Posted on 03/03/2012 7:02:42 AM PST by Erik Latranyi
Harlan:”Without out an official investigation with sworn Arizona peace officers nothing will happen. It is simple as that.”
But as soon as they do, people like yourself will start hollering and complaining that Sheriff Joe is wasting tax-payer dollars on loony birth certificate conspiracies!
As it stands, they can continue to pursue the facts with the volunteer posse and use Sheriff Joe’s office as a force of credibility. As far as I can tell, nothing that Joe has signed onto has been disproven...
I won’t complain - I am not an Arizona tax payer.
How can Sheriff Joe be a voice of credibility? Nothing he says will give credibility to Corsi or Farrah.
Nothing that he has signed on to has been proven to a standard that would be acceptable to a DA or a judge. It nothing more than hearsay. In the American legal system, a group of private citizens is not allowed to first make accusations and then be allowed to conduct an official legally valid investigation of those accusations. Do I really have to explain to you why that is such a bad idea?
He’s a Democrat - he is a fool and a simpleton.
I do know this. The former Republican governor of Hawaii has said that Obama was born there. They have not denounced the post COLB as a forgery.
When everyone in Hawaii keeps saying he was born there, I suspect that he was born there, birther fantasies withstanding.
How do you explain the fact that the state of Hawaii has said many times that he was born there? That the long form BC he posted was valid?
Ariz. Rev. Stat. § 21-402 A. In a county with a population of two hundred thousand persons or more a grand jury shall be called every four months each year by the presiding judge of the superior court. Each grand jury shall sit until a new grand jury has been impanelled to replace it or until its term expires pursuant to section 21-403. Additional grand juries shall be called on petition of the county attorney stating the reasons therefor. (emphasis added)
The function of the Office is to keep accurate and complete records. It is the Duty of the personel of that Office to do so and, if called upon, to attest to the accuracy of those records.
Anyone should face legal penalties for attesting to something which is not true.
Those who keep legal records must face legal penalties for attesting to something which is not true.
Your characterization that those who desire legal penalties be incurred for those who give false attestation is really only a pretense "to accuse them of further mischief" is very misguided, at best.
Accurate record keeping is essential for a sound legal system. Surely you agree, yes?
Unattended home birth registration. This explanation fits the available information. Providing cover for Obama's false birthplace story is the name of the game played by the DoH. It explains motivation for government lies about destruction of passport records (prior to 1965), ...
Former Gov. Lingle never claimed that she personally saw Obama's birth certificate, her statements were based on Dr. Fukino's words.
Under Dr. Fukino's leadership Hawaii DoH refused to confirm that they issued COLB to Obama on June 6, 2007. I have personally asked them about it and they never replied.
Now it is your turn (you avoided answering this question in your first reply) - Does the Hawaii statute 338-18 (d) or any other law prevent the DoH from publishing the original birth registration index?
rslc.com
No DA would accept this investigation. It was not official and was not conducted by real law enforcement officers.
There is a proven history of bias and several prominent participants would in violation of Arizona conflict of interest laws if they were real LEO. Their credibility would no survive a second in a courtroom.
If you are going after the president of the united states then everything has to be perfect because you know there will be a firestorm. An investigation by a self selected group of citizen volunteers is far from perfect. Sheriff Joe needs to step up and conduct an official investigation with real Arizona peace officers.
The rest of the country very much disagrees with you. They have accepted the BC and Hawaii’s pronouncements.
I don’t have every answer to every minute detail but if you have to accept an elaborate conspiracy that encompasses the entire state of Hawaii, both national political parties and the entire US legal system then perhaps there is less to your theories then you think.
I suspect the DoH refuses to show you the index because they are tired of wasting time and money dealing with out of state birthers. They have a real job to do and dealing with irrational conspiracy theorists is not one of them.
Just a question, but “hospital-generated” birth certificate doesn’t make sense. The state dept of health or other government body generates the birth certificate, do they not? IIRR when my kids were born, somebody came by from the state and took the information from me (names etc). Here in FL they even tell you a hospital birth cert is not valid identification.
Harlan:”How can Sheriff Joe be a voice of credibility? Nothing he says will give credibility to Corsi or Farrah.”
Instead of gross generalizations, perhaps we should speak more in specifics.
Do you think the finding of Obama’s Selective Service forgery is compelling or do you think that Corsi and Farrah have illegitimized this finding in some way? I had personally never seen this mentioned previously by Corsi or Farrah.
Do you think the analysis of the PDF file from the White House is compelling? There is nothing that Corsi or Farrah could have done to taint the evidence since it is a file provided by the White House on the White House server. Have they somehow tampered with this digital evidence? Does their involvement make the evidence suspect? There have been many different sources that have investigated these files and as far as I know, the file can be duplicated in it’s exact “original” form such that even YOU could evaluate the veracity of the Posse’s findings.
Instead of harping on those who bring this evidence forward, perhaps you should spend more time either disproving the evidence (since you seem inclined to do so), or following the path of deception that leads to successive cover-ups.
