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My Answer to a Question My Daughter-in-Law Asked: What Can Done to Reduce Gun Violence

Posted on 01/18/2013 4:36:29 AM PST by ducttape45

My daughter-in-law asked me a question today. She asked me:

So I'm curious- COMPLETELY disregarding Obama, terrorism, muslims, etc- what do you think would be a solid solution to reduce gun violence?

This is my answer. It's long, but I hope you take the time to read it.

This is going to be a very difficult question to answer, mainly because there are no simple answers. But one thing is certain: guns, and the availability of them, are not the problem. I’m going to reach into the Bible tonight because the only answer(s) I can give you are found in the scriptures and nowhere else.

The problems with guns, and all forms of violence, all boils down to one inescapable truth: Man has a sin problem. Now before everyone says “oh there he goes again” please read what I have to say.

There are many passages in the Bible that talk about the condition of a man’s heart.

Proverbs 12:20, “Deceit is in the heart of them that imagine evil: but to the counsellors of peace is joy.”

Ecclesiastes 9:3, “This is an evil among all things that are done under the sun, that there is one event unto all: yea, also the heart of the sons of men is full of evil, and madness is in their heart while they live, and after that they go to the dead.”

Jeremiah 17:9, “The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?”

Jeremiah 23:26, “How long shall this be in the heart of the prophets that prophesy lies? yea, they are prophets of the deceit of their own heart”

Matthew 12:35, “A good man out of the good treasure of the heart bringeth forth good things: and an evil man out of the evil treasure bringeth forth evil things.”

Matthew 15:18, “But those things which proceed out of the mouth come forth from the heart; and they defile the man.”

Matthew 15:19, “For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies”

Mark 7:21, “For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders”

Luke 6:45, “A good man out of the good treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is good; and an evil man out of the evil treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is evil: for of the abundance of the heart his mouth speaketh.”

You’re all probably asking yourselves, “Why is he bringing this up?” I’ll tell you. The founders of our nation built the Constitution upon one immutable principle, “A free people cannot survive under a representative republican constitution unless they remain virtuous and morally strong.” They also maintained that “without religion the government of a free people cannot be maintained.”

Up until the early 1960’s these principles were maintained. Sure, there were, and are going to be, people who did not follow biblical teachings, but on the whole the society was maintained at a level of morality and spirituality that was in keeping with basic Judeo/Christian values, and that in turn kept society strong and vibrant.

However, in the 1960’s all that changed.

1. In 1963 Madalyn Murray O’Hair brought a lawsuit that was called “Murray vs Curlett” which led to the end of Bible reading in American public schools. God got kicked out of school.

2. The legalization of abortion in 1973 has led to the deaths of nearly 50,000,000 children.

3. Pluralism and tolerance for anti and non-Christian religions, teachings and institutions have reared a generation who do not hold to the teachings of the Bible regarding salvation, holiness, love of their fellow man, intolerance towards evil, the concept of hell and a future judgment of man’s souls.

4. Teaching that everyone is right in their own eyes and using a Bible passage out of context “judge not lest you be judged” have given us a culture that would tolerate even someone like Adolph Hitler and Joseph Stalin, two people who killed millions of innocent men, women and children to further their socialistic agendas. (Communism killed over 500,000,000 million people in the 20th century alone)

Since the 1960’s a generation of people have arisen who “know not the Lord.” 2nd Thessalonians 2:1-4 says;

“Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him, That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand. Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.”

The falling away spoken of in this passage directly correlates to Matthew 24:24-25 where it says, “For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect. Behold, I have told you before.”

That falling away has manifested itself, today, in a generation of people characterized by the following passage from the Book to the Romans, 1:18-32. It says:

"For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness; Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.

For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools, And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.

Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves: Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen. For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet. And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient; Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers, Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful: Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.”

Now notice what it says. They did not “retain God in their knowledge.” Think of it this way. They chose not to acknowledge God. It was not because they could not, but because they were displeased with God, and chose to forsake him, and follow their own passions and lusts. This was the true source of their crimes.

Now we can start to arrive to an answer to Kayla’s question. “What do you think would be a solid solution to reduce gun violence?” With the class of people described in the passage above, there is not a single thing that can be done. These kind of people are “full of unrighteousness, wickedness, murders, inventors of evil things……” These are the people of today (granted, this doesn’t apply to everyone of course, but the ruling elite to be sure and many others). These are the people who rule this nation right now, and many others around the globe. Without the restraining influence of the Spirit of God in their lives, which came about because God was taken out of the schools and immorality was allowed into the vacuum that resulted, this country is now led by a class of citizens who have no real regard the well-being of the people they govern.

Oh, to be sure, there are people who do not fall into this group. There are many, thankfully like you kids and many of our friends and family here on Facebook, who still have a knowledge of God and sensitivity to His Spirit and who have not chosen to completely disregard Him, and to those belong the salvation of the nation if they so chose to rise up and bring about the right kind of societal change. But you see the problem?

Unless the condition of the heart is changed, there is no gun law in the world that will stop someone from killing another human being with it, or by any other means for that matter. So for politicians, college professors, liberal elitists in the media, and so on who say that guns are the problem, they are completely wrong!

The problem is the human heart. Remember what Mark 7:21 said above? “For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders.” It’s what is within a man’s heart, his soul, his very being, that commits the crime, not the instrument he chooses to do so with. You solve the “heart problem” and you arrive at the answer to your question.

And there is only one true solution to the problem of the heart. If there were others then this nation wouldn’t be in the mess it’s in now. But since all the others failed, that is proof enough that they don’t work, no matter how much it is argued otherwise. In Matthew 22:36-40 it reads as follows:

“Master, which is the great commandment in the law? Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

Notice the words “love the Lord thy God with all thy heart.” The word “thy” is singular. Jesus is speaking directly to the individual. And the word “love” is from the Greek word “agapao.” It’s where we get our word “agape” which by translation means “love that is affectionate, benevolent.” If the people in this nation once again had this type of love in their hearts, there would be no need for gun laws. That would be the solution. That would be the answer to your question.

Do I personally expect that type of heart change happen? No, I don’t. Can it happen? Yes, it can. One only has to read the Book of Jonah to understand that. Jonah, a prophet of God from Israel, was told in Jonah 1:2, “Arise, go to Nineveh, that great city, and cry against it; for their wickedness is come up before me.”

He chose instead to head off in completely the other direction, hundreds of miles in the other direction! He said to himself, “there’s no way I’m going to go there.” You see, he hated the Ninevites because of the cruelty by which they plundered Israel and murdered its people. They were a truly despicable, evil people. But we know that God caused him to be swallowed by a great fish and taken to Nineveh, the hard way.

When he got there, and the fish vomited him upon the land, you can imagine the local folks went wild with fear and bewilderment. And for a city that was so huge that it took 3 whole days to go through it, that’s a lot of people to get excited. So when Jonah finally preached his message, “Yet forty days, and Nineveh will be overthrown” they believed him. Everyone from the king down to the stable animals wore sackcloth and sat in ashes in repentence. Jonah 3:10 says, “And God saw their works, that they turned from their evil way; and God repented of the evil, that he had said that he would do unto them; and he did it not.”

So, can that happen here, can the heart of men and women in the USA be changed, and thereby solve not only the gun problem but all sorts of violent crimes, yes, but only if the condition of the heart is cured by the only means that can truly remedy the problem; sin, and that remedy is in the person of Jesus Christ. He is the answer to your question Kayla. Nothing, or no one, else can work the kind of miracle that is needed now. John 3:5-7 says,

“Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.” And the heart change that we so desperately crave will happen!


TOPICS: Religion; Society
KEYWORDS: guncontrol; secondamendment
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It is not my desire to see any flaming. This is from the heart. There may be typos (I typed it up real fast last night) but I wanted to share this in hopes that maybe, just maybe, it will do some good.
1 posted on 01/18/2013 4:36:37 AM PST by ducttape45
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To: ducttape45
There is a big difference between what can be done and what will be done. In short, because we don't have the will, nothing will be done.
2 posted on 01/18/2013 4:42:43 AM PST by Russ (Repeal the 17th amendment)
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To: ducttape45

Bring back “CHRISTIAN values” back into the school system - the lives of average people - because this country was established and great in power because of that relationship with GOD and the acknowledgement of the Son of God...we have moved away from that...

With that move, being “self-responsible” for one’s actions. We have a rising abortion rate, because both parties in the sexual relationship don’t measure the result of having sex. It’s always someone’s fault, but not their own.

Add to that, one has to be accountable for the actions they commit to. Goes with the above - but for some reason, children today are propped up with FAKE self-esteem and allowed to believe that no matter what they do - it’s okay and if mistakes are made - mommy or daddy will take care of it.

I’ve seen more rudeness - vile - disrespect emerge and values going down.

With the recent rise in legalized marijuana is a tell-tale sign that the US Society is heading in the wrong direction - and the education and values start at home - not school - not the church - not out in society - and definitely not on Facebook or Twitter...those medium are distractions and mislead ill prepared adults and vulnerable youth to take a path that will only lead them to failure.

just my thoughts...


3 posted on 01/18/2013 4:48:10 AM PST by BCW (http://babylonscovertwar.com/index.html)
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To: ducttape45

When we can figure out how to make people like Nancy Lanza get REAL about not having their guns available to disturbed kids and young adults, we will maybe stop more Adam Lanza’s

When our society gets REAL about taking preemptive action against nutjobs identifed by worried parents, teachers and co-worker and others...and whom about NOTHING is done because or worries and laws protecting their “rights” to wlak our streets- then we may be able to stop more people like Major Hassan, James Holmes, Jared Louhgner and the weird stalker kid who shot up Va Tech

When Hollywood and the recording industry and the liberals who dominate the arts (all obama buddies) stop saturating our CHILDREN with VIOLENT games, movies, TV shows and music, and even angry contemptuous “art” like Piss Christ, THEN maybe we can return to being humanized by art instead of the opposite


4 posted on 01/18/2013 4:49:10 AM PST by silverleaf (Age Takes a Toll: Please Have Exact Change)
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To: Russ

A return to traditional family values would go a long way in curbing violence of any kind,gun or otherwise.A mom and dad in the home,working together,putting their kids first,like back in the good old days,would be a really good start-and i’m talking REAL parents-not enablers,or buddies,or besties,but REAL parents who recognize that their kids are not perfect,can’t win all of the time,must exercise personal responsibility and must work hard to make it in life-and who lead by example. God must be central in the home,or all is lost.


5 posted on 01/18/2013 4:52:14 AM PST by gimme1ibertee (When injustice becomes law, rebellion becomes duty.)
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To: ducttape45

Not a flame!

I have lived long enough, and have made it to 60, and will add this ... “I have seen the evil that men do.”

The explanation of what has been termed, “the human condition”, has been written well enough.

Finally, if I remember right, there was the explanation given, that when Adam and Eve found themselves to be naked, and animal coverings were supplied, there was that inescapable fact that there was a shedding of blood, and a death, to ‘cover’, (as in “got it covered”) the discovered inequity. As a People, in America, that very idea has been argued as ‘insane’, by the same folks that argued what was ‘insane’, as being ‘normal’. What used to be so abhorrent, that one would not ever consider doing it, because of the costs, has now been so compartmentalized, and removed, that it has lost that aura of “DON’T DO IT!”


6 posted on 01/18/2013 4:57:21 AM PST by Terry L Smith
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To: ducttape45

The answer is obvious. Bring God (not Allah, etc.) back into the schools. Teach real, not revisionist) American History to re-introduce patriotism. Get families back to church instead of opting for Sunday soccer, etc., and have home life centered on Christianity. Have the balls to speak the truth instead of bowing down to the god-forsaken, everlasting political correctness.


7 posted on 01/18/2013 5:00:39 AM PST by MayflowerMadam
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To: ducttape45
This is from the heart too.

SSRI Stories

Shocking!

8 posted on 01/18/2013 5:02:47 AM PST by Scooter100 ("Now that the fog has lifted, I still can't find my pipe". --- S. Holmes)
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To: gimme1ibertee

Violence is where the focus belongs, not gun violence per se. It would probably be just as effective for the Obama administration to ban all violence. I wonder how far they would get with that?


9 posted on 01/18/2013 5:03:22 AM PST by billhilly
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To: gimme1ibertee

Violence is where the focus belongs, not gun violence per se. It would probably be just as effective for the Obama administration to ban all violence. I wonder how far they would get with that?


10 posted on 01/18/2013 5:03:42 AM PST by billhilly
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To: ducttape45

My family and I have been talking about “this” ... the moral decay, lack of God, etc. for quite a while. What you have done is very beautifully and succinctly “made the case”. You’ve said (and backed up Biblically) what we’ve been thinking and talking about. And you are 100% correct. Thank you for writing this .... it will definitely be “shared”! I think this should be FreeperED, by the way .....


11 posted on 01/18/2013 5:05:47 AM PST by MissMagnolia (You see, truth always resides wherever brave men still have ammunition. I pick truth. (John Ransom))
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To: Scooter100; All
I'm checking out that website more closely when I get back from the doctor.

So far, these are the replies I got from my brother and my daughter to my FB post.

Brother: Obama = total damnation. I thought I was the wacky uncle. You have taken my crown. Congratulations.

Daughter: Okay so, if we all believe in your God and are filled with super duper warm fuzzy feelings, we can all carry around guns and there wouldn't be so many people dying because we're all Good Christians.

Great. Except that that is never going to happen. So your solution isn't a solution at all, it's your image of an ideal world that will never come to pass again. So nevermind that children are getting blown up, we just gotta let those things happen in the name of the second amendment, and not do anything to prevent the mentally ill from getting guns. It sickens me that so many people are in love with their guns to the point that they plug their ears to all the statistics about gun homicides in the USA.

NONE of the items on Obama's list was taking away people's precious guns. They were meant to keep them away from people who aren't healthy or responsible enough to own them. Although I don't know why conservatives are whining so much about how the government is gonna take us over because without our guns we're helpless! Right...because your automatic weapon is going to do a LOT of good against the US military, tanks, drones, and missiles. Face it, if the government wanted to do something like that, it could do it no matter how many guns we have.

Also amusing to me is how you list abortion as a reason we've gone down the corrupt path. Funny how you can say that after a massacre of 20 children we shouldn't have any legal action taken to prevent more events like it, but abortion -- THAT needs to be outlawed everywhere. Thousands and thousands of real, live children are starving, hungry, homeless, and unwanted. Now they're getting gunned down in schools. But conservatives are too busy trying to put regulations on my uterus to worry about those kids.

I really can't put it better than George Carlin: "Pro-life conservatives are obsessed with the fetus from conception to nine months. After that, they don’t want to know about you. They don’t want to hear from you. No nothing. No neonatal care, no day care, no head start, no school lunch, no food stamps, no welfare, no nothing. [...] They’re not pro-life. You know what they are? They’re anti-woman. Simple as it gets, anti-woman. They don’t like them. They don’t like women.They believe a woman’s primary role is to function as a brood mare for the state."

Oh, and don't forget the non-religious people. We're responsible for all this nasty evilness in the world, for taking religion out of schools and teaching people that it's better to think for themselves than to take all their morals from an antiquated text.

Can you feel the love?

12 posted on 01/18/2013 5:08:01 AM PST by ducttape45 (Can you tell I'm angry?)
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To: MissMagnolia
I appreciate your kind words, and please, share with whoever you want. I encourage it's distribution.

BTW, what's FreeperED? :D

13 posted on 01/18/2013 5:09:27 AM PST by ducttape45 (Can you tell I'm angry?)
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To: ducttape45

Limit and speed up the appeals process for murder. Bring back public executions. Hang murderers (OF ANY AGE) in the town square.

Kill the right back, quickly, and humiliate them publicly.


14 posted on 01/18/2013 5:10:25 AM PST by Little Ray (Waiting for the return of the Gods of the Copybook Headings.)
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To: Scooter100; All
This is what I replied to my daughter and brother:

If that is all you take away from this, then I can do no more. Kayla asked a perfectly rational question, and I gave an answer straight from the Holy Bible. If I'm now the "wacky uncle" or the one who is just repeating the "lies upon lies upon hateful lies, regurgitated by the fundamentalist right wing, and spewed out again by the blind, uneducated followers who can't think for themselves, all coming from my demographic, the Straight White Christian Male, usually the older ones, who are terrified that their place of supreme world power is coming to an end" then that's what I'll have to be to you two at least.

I've spoken the truth, and the truth has been refused, by at least two of you. This is what happens when a world rejects moral absolutes and replaces it with doing what is right in your own eyes, judging not, and easy believism.

There was something I purposely left out of my post above, but now I will include it.

2nd Thessalonians 2:11-12 says this, "And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness."

This is talking about folks who ultimately deny the truth of the Word of God and who go into the "time of the end." God can only do so much when the person ultimately rejects Him. At that point, they are basically cut loose and let to do as they please. He will also reinforce their misconceptions by sending them a "strong delusion," or in simpler terms, to permit false and erroneous teachings to come upon them to enforce those same wrong teachings. At that point, their eternal destination is assured.

You have now the complete message.

15 posted on 01/18/2013 5:11:44 AM PST by ducttape45 (Can you tell I'm angry?)
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To: ducttape45
I agree completely. In order to minimize gun violence, the number one answer would be to improve this moral wasteland we live in. You can pass all the laws you want and an immoral population will not function unless they are kept in cages.

So it becomes of matter of giving up liberty to achieve safety.

Now in a free society there will be mentally ill people who will get out of control. Some are predictable, some are not. Whatever efforts we make to identify and help people will reduce incidents of gun violence, but in order to have liberty we have to accept that some incidents will happen.
It is the price of freedom.

16 posted on 01/18/2013 5:16:49 AM PST by oldbrowser (They are marxists, don't call them democrats)
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To: ducttape45

Anyone who thinks there are a lot of children getting killed right now has not seen anything yet. Wait until the marxists take away our firearms.


17 posted on 01/18/2013 5:25:16 AM PST by exnavy (Fish or cut bait ...Got ammo, Godspeed!)
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To: ducttape45

People have free will. They can choose evil. There is a distinction between good and evil. Good is that which is in keeping with our human nature. Evil is that which is in opposition to it.

Modern liberalism says both are the same. Modern liberalism gives people permission to do evil, and then blames society.

Modern liberalism is the problem.

There was a time, I remember, that people had something called “shame” if they did wrong. Other people reminded them of their need to be ashamed. Today, there is no shame.


18 posted on 01/18/2013 5:26:50 AM PST by I want the USA back
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To: ducttape45

I am getting tired of the term “gun violence”. There are way more instances of a gun STOPPING violence than anything else.

They just are not talked about in the libtard media.

This is it folks- this is the gun grab starting RIGHT NOW.


19 posted on 01/18/2013 5:27:09 AM PST by Mr. K (There are lies, damned lies, statistics, and democrat talking points.)
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To: ducttape45

Gun violence has not been addressed so much as it has been ignored. The deaths of twenty kids are trivial compared to those in the urban gang wars.

It is shocking that more American Youths murdered each other in urban warfare in Chicago than in the war in Afghanistan and military suicides. Chicago is more dangerous than Kabul.

What is worse is the murdered young are the very community organized by the current President. His complicity in the murderous affair will never be mentioned. It is obvious his goal was political rather than humanitarian. He didn’t give a damn about the youth of Chicago then and certainly doesn’t now.


20 posted on 01/18/2013 5:27:21 AM PST by bert ((K.E. N.P. N.C. +12 .....The fairest Deduction to be reduced is the Standard Deduction)
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To: ducttape45
"Communism killed over 500,000,000 million people in the 20th century alone"

Uh, you might want to check your math.....(try more like, ONE HUNDRED million).

21 posted on 01/18/2013 5:34:39 AM PST by safeasthebanks ("The most rewarding part, was when he gave me my money!" - Dr. Nick)
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To: ducttape45
My answer would be in two parts:

1) Why do you consider gun violence special? Are you any less dead if you are stabbed to death, or beaten to death?

2) The problem of violence come from allowing violent people loose on the street. According to a 2006 Dept of Justice paper:

* Thirty-six percent of violent felons had an active 
criminal justice status at the time of their arrest. 
This included 18% on probation, 12% on release 
pending disposition of a prior case, and 7% on 
parole.

* Seventy percent of violent felons had a prior arrest 
record, and 57% had at least one prior arrest for a 
felony. Sixty-seven percent of murderers and 73% of 
those convicted of robbery or assault had an arrest 
record.

* A majority (56%) of violent felons had a prior 
conviction record. Thirty-eight percent had a prior 
felony conviction and 15% had a previous conviction 
for a violent felony. 

Too many violent criminals are on the street due to plea bargains. We need to focus on keeping violent criminals in jail.
22 posted on 01/18/2013 5:35:50 AM PST by PapaBear3625 (You don't notice it's a police state until the police come for you.)
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To: ducttape45

It’s a category for original content, editorial or thoughtful, analytic type posts such as yours. On your main FR page, look at the topics up top and you’ll see FreeperED - click on it to see the kinds of posts there. I think this is more appropriate for what you wrote than General/Chat for instance.

Your post is “gone like the wind” already to relatives/friends in FL, TX, VA .... thanks so much for taking the time to put ‘fingers to keyboard’!


23 posted on 01/18/2013 5:37:37 AM PST by MissMagnolia (You see, truth always resides wherever brave men still have ammunition. I pick truth. (John Ransom))
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To: ducttape45

Reduce violent crime by reducing the victim mentality and increasing the number of father’s present in children’s lives.

Focusing on gun crime is pointless, as it is violent crime that matters. I a woman that is beaten, raped, and strangled with her stockings better off because she wasn’t shot? Tell her that violent crime in “gun free” countries makes the U.S. look like an Amish picnic.


24 posted on 01/18/2013 5:41:46 AM PST by SampleMan (Feral Humans are the refuse of socialism.)
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To: ducttape45

Whether we’ve fallen away from God or not, gun violence, indeed crime in general, has generally been declining for 20 years. All the predictions that violent video games, violent movies, violent music, etc, was going to cause a surge in violence turned out to be bunk.

You’re answer is way too wordy. The long term answer is clean up the ghettos by reducing dependency - but that is a big fight about the social welfare state. The short term answer is to be very tough on crime. That means more effective policing the streets and locking people up for a very long time. The NY Times may struggle with this, but sensible American’s don’t - the crime rate goes down as we lock more criminals up.


25 posted on 01/18/2013 5:49:09 AM PST by Longbow1969
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To: ducttape45
Gun violence is an awful thing. Its' cause is ALWAYS a bad or irresponsible person.

Outlaw irresponsible and bad people.

In fact, there is no other solution.

26 posted on 01/18/2013 5:49:45 AM PST by Sacajaweau
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To: ducttape45

The churches recognize that legitimate insanity exists, and for the most part, they agree that it is usually not demonic in character, but a malfunction of the brain or body.

This being said, the old definition of insanity was that a person, because of their mental illness, represents a threat of harm to themselves or others. As such, that they be institutionalized is a good thing for society at large, and a charitable thing for the mentally ill person.

However, because in past states confined people who were more inconvenient than representing a threat to themselves or others, eventually the courts decided that few but the entirely incapable should be confined in mental institutions. As such, the bulk of the criminally insane are confined in prisons, not mental institutions.

For this reason, there is a legitimate national reason to have several large federal reservation-medical facilities set aside specifically for the treatment of the mentally ill who are dangerous.

It would not be easy to be confined to such a reservation-medical facility, instead it would have to be after a chain of independent psychiatric evaluations.

First would be a private psychiatrist, family, or police referral which goes to the existing county psychiatric facility in use today. If, in their opinion, the person is a threat, then they are sent to the state institution for evaluation.

If, after an independent examination, the state mental institution determines that the findings are accurate, then a referral is made to the federal reservation. They perform a final initial independent diagnosis, and then different psychiatrists perform full follow up diagnoses each year thereafter.

Once admitted, unlike many state mental hospitals, which are used to “warehouse” the mentally ill; the federal reservation-medical center will active work to find a suitable treatment for them. If they find a drug, or a new drug is released to market, that seems to be effective, then for the first years’ use of that drug they act as a trustee.

This means that for some months the drug is administered under supervision, and then they are issued the drug for additional months, to determine if they are capable of continuing their medication on their own.

Release from the facility works in the reverse of admission, in that they must be certified at the federal, state and county level first. And any of these can veto their release.


27 posted on 01/18/2013 5:55:48 AM PST by yefragetuwrabrumuy (Best WoT news at rantburg.com)
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To: ducttape45

Gun violence is not the problem...Liberal politicians are.

In 2011:

323 death attributed to Guns.

496 deaths attributed to Hammers.

650 deaths attributed to Knives.

12,000 deaths attributed to Drunk Drivers.

195,000 deaths attributed to Malpractice by Physicians.

???? Deaths caused by wars instigated by politicians ???


28 posted on 01/18/2013 5:59:58 AM PST by chainsaw ("Two ways to conquer and enslave a nation. One is by the sword. The other is by Obama")
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To: ducttape45
You are right, all violence is caused by sin. Jesus has defeated sin and death but violence will only increase until the Prince of Peace has returned to trample his vintage. Why is gun violence more heinous than abortion violence?

Matthew 10:34 Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.

29 posted on 01/18/2013 6:06:47 AM PST by Theophilus (Not merely prolife, but prolific)
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To: ducttape45

Good work. They take the Creator out of the equation, then they say that two plus two is three and you are ignorant if you cannot see that.


30 posted on 01/18/2013 6:07:24 AM PST by winodog (Thank you Jesus for the calm in my life)
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To: silverleaf
for years and years, the Left has told us that it is degrading and morale-lowering to institutionalize those that are only marginally on the safe side of the sane-insane line of demarcation. [Yes, I understand that line to be somewhat fuzzy.] But I note that the perpetrators of all the big massacres of note in recent history (Columbine, Virginia Tech, Aurora, Oslo, Sandy Hook Elementary) had a history of mental instability. Decisions have consequences.
31 posted on 01/18/2013 6:12:17 AM PST by Pecos (If more sane people carried guns, fewer crazies would get off a second shot.)
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To: PapaBear3625
Too many violent criminals are on the street due to plea bargains. We need to focus on keeping violent criminals in jail.

Liberals crack me up: when I hear one say, "penalties for gun violence must be harsher", I respond "better start building more prisons".

The typical response? "Our prisons are overflowing now! Too many Americans are in jail now! We can't build more prisons!"

32 posted on 01/18/2013 6:16:55 AM PST by Night Hides Not (The Tea Party was the earthquake, and Chick Fil A the tsunami...100's of aftershocks to come.)
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To: exnavy

They may not be killed in body but their minds will be just as surely killed by the inculcation of the communist dogma, that is for sure.

One piece of info generally missing from all these “studies” about violence and guns is, most of the criminal gun violence is done by repeat offenders. Seems to me if there were a punishment certain for using a fire arm in the commission of a violent felony, and by certain I mean death, gun violence would go down. Yet we hear nothing about doing this from His Excellency.

Of course this would do little to mitigate the potential for some nut job doing what happened in Conn. However, one must weigh the benefits of proactive mental health testing verses privacy and freedom issues. Matt Towery has an article about this in the paper today with more info about why this is a bad idea.

So the upshot here is the creature in the whitehouse has decided to wreck the second amendment in a two pronged approach....ban most weapons in common usage today AND make it as hard as possible for anyone to acquire any firearms through an elaborate bureaucratic maze. His myopic approach is similar to that of his nuclear arms ideas: get rid of them and then we don’t have to worry about them. I wish he felt the same about illegal aliens.


33 posted on 01/18/2013 6:19:56 AM PST by Mouton (108th MI Group.....68-71)
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To: ducttape45

Have not read your entire piece but I have a minor disagreement with your beginning. In my opinion, it did not start in the 60’s. The 60’s is a too convienent scapegoat. It basically started with the push of socialism - or if you want to call it progress politics - back in the 1800’s. Those with socialistic beliefs started infiltrating government - from grass roots on up to the Fed level - and started chipping away at our Constitution and belief system.


34 posted on 01/18/2013 6:30:06 AM PST by 7thson (I've got a seat at the big conference table! I'm gonna paint my logo on it!)
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To: Night Hides Not
Liberals crack me up

You want to see a Leftist really flip out? Show him some stats on how many violent felons are children of welfare moms. Make the point that we would have far less violence if welfare didn't enable underclass single women to have so many dysfunctional kids.

35 posted on 01/18/2013 6:44:07 AM PST by PapaBear3625 (You don't notice it's a police state until the police come for you.)
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To: ducttape45
How to reduce gun violence:

Stop the "War on Drugs(TM)"; Restore lunatic control to its pre-1970 state as Charles Krauthammer suggests; Outlaw and ban the demoKKKrat party.

36 posted on 01/18/2013 7:03:58 AM PST by varmintman
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To: ducttape45

The answer to all of our troubles is a 3 part concoction: Attentive father + Gospel of Jesus + Lots of investment of time.


37 posted on 01/18/2013 7:10:54 AM PST by lurk
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To: ducttape45

I am so sorry that you got such a disrespectful and nasty response from your daughter. She has the Liberal Talking Points down pat, even quoting George Carlin as a “Moral Authority”. My heart goes out to you.

Please take comfort in the fact that there IS hope, as I was an extremely rebellious teen, a “flower child”, socialist, agnostic, angry, grievance-driven, trial to my loving parents.

They must have prayed for me, because now I am a Conservative, Tea-Party, Evangelical, Christian, FReeper who posts two daily prayer threads on FR.

And...I read your essay and agree with you.

“Take Heart, and Fear not. Let not your heart be troubled, for I have overcome the world”....Jesus.


38 posted on 01/18/2013 7:22:19 AM PST by left that other site (Worry is the darkroom that developes negatives.)
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To: chainsaw

Quote:
“323 death attributed to Guns”

I *think* that is ‘long guns’.
Between Chicago and Detroit they probably have more than
323 gun deaths (although I do no know that for fact).


39 posted on 01/18/2013 7:27:36 AM PST by Verbosus (/* No Comment */)
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To: ducttape45

You,of course are 100% correct and judging by some of the replies so is God.

“Many shall be purified,and made white,and tried;but the wicked shall do wickedly:and none of the wicked shall understand;but the wise shall understand” Daniel CH.12 v.10


40 posted on 01/18/2013 7:30:10 AM PST by logitech (Who's here so vile, that will not love his country? If any speak, for him I have offended)
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To: ducttape45
You have cut to the chase here, IMHO. I'm 61 years old myself. As a child, we left our doors unlocked and the keys in the cars. Today, it is front page news if someone finds your wallet and returns it with the money in it. It's more than just murdering people with guns. America, as I knew it, is almost dead. Arguing over whether or not we ban one type of weapon or not is just silly. If murder is in your heart, you will find a way.

I have mentioned the day America changed was when we took God out of school and my friends scoff. They can't seem to make the connection. What must a child think when we teach them aborting children is good, or God loves homosexuality, after their Sunday School just told them differently? After decades of abortion, and releasing murderers, how confused must they be? I was struck by the logic of 6 year olds suspended from school for making a "gun" with their fingers because they might grow up to think shooting people is OK, and then going home and playing video games and watching "Die Hard IV". Our country has gone mad over the last 50 years.

I chose to home school my daughter for these very reasons. It's not something you can vote on tomorrow and change back, but a series of crazy ideas from the "Left" that has been foisted on us over decades. Marriage, old fashioned and unneeded. Homosexuals need to be Scoutmasters and teachers. Burning a flag is good. God is a myth. Everyone ties in sports, and for heavens sake, no dodge ball. The list is almost endless and is increasing every day. Now, drugs are legal. If we had drives to stop drunk drivers and smokers are falling off of roofs while they freeze, how smart can it possibly be to smoke a blunt while driving?

It just seems we have gone mad and we expect good results from insanity.

Putting God back in school wouldn't stop the murders tomorrow, but it is a mandatory beginning. Where is the source of wisdom today if not from God? You cannot build a foundation on anything but God. An atheist cannot be forced to believe, but they can be forced to recognize right from wrong if they live in a Godly country. There were kids that didn't pray when we prayed in class and some looked out the window during the Pledge of Allegiance, but they understood that God and America were good, and we expected them to be "good". We also had a paddle down at the principle's office for "unbelievers".

Our Founders knew that freedom comes from God and no people can be free without God. All the laws made cannot change a human heart. Our system was made for a Godly people, otherwise, we would need a dictator. The further we get from God, the more laws we will "need". If you truly want to be free, we MUST have God at our core.

41 posted on 01/18/2013 8:15:47 AM PST by chuckles
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To: BCW
With the recent rise in legalized marijuana is a tell-tale sign that the US Society is heading in the wrong direction

How so? Was the relegalization of the drug alcohol a tell-tale sign that the US Society was heading in the wrong direction?

42 posted on 01/18/2013 8:58:12 AM PST by JustSayNoToNannies ("The Lord has removed His judgments against you" - Zep. 3:15)
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To: safeasthebanks

I checked my facts before posting that number. During the reigns of Stalin, Hilter, Mao, Kim, Castro, Chaves, just to name a few many millions were killed. I’ll have to find my source again but I will post it when I do.


43 posted on 01/18/2013 9:00:44 AM PST by ducttape45 (Can you tell I'm angry?)
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To: MissMagnolia
I never knew that type of category existed, and if the Moderator wants to move this thread there, that's cool with me. I never think of myself as "thoughtful or analytical" but if you say so, I'm cool with that too!

I'm going to rework the piece a bit to include my response to my daughter but if you want a PDF file with the entire thing I'll be more than happy to email it to you. Just send me a Freepmail with your email address and I'll get it out to you. That goes for anyone else who might want it as well!

44 posted on 01/18/2013 9:04:24 AM PST by ducttape45 