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Who is/were your top GOP candidates, in order? (VANITY)
Self ^ | April 29, 2016 | Self

Posted on 04/29/2016 8:27:40 PM PDT by pogo101

Who, with the benefit of hindsight, were your preferences for the GOP nomination, in order?

And if you feel like adding it, whom did you #1 prefer in 2008 and 2012?


TOPICS: Chit/Chat
KEYWORDS: cruz; election; rubio; trump; vanity
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To: RedWulf

I don’t blame them for staying home. Frankly, they acted more responsibly than I did by holding my nose and voting for the bastard.


41 posted on 04/29/2016 9:10:42 PM PDT by perfect_rovian_storm
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To: RedWulf

Come, now: We have to take into account that a President Obama will appoint young Sotomayors who will serve on the federal courts for 40 years. FORTY YEARS. Not four, not eight. FORTY. When that is properly weighed in the balance, one must forgive a LOT of less-than-perfect conservative-candidate failings. Those, we can correct in far less then 40 years. Judge appointments, not so much.


42 posted on 04/29/2016 9:13:40 PM PDT by pogo101
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To: pogo101

Romney has appointed and would appoint people who were just as bad. His history shows it. It would be even worse, because those people would get the ‘conservative’ stamp by default and then where are we? Kinda the same screwed place we’re in now, but slightly more screwed, I guess.


43 posted on 04/29/2016 9:15:55 PM PDT by perfect_rovian_storm
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To: pogo101

Initially, Scott Walker.

Now Trump.


44 posted on 04/29/2016 9:16:27 PM PDT by kaehurowing
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To: pogo101

Trump, Cruz, Perry, Jindal and Walker.

We liked Jindal for his ideas, but neither of us thought he was electable.
Walker surprised us how weak he was in the first debate.
Perry looked out of his league. Wife wondered why he went to glasses.
Liked Cruz for his knowledge and debate skills, but the wife first pegged him for a serious liar and his proposals were too over the top; nothing but red meat.

Trump just started to grow on us pretty quickly


45 posted on 04/29/2016 9:20:37 PM PDT by MaxistheBest
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To: RedWulf

I railed against him for a decade, so there was nothing on earth that would’ve compelled me to vote for him. I made it plain if that pathological liar and leftist fraudster/Democrat agent/ringer was foisted down our throats, I was off the HMS Titanic. I voted for Congressman Virgil Goode, one of only two Conservatives on the ballot for President (FR’s own EternalVigilance, Mr. Tom Hoefling, was the other).


46 posted on 04/29/2016 9:21:33 PM PDT by fieldmarshaldj (Resist We Much)
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To: pogo101

2008: Fred Thompson

2012: Perry or Santorum

Ironically, the last candidate I got really excited about was Colin Powell. But of course that never went anywhere, and then he went downhill personally. Powell would have destroyed Billy Clinton though.


47 posted on 04/29/2016 9:22:39 PM PDT by kaehurowing
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To: kaehurowing

Powell would have been great, yes .. had he actually turned out to have been remotely conservative.

Not your fault. He lied about what he believed to get ahead.


48 posted on 04/29/2016 9:24:58 PM PDT by pogo101
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To: pogo101

Willard appointed horrible leftists to the bench in Massachusetts. One of whom released a deranged lunatic who went and promptly brutally slaughtered a young couple, Brian and Beverly Mauck. When told of his handiwork, Willard was more indignant that it might make him look bad rather than expressing concern about the murdered couple (during his farce of a Presidential campaign in 2007).

BTW, he met with said judicial applicant for all of a few minutes (which close scrutiny of her record would’ve stopped her appointment), Willard had more pressing business to tend to. What was that ? He had a lunch reservation at Ruth’s Chris Steakhouse.


49 posted on 04/29/2016 9:28:20 PM PDT by fieldmarshaldj (Resist We Much)
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To: pogo101
Interesting thread and responses.

Walker very early.

Drifted to Cruz/Trump, but looking hard at Rand Paul and glancing at Rubio.

Then hardcore Trump and haven't wavered.

