You are correct, thank you.
Posted on 09/21/2009 10:48:52 AM PDT by pissant
The divisions in America run deep at this moment in history, and the heated rhetoric is “ratcheted up” by the continual efforts to silence all voices of dissent, or label all dissenters “racists” no matter how unrelated to race or valid their complaints might be.
Still, when listening to millions of citizens showing up at town hall meetings and Tea Parties across the country, liberal Democrats see a bunch of racists. That’s what all leftists have been trained to see...
Take columnist and Fox News contributor Juan Williams for instance:
“These critics seem less interested in arguing about health care proposals than in building the case that Obama is not legitimately our national leader. - They charge Obama was not born in the United States, and therefore doesn't meet the requirements that all Presidents be native-born.” – said Williams
No Juan... These people don’t want to debate the alleged benefits of “socialized medicine” in a country where the Constitution grants the federal government NO authority on such a matter, and where FREEDOM (not government) has created the greatest nation on earth.
The issue over Barack Obama’s eligibility does NOT pertain to whether or not Barack is a “native born citizen,” but rather on the well-known FACT that he is NOT a “natural-born citizen,” and that the US Constitution clearly states that ONLY a “natural-born citizen” can be President of the United States.
To eliminate the confusion for Juan and others in his camp, “native-born” is a matter of where someone is born geographically, and “natural-born” is a matter of not only where one was born, but what his family lineage is and where his foreign loyalties rest.
There is NO debate over the fact that Obama is the “natural-born” son of a British citizen of Kenya. As such, Obama is a “natural-born” British subject and citizen of his father’s nation, Kenya. Even if he had navigated the naturalization process, becoming a “naturalized” citizen, he would not qualify for the office of president.
He claims to have been born in Hawaii, using “anchor baby” laws to support the notion that he qualifies. But even “anchor babies” are NOT “natural born citizens” for the reasons stated in the Law of Nations, at the foundation of Article II – Section I of our Constitution. They are “native-born,” thus the reason for Juan’s use of this term.
There is also NO honest debate over what the term “natural-born citizen” used by the original “birthers,” our Founding Fathers, meant, and even the US Senate was able to properly interpret the Law of Nations definition based upon Natural Law, regarding Senator John McCain last year.
But no! – Americans furious that a foreign global leader is sitting in their White House shoving anti-American policies down taxpayer throats for the benefit of leftist political power around the world, looks like a simple case of “racism” to Juan and Jimmy Carter. AMAZING!
“They make this argument even when all Hawaiian documents, officials and news stories of his birth conclusively prove he is an American.” - Williams
I honestly expect better than this. THREE COLB’s (which anyone from anywhere in the world can purchase in Hawaii) have been used as “proof” that Obama is a “natural born citizen.” NO other evidence has been offered and Obama has spent in excess of $1.5 million in legal fees to make certain that NO other evidence is ever seen. Thanks to taxpayers, he has the most powerful legal defense team in the world at his command in this effort, the Department of Justice.
1 Certified copy of original birth certificate
2 Columbia University transcripts
3 Columbia thesis paper
4 Campaign donor analysis requested by 7 major watchdog groups
5 Harvard University transcripts
6 Illinois State Senate records
7 Illinois State Senate schedule
8 Law practice client list and billing records/summary
9 Locations and names of all half-siblings and step-mother
10 Medical records (only the one page summary released so far)
11 Occidental College Transcripts
12 Parent’s marriage Certificate
13 Record of baptism
14 Selective Service registration records
15 Schedules for trips outside of the United States before 2007
16 Passport records for all passports
17 Scholarly articles
18 SAT and LSAT test scores
19 Access to his grandmother in Kenya
20 List of all campaign workers that are lobbyists
21 Punahou grade school records
22 Noelani Kindergarten records are oddly missing from the the State of Hawaii Department of Education.
Anyone who cares about their country would be very concerned that a POTUS had hidden every scrap of information of his life that he possibly could.
~~PING!
Liberal democrats view the Constitution as an impediment to progress. They will use bits and pieces if they need to, but the concept of concrete law is repulsive to them.
Still waiting for any relevant court decision or part of the Constitution that supports such a distinction. If it was so clear, Obama would have been challenged long ago. Right now, this seems to exist solely in the birther imagination.
Here is the problem I have with BHO COLB issue: It is a day late and a dollar short. We should have had this discussion BEFORE the election. According to the Constitution the only legal method to remove is a sitting POTUS is through the impeachment process. Since the Democrats overwhelmingly control Congress this will never happen. The Democrats will never even hold hearings on this subject to investigate whether or not there is any validity to it. Also as POTUS, BHO is CINC of the armed forces and appoints federal judges. Whether we like it or not, barring some unforseen event, BHO was elected POTUS and will serve a four year term, maybe two at most unless they pass a constitutional amendment allowing the president to serve more than two four year terms. Our energy and efforts should therefore be concentrated on changing control of Congress which is key. That is the ONLY way I know to stop and and slow down BHO’s ruinous path towards socialism. At least the only constitutional and legal way.