That’s the problem with liars. They start by telling little “innocent” white lies like the first Obama BC that was posted back in 2008. Then they realize that people aren’t going to just let it die, so they have to pursue much grander lies and schemes to cover-up the initial lies. Pretty soon those lies become forgery and fraud and perjury.
I don’t know exactly what Obama is trying to cover up here (although there have been many speculations on these threads) but at this point, the cover-up may be the larger crime than what was initially covered up. The same was true of Bill Clinton and now seems to apply to Obama as well. These Democrats never learn...
I am not trying to accuse them of anything. I am AWARE of the situation that they are in. Any efforts on their part to hide information regarding birth certificates (and adoptions) are consistent with the requirements of their job.
They are between a rock and a hard place on this. The State Law says they cannot divulge any information regarding people's birth certificates, and they cannot divulge any information regarding adoptions.
In most ordinary states of affairs, this poses no problem. However, in the case of the Presidency, it pits the requirements of Hawaiian law, against the requirements of Constitutional law, and the Duty of each state to confirm credentials.
In reality, it isn't so much that Hawaii DOH is causing the problem, they are actually acting within the requirements of Hawaiian Law. The main problem is that those people who were supposed to enforce the CONSTITUTIONAL requirements (election officials in all the states) have failed to do their job, because they didn't require Original records to demonstrate compliance. (This has been a non-issue in the past, because for most candidates, there never were any suggestions that they were not born in the country of two American Parents.)
The Election officials of the States ought to have a right to know if they are looking at an actual ORIGINAL birth certificate, or a replacement one for an adopted child created by a court order. (Which at this point is a possibility)
Hawaiian privacy law (or any other state's privacy law) ought to be set aside in the instance of the Presidency.
You don't understand how it works.
An investigation is conducted by the grand jury.
The grand jury has broad investigative powers. Ariz. Rev. Stat. § 21-408. A. The county attorney or other prosecuting officer shall attend the grand jurors when requested by them, and may do so although not requested for the purpose of examining witnesses, in their presence, or of giving the grand jurors legal advice regarding any matter cognizable by them. He shall also, when requested by them, draft indictments and cause process to issue for the attendance of witnesses and other evidence. (emphasis added)
If you are going after the president of the united states then everything...
The issue is a private individual seeking ballot access. Identity documents publicly displayed by said individual appear to be fake. An investigation by a grand jury is called for.
Harlan:”The rest of the country very much disagrees with you. They have accepted the BC and Hawaii’s pronouncements.”
I beg to differ based on recent polls:
Sorry Obama: Lots Of Republicans Still Think You’re Not Even An American
http://www.sheriffin.com/article_read.php?idLink=2441872
You are third Obot apologist who failed to answer the question I posted on this thread. Your excuse is that you don't have an answer to every question. Will you stop ridiculing birthers? If you cannot answer a simple question, something is wrong with your argument.
There is no law preventing DoH to release the original birth index. Gov. Abercrombie said that torpedoing the birther controversy was his top priority (not second or third but first). Why did he stop talking - If Obama' birthplace story were true it would have been trivial for Abercrombie to fulfill his promise.
That is extraordinarily mature. I am impressed. A lot of people have suggested you are an Obot, but I have long argued against it. Your tagline, for example argues to the contrary. So do your postings on other issues. I have noticed that there are some people on your side of the issue who can and will be reasonable. (Sometime lurker comes to mind.)
It is my habit to present reasonableness against reasonableness and to present snark against snark. I much prefer civility.
"Arizona Revised Statutes - Title 21 Juries
Section 21-407 Duties of grand jurors
21-407. Duties of grand jurors
A. The grand jurors shall inquire into every offense which may be tried within the county which is presented to them by the county attorney or other prosecuting officer at the request of the county attorney, or by the attorney general as a special prosecutor appointed by the presiding judge of the superior court for the purpose of proceedings under section 21-408, subsection B, or section 38-344, and shall have access to all jails, public institutions, and public records."
No judge or DA is going to use Sheriff Joe's posse investigation as probable cause to go to a grand jury.
The Maricopa County County Attorney has his own investigators. I would imagine he could conduct his own investigation if he wanted to - I doubt he will.
There is no credible evidence that the documents are fake. The "investigation" was tainted - therefore the results are tainted too.
The governor is sick of birthers. Why can’t you see that? Nothing he says or does will end the craziness - you will simply pick fault with his reply or move on to the next argument.
You are right - there is no law preventing DoH from releasing the original birth index. He is simply ignoring you. Which proves nothing except he is ignoring you.
A lot of people have suggested you are an Obot, but I have long argued against it.
___________________________________
You posted this to El Sordo. What is your definition of an obot?
The common definition of an Obot is this : The word “Obot” came about mostly to describe a paid blogger.
But I don’t think you have to be paid to be an Obot.
Examples of obots:
http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/10575/whats-an-obot/
My definition of an Obot is anyone that spends most of their time on the internet defending Barry Hussein the homo Marxist. Now if I look at el sordo’s past posting history, for months all he has done is attack freepers and defend Barry on the BC issue. Therefore, he meets my definition of an Obot.
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