50 posted on 04/29/2016 9:31:19 PM PDT by TontoKowalski (You can call me "Dick.")
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To: kaehurowing

Powell would’ve been an epic fiasco. The GOP may have promoted him, but he was a racist Socialist to the core. I remember being in Washington, DC just days before he made his announcement he wasn’t running (in 1995). I happened to be riding in a cab when the driver, who was Black, gave me an earful about Powell being a dangerous fraud (the cabbie was not a leftist). I thought the cabbie was being a bit paranoid, but everything he said about “Colon” was 100% dead on the money.


51 posted on 04/29/2016 9:31:52 PM PDT by fieldmarshaldj (Resist We Much)
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To: fieldmarshaldj

YOu’re not wrong about Romney’s judicial appointments, but have you read the constitution of that state? It lets a (leftist, in modern times) council approve all judicial appointments. Sure, ideally Romney would have nominated only conservatives; that’s what I hope I would have done. But a conservative might also have chosen, rationally, to have nominated “slightly less liberal” judges. I can at least nod my head to that approach, even if I don’t agree.


52 posted on 04/29/2016 9:36:37 PM PDT by pogo101
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To: pogo101

He had zero interest in pursuing a Conservative agenda in that state. If he had, he would’ve gone off script. He could’ve held as firm as possible and said no to the leftist misadventures, but he didn’t, because he was a firm believer in them. It was the Supreme Judicial Court on his watch that got the ball rolling for sodomite “marriage”, which had no legal basis under any reasonable reading of any state (or the federal) constitution. It was Willard who rolled out the Socialist plan for gubmint healthcare (and cheap abortions) and who yukked it up with Ted Kennedy and the other Bay State Baboons, the very plan that was the template for Zero’s federal (and blatantly unconstitutional) boondoggle.

I mean, hey, with RINO Socialist cretins like this, who needs Democrats ? The latter couldn’t have gotten their agenda across more quickly and smoother with one of their own openly serving as a Democrat as they could with a fake Republican pushing it all through.

Like I said, there was nothing under the sun that could’ve made me vote for that destructive, lying Socialist fraud.

And as an addendum, if by some unholy act he had ended up in the White House, what you would’ve had left in the way of Republican officeholders would’ve resembled something along the lines of after the 1958 and 1964 elections (1/3rd of Congress was GOP in those days, and many of them were leftists).


53 posted on 04/29/2016 9:45:40 PM PDT by fieldmarshaldj (Resist We Much)
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To: pogo101

IMHO, one of the worst things we do (and I’ve been guilty of it myself) is to make excuses for these guys. We rationalize and excuse away so many obvious red flags, because we want to support our ‘team’.

It’s a fool’s errand.


54 posted on 04/29/2016 9:48:51 PM PDT by perfect_rovian_storm
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To: fieldmarshaldj

I totally agree with you that Romney should have said to the council, Eff You, I’m nominating ONLY these strong constitutionalists, boom boom boom, reject them if you like. Totally agree. Let the judicial seats go empty rather than be sat upon by leftists. I agree. I still preferred Romney to Term Two of Obama.


55 posted on 04/29/2016 9:49:21 PM PDT by pogo101
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To: pogo101
Trump
Walker
Cruz
Carson
Paul

Those are all guys I could have supported without much angst. The following are the bad/weak candidates from bad to worst.

Santorum
Christie
Huckabee
Rubio
Carly
Graham

Christie, Santorum and Huckabee are unelectable, but they have their good points, but knowing they couldn't win ruled them out. Graham would be the worst of the worst this time around. Utterly evil. Carly and Rubio aren't much better.

56 posted on 04/29/2016 9:49:55 PM PDT by MaxFlint
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To: pogo101

1. Cruz
2. Cruz...


57 posted on 04/29/2016 10:04:28 PM PDT by rbbeachkid (Get out of its way and small business can fix the economy.)
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To: rbbeachkid

Note the reference to Natural Law in the first sentence of our Declaration of Independence.

It is crystal clear that the Founding Fathers used the Natural Law definition of 'natural born Citizen' when they wrote Article II. By invoking "The Laws of Nature and Nature's God" the 56 signers of the Declaration incorporated a legal standard of freedom into the forms of government that would follow.