You haven’t read much of Donofrio’s research then. At best, it is an open question.
“FREE THE LONG FORM!”
From Leo Donofrio’s website http://naturalborncitizen.wordpress.com/
” Obama’s father was never a US citizen and was never permanently domiciled in the US. The leading Supreme Court decision in Wong Kim Ark indicates that the native born son of an alien is not natural born. There is no conspiracy theory attached to this question. Let’s state it another way:
Can a person who is at birth a dual citizen be considered a natural born citizen for purposes of meeting the Constitution’s requirements to be POTUS?
That is in no way a conspiracy theory. The US State department web site - now run by Obama – tells us that dual citizens owe allegiance to both nations and that while on the soil of the foreign nation that nation has a greater claim to the person than the US. It is certainly not trivial for US citizens to ask whether dual citizenship at birth means a person is not a “natural born citizen” of the US.”
Recommend you read both Leo’s website from front to back, top to bottom and the Wonk Kim Ark decision at http://www.law.cornell.edu/supct/html/historics/USSC_CR_0169_0649_ZO.html.
IF Obama is not qualified to serve as President, the 20th Ammendment applies. He’d be removed by a ruling from the Supreme Court. Biden serves as acting POTUS until a new POTUS can be determined.
It helps to weaken him so he doesn’t get more of his Marxist agenda approved.....hopefully. Also, if enough states get laws approved to prove that each of the 3 qualifications for presidency are met in order to be on their presidential ballot for 2012 it might be check mate.
Nowhere in the decision is this distinction made.
OK Fine. And does the SCOTUS have the cojones to take this up? Of course not! No one with authority wants to touch this with a ten foot pole. They even belittle the “birther” movement (their words not mine) and put in the same category as the 9/11 “truthers” nut jobs.
INTREP
Dear Kleon,
Assuming you are a male, have you ever been married or in a relationship? If so, like most men, you have probably gotten into an argument with the woman in your life. If so, you have probably encountered that peculiar thing they sometimes do where there are two realitys. One is the real world we all live in, and the other reality is the thing they wish to believe in, and in which no amount of rational argument is going to change. In fact, the more you introduce “facts” into the argument, the worse it gets.
Arguing with birthers is often like that. In their “reality” Obama just isn’t an American PERIOD. Nothing you can say is going to change their mind. If the long form birth certificate came out, that would not change their mind. If you rounded up the hospital staff and found ten people who remember it, they would have an answer.
That being said, it is good sometimes to see if you can convert a few of the less entrenched birthers to the truth. It will make conservatives look less stupid in the long run.
parsy, who says good luck
IF it is PROVEN that Obama is inelligible to serve as POTUS
and
IF Obama doesn’t resign immediately to avoid further disgrace
and
IF Biden doesn’t have Obama escorted out of office by the military
and
IF the SCOTUS refuses to take it up
and
If Congress does not impeach, then remove Obama
and
If it appears that the military will not enforce the Constitution
Then
The Second Ammendment will be applied, as there will be no other recourse in which to defend the Constitution. Since Obama has ticked off the police, the CIA and the military, I suspect that the restoration of the Constitution will be quick.
Please note there is a LOT of recourse before the final step is necessary.
It is also a Fact that Barry Sr. was a Kenyan Subject at the time of Jr.s birth. Oh, yes - and this is by Jr's own admission in hiss book “Dreams of my Father”.
However, if Barry Zero can pull a Rabbit out of his hat and produce a birth cert. (a REAL birth Cert.) that says mom and dad were US CITIZENS, and that he was born on US Soil, The issue is then over.
In God we trust - all others bring Data (W. Edwards Demming)
I don’t think anything will ever be proven to our satisfaction because BHO will never release anything. Since the Congress, and the SCOTUS, and the military will do nothing this brings us to the Second Amendment scenario which I also respectfully doubt will ever happen.
It would be a lot easier to throw the bums out of Congress next year then focus on 2012.
This statement alone shows the absolute 100% stupidity and brainwashing that goes on with this debate.
Could Juan please fill all of us uninformed Americans on this CONCLUSIVE information that Hawaii has released:
What is the citizenship of both of his parents that is listed on his birth certificate?
What hospital was he born in?
That's true only if the POTUS validly holds the office. If 0bama is not a natural-born citizen as required by the constitution then he is a usurper and does not and never has validly held the office of POTUS.
OK then. Who with any authority is going to challenge BHO to produce a valid COLB? My point is this: No one has the guts to do this. Look what happened to poor ol Joe Wilson when he had the audacity to tell the truth about BHO. BHO is holding all the cards right now. He is the POTUS. His party has overwhelming margins in the Congress. He appoints judges, he controls the military. The media worships the ground he walks on.
At least if we took back Congress next year, we would have a better hand. Right now we have no cards to play with.
I agree that BHO will never willingly release anything.
Thus the reason for the court case to force BHO to release applicable documentation.
If the court case dies on a technicality, then the Constitution is cheapened and we’d better focus on who is counting the votes in 2012 as well as who is running.
He has. He has produced a COLB. There has been little or no evidence to the contrary. At present, Orly has an affidavit and another fake birth certificate in the record, so we are in the la-la land of evidence. There’s some on file,but its worthless IMHO.
This has been the birther problem since the beginning. Pretty much all they have are suspicions. You might find these relevant:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xes0F36eTJA&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7_DEtfvv9MU
parsy, who says just substitute Orly’s face for the ones in the video, and you have the birther movement
LOL.
That COLB is nothing more than butt-wipe. I could get a COLB from Hawaii if I wanted to stating that, Yes, I was in fact born - that’s all that the COLB produced by Obama indicates. Yes, he was in fact born. So what? The COLB does not indicate his parents citizenship - which is the crux of the matter.
Do some real analysis and get a clue.
Why don’t you get one stating that you were born in Hawaii then? That would be relevant and some pretty good evidence that the COLB is fishy.
parsy, who is really curious if you can do it
And why then does Barry Zero continue to obstruct and redirect legitimate inquiry, Hmmmmmmm?
Maybe he likes watching you birthers run around in circles led by Madame Orly. I have to admit, it does have a certain sadistic charm to it.
parsy, who is ashamed of himself
Call me a skeptic.
In God we trust - all others bring Data - and Barry Zero has produced Zero vis Data.
Fact.
Dispute that.
I don’t dispute that you are a skeptic.
parsy, who is happy with the COLB
Nice - do you also not dispute that he’s provided ZERO for data?
And if you do dispute that he’s provided no data, what data then has he provided/produced? Hmmmmmmm?
Obama has provided his COLB. You guys just don’t want to believe it. That’s your problem, not his. Get some GOOD evidence and you might have a case.
parsy, who asks when are you birthers ever going to learn?
LOL!
that COLB has been proved to be a poor excuse for a forgery. That’s just too funny for words!
It has not been “PROVED” to be any such thing. Last I saw, some guy dissected an online image of it, but it is still a good document IMHO.
parsy, who does not believe aliens crashed at Roswell.
LOL! No, not LOL.
ROTFLMAO!
Do you need a “relevant court decision” to tell you how to wipe your ass as well?
Umm, we did, either the issue was not ripe, or no one had standing.
According to the Constitution the only legal method to remove is a sitting POTUS is through the impeachment process.
Not eligible would meant NOT POTUS. Impeachment is for Presidents, not ineligible usurpers. For them, it's go peaceably, or do the perp walk.
Citizenship of the parents is not shown on the Hawaii long form Birth Certificate of 1961. Their birthplace is however. But the BC also serves as legal proof of who the parents were. Thus if the BC says "Barrack H. Obama" born in Kenya, then that is not proof that his father was not a US Citizen, but it's one step away from it. That step involves entry and exit records and/or visa records.
You are correct, thank you.
OK then, find me someone with the authority to call BHO out on this issue. My contention is no one that I am aware of has the cojones to do this. Look what happened to Cong. Joe Wilson simply for telling the truth that BHO is a liar.
While you may still be proved correct, there are several ongoing court cases on the subject.
The one that is most immediate is "Barret et. al. vs Obama et. al., in the US District Court for the Central District of California, Judge David Carter. (USMC ret, medical for wounds received at Khe Sanh, Republic of Vietnam). DoJ (representing Obama et. al.) has a motion to dismiss pending, due to be ruled on Oct. 5. Plaintiffs have already turned in their responses (two different lawyers representing different parts of the et. al.) DoJ's response to that is due next Monday. Trial is currently set for January, and if the motion to dismiss is not granted, full discovery will start shortly after Oct. 5.
It would be nice to see a federal judge with the guts to pursue this matter but I am not holding my breath on this or investing any emotional capital on it. Right now, unfortunately, B-HOE is holding ALL of the cards: He is the POTUS, he is CINC of the armed forces, he appoints all federal judges, his party has overwhelming majorities in Congress. Our best chances in slowing down his radical agenda remains taking back the Congress in next year’s midterm elections. And btw, I happen to think it will take far more than a single federal judge in CA to remove the POTUS. I think it would take the SCOTUS to rule that B-HOE is ineligible.
Oh I forgot to mention another card B-HOE holds in his hand is the slavish devotion of the MSM which routinely dismisses those of us who question the messiah’s background and qualifications as kooks on the fringe.
While that's likely true, although if "discovery produces proof that he is not native born, which means he can't be natural born, the pressure will run the other way, that is for him to leave *before* the Supreme Court does it's thang. At that point he would not be able to *count* on the military, who at best (for him) would just sit things out. He appoints judges, but can't remove those already seated, although Congress could.
Who with any authority is going to challenge BHO
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
We the people have the authority.
2 million people showed up in Washington, D.C., on 9/12. If they wanted they could peacefully shut down the city any time they wanted.
Sure wish they would!
Welcome2thejungle : Since 2008-11-07 ( Just when Berg’s case was before the Supreme Court)
And? I have been a movement conservative since RR first ran for president in 1976.
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