters would share a collective guilt. In particular, those inciting the riot, inciting passion within the rioters, would be guilty. However, the murders last weekend occurred weeks later. Passions die down quickly, especially mob passions. I can’t see how de Blassio is responsible for the actions taken by one man (or a group of men, it’s not entirely clear yet) weeks later.

We conservatives had to deal with the same declaration of collective guilt 20 years ago when the Oklahoma City bombing occurred. Conservative talk radio was blamed for stirring passions and creating conditions wherein someone like McVeigh would go ahead and blow up a Federal building. Without getting into the specifics of OKC (I understand there are a multitude of conspiracies about the bombing and McVeigh) the same fact pattern exists in that bombing and in last weekend’s police shootings. Talk radio and de Blassio are accused of stirring up passions within political dissenters and those dissenters weeks or months later commit violent acts that talk radio and de Blassio are then blamed for.


17 posted on 12/22/2014 6:26:53 AM PST by LeoMcNeil
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To: LeoMcNeil

I do not buy “collective guilt.” It’s a communist ploy to divide people and to ultimately turn us into a communist country.


18 posted on 12/22/2014 6:39:59 AM PST by I want the USA back (Media: completely irresponsible. Complicit in the destruction of this country.)
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To: LeoMcNeil

You articulate your position well and everything, but I do not see a similarity at all. The talk radio charge was completely unrelated and bogus. The other is much more specific and directly related. Apples and oranges.

As for de Blassio, you are not talking about just conservatives blaming him. It looks like the vast majority of the police department blaming him. It is his job to stand up for the rule of law and to support grand juries and police — to be a help and not a hinderance between different groups. If the officers find him guilty it is not my job to tell them they are wrong.


19 posted on 12/22/2014 6:53:31 AM PST by The Ghost of FReepers Past (Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light..... Isaiah 5:20)
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To: LeoMcNeil
I don't care about Michael Brown. There's no such thing as 'White Privilege'. Sometimes women DO lie about rape. Global climate change is a crock of shiite.

Repeat 10 times. You'll feel much better.

20 posted on 12/22/2014 7:00:35 AM PST by skeeter
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