President John Quincy Adams, writing in 1839, looked back at the founding period and recognized the true meaning of the Declaration's reliance on the "Laws of Nature and of Nature's God." He observed that the American people's "charter was the Declaration of Independence. Their rights, the natural rights of mankind. Their government, such as should be instituted by the people, under the solemn mutual pledges of perpetual union, founded on the self-evident truth's proclaimed in the Declaration."

The Constitution, Vattel, and “Natural Born Citizen”: What Our Framers Knew

The Laws of Nature and of Nature's God: The True Foundation of American Law

The Supreme Court of the United States has never applied the term “natural born citizen” to any other category than “those born in the country of parents who are citizens thereof”.

MINOR V. HAPPERSETT IS BINDING PRECEDENT AS TO THE CONSTITUTIONAL DEFINITION OF A NATURAL BORN CITIZEN.

Neither the 14th Amendment nor Wong Kim Ark make one a Natural Born Citizen

The Harvard Law Review Article Taken Apart Piece by Piece and Utterly Destroyed

Citizenship Terms Used in the U.S. Constitution - The 5 Terms Defined & Some Legal Reference to Same

"The citizenship of no man could be previous to the declaration of independence, and, as a natural right, belongs to none but those who have been born of citizens since the 4th of July, 1776."....David Ramsay, 1789.

A Dissertation on Manner of Acquiring Character & Privileges of Citizen of U.S.-by David Ramsay-1789

The Law of Nations or the Principles of Natural Law (1758)

The Laws of Nature and of Nature's God: The True Foundation of American Law

Publications of the Colonial Society of Massachusetts, Volume 20 - Use of The Law of Nations by the Constitutional Convention

The Biggest Cover-up in American History

Supreme Court cases that cite “natural born Citizen” as one born on U.S. soil to citizen parents:

The Venus, 12 U.S. 8 Cranch 253 253 (1814)

Vattel, who, though not very full to this point, is more explicit and more satisfactory on it than any other whose work has fallen into my hands, says: “The citizens are the members of the civil society; bound to this society by certain duties, and subject to its authority, they equally participate in its advantages. The natives or indigenes are those born in the country of parents who are citizens. Society not being able to subsist and to perpetuate itself but by the children of the citizens, those children naturally follow the condition of their fathers, and succeed to all their rights.

Shanks v. Dupont, 28 U.S. 3 Pet. 242 242 (1830)

Ann Scott was born in South Carolina before the American revolution, and her father adhered to the American cause and remained and was at his death a citizen of South Carolina. There is no dispute that his daughter Ann, at the time of the Revolution and afterwards, remained in South Carolina until December, 1782. Whether she was of age during this time does not appear. If she was, then her birth and residence might be deemed to constitute her by election a citizen of South Carolina. If she was not of age, then she might well be deemed under the circumstances of this case to hold the citizenship of her father, for children born in a country, continuing while under age in the family of the father, partake of his national character as a citizen of that country. Her citizenship, then, being prima facie established, and indeed this is admitted in the pleadings, has it ever been lost, or was it lost before the death of her father, so that the estate in question was, upon the descent cast, incapable of vesting in her? Upon the facts stated, it appears to us that it was not lost and that she was capable of taking it at the time of the descent cast.

Dred Scott v. Sandford, 60 U.S. 393 (1857)

The citizens are the members of the civil society; bound to this society by certain duties, and subject to its authority, they equally participate in its advantages. The natives, or natural-born citizens, are those born in the country, of parents who are citizens. As society cannot perpetuate itself otherwise than by the children of the citizens, those children naturally follow the condition of their parents, and succeed to all their rights.' Again: 'I say, to be of the country, it is necessary to be born of a person who is a citizen; for if he be born there of a foreigner, it will be only the place of his birth, and not his country. . . .

Minor v. Happersett , 88 U.S. 162 (1875)

The Constitution does not in words say who shall be natural-born citizens. Resort must be had elsewhere to ascertain that. At common law, with the nomenclature of which the framers of the Constitution were familiar, it was never doubted that all children born in a country of parents who were its citizens became themselves, upon their birth, citizens also. These were natives or natural-born citizens, as distinguished from aliens or foreigners. Some authorities go further and include as citizens children born within the jurisdiction without reference to the citizenship of their parents. As to this class there have been doubts, but never as to the first.

United States v. Wong Kim Ark, 169 U.S. 649 (1898)

At common law, with the nomenclature of which the framers of the Constitution were familiar, it was never doubted that all children, born in a country of parents who were its citizens, became themselves, upon their birth, citizens also. These were natives, or natural-born citizens, as distinguished from aliens or foreigners.

Perkins v. Elg, 307 U.S. 325 (1939),

Was a decision by the Supreme Court of the United States that a child born in the United States to naturalized parents on U.S. soil is a natural born citizen and that the child's natural born citizenship is not lost if the child is taken to and raised in the country of the parents' origin, provided that upon attaining the age of majority, the child elects to retain U.S. citizenship "and to return to the United States to assume its duties." Not only did the court rule that she did not lose her native born Citizenship but it upheld the lower courts decision that she is a "natural born Citizen of the United States" because she was born in the USA to two naturalized U.S. Citizens.

But the Secretary of State, according to the allegation of the bill of complaint, had refused to issue a passport to Miss Elg 'solely on the ground that she had lost her native born American citizenship.' The court below, properly recognizing the existence of an actual controversy with the defendants [307 U.S. 325, 350] (Aetna Life Ins. Co. v. Haworth, 300 U.S. 227 , 57 S.Ct. 461, 108 A.L.R. 1000), declared Miss Elg 'to be a natural born citizen of the United States' (99 F.2d 414) and we think that the decree should include the Secretary of State as well as the other defendants. The decree in that sense would in no way interfere with the exercise of the Secretary's discretion with respect to the issue of a passport but would simply preclude the denial of a passport on the sole ground that Miss Elg had lost her American citizenship."

The Supreme Court of the United States has never applied the term “natural born citizen” to any other category than “those born in the country of parents who are citizens thereof”.

Citizenship Terms Used in the U.S. Constitution - The 5 Terms Defined & Some Legal Reference to Same

"The citizenship of no man could be previous to the declaration of independence, and, as a natural right, belongs to none but those who have been born of citizens since the 4th of July, 1776."....David Ramsay, 1789.

A Dissertation on Manner of Acquiring Character & Privileges of Citizen of U.S.-by David Ramsay-1789

The Law of Nations or the Principles of Natural Law (1758)

The Laws of Nature and of Nature's God: The True Foundation of American Law

Publications of the Colonial Society of Massachusetts, Volume 20 - Use of The Law of Nations by the Constitutional Convention

The Biggest Cover-up in American History

If there is extensive law written that covers election fraud, but it is impossible to enforce, or if a sufficient number of people agree that So-and-So is the President or Pope despite the law, how does that not utterly, completely destroy the entire notion of the Rule of Law itself? As I have said for years with regards to Obama, if you can’t enforce Article II Section 1 Clause 5 of the Constitution, what can you enforce? Can you enforce the border? Can you enforce citizenship? Equal protection? Search and seizure? Right to bear arms? Can you enforce the law against treason? Theft? Murder? Trafficking in body parts? Religious persecution?

Mark Levin Attacks Birthers: Admits He Hasn't Studied Issue; Declares Canadian-Born Cruz Eligible

Not much information exists on why the Third Congress (under the lead of James Madison and the approval of George Washington) deleted "natural born" from the Naturalization Act of 1790 when it passed the Naturalization Act of 1795. There is virtually no information on the subject because they probably realized that the First Congress committed errors when it passed the Naturalization Act of 1790 and did not want to create a record of the errors.

It can be reasonably argued that Congress realized that under Article I, Section 8 of the Constitution, Congress is given the power to make uniform laws on naturalization and that this power did not include the power to decide who is included or excluded from being a presidential Article II "natural born Citizen." While Congress has passed throughout United States history many statutes declaring who shall be considered nationals and citizens of the United States at birth and thereby exempting such persons from having to be naturalized under naturalization laws, at no time except by way of the short-lived "natural born" phrase in Naturalization Act of 1790 did it ever declare these persons to be "natural born Citizens."

The uniform definition of "natural born Citizen" was already provided by the law of nations and was already settled. The Framers therefore saw no need nor did they give Congress the power to tinker with that definition. Believing that Congress was highly vulnerable to foreign influence and intrigue, the Framers, who wanted to keep such influence out of the presidency, did not trust Congress when it came to who would be President, and would not have given Congress the power to decide who shall be President by allowing it to define what an Article II "natural born Citizen " is.

Additionally, the 1790 act was a naturalization act. How could a naturalization act make anyone an Article II "natural born Citizen?" After all, a "natural born Citizen" was made by nature at the time of birth and could not be so made by any law of man.

Natural Born Citizen Through the Eyes of Early Congresses

Harvard Law Review Article FAILS to Establish Ted Cruz as Natural Born Citizen

Watch: Mark Levin declares Ted Cruz a "Naturalized Citizen"

Mark Levin Attacks Birthers: Admits He Hasn't Studied Issue; Declares Canadian-Born Cruz Eligible

The settled law of the land is that the US President must be a natural born citizen, and that to be a natural born citizen, you must have been born in the United States to parents both of whom were US citizens when you were born.

You may disagree with the goal of the Constitutional Convention, and/or with the means they chose to achieve it. But it's not a technicality, not an anachronism no longer relevant in modern times, nor is it racist. Especially in modern times, it enables persons of any race or ethnic heritage to become President. And it's what the Constitution requires.

You may also disagree with binding precedent regarding the meaning of "natural born citizen" as established in Minor. But in our system, the Constitution, and the Supreme Court's interpretation of it, are the "supreme law of the land." And if one faction gets to disregard the Constitution and/or the Supreme Court because they disagree, then that sets a precedent where all other factions can do the same.

Any Argument Against the Natural Law Definition of "Natural Born Citizen" Can easily be Defeated Here

58 posted on 04/29/2016 10:07:12 PM PDT by Godebert (CRUZ: Born in a foreign land to a foreign father.)
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To: perfect_rovian_storm
IMHO, one of the worst things we do (and I’ve been guilty of it myself) is to make excuses for these guys. We rationalize and excuse away so many obvious red flags, because we want to support our ‘team’

I think there is some truth to this. My poltical "independence" began on election day 2012. In that booth, in that moment, I just could not put the X by Romney's name. I left the top line of the ballot blank.

It really wasn't much of an act of courage. I live in a solid red state. But I didn't want to add one more number to his vote total.

Perhaps it is because I've marked the R down the whole ballot for so long, but it was a liberating experience. To say, "I'm not putting up with this crap any more."

I have found that my views DON'T match up with Republican orthodoxy 100%. I'm pro-life, but I'm not going to forgo a "with exceptions" provision any more than I'd refuse to save 1 drowning man because I couldn't save 2.

I'm pro-police, but I think there are enough problems with the criminal justice system that we ought to hit the pause button on the death penalty.

I am a veteran, but I am beyond tired of the neocons keeping our sons at war constantly. I'd send mine to Canada before I'd let him be drafted to die for Bill Kristol.

I've always felt that wide-open free trade was an inviolable part of conservatism, but I only thought that because "conservatives" told me to. I hadn't really thought about it. I cheered when NAFTA passed, but no more.

Anyway, as my own views have evolved, I still find that I fit as a Republican, but they're going to have to work to keep my vote.

I don't think Trump is perfect. I'm voting for him with my eyes open. I think he's the best shot we've got.

59 posted on 04/29/2016 10:12:52 PM PDT by TontoKowalski (You can call me "Dick.")
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To: pogo101

In the earliest stage I was most interested in Walker and Cruz. I’ll admit Rand Paul also piqued my interest.

A short time later, Trump completely blew me away and now I am solidly in his court.

In previous races, I liked Duncan Hunter and Fred Thompson.


60 posted on 04/29/2016 10:17:48 PM PDT by adaven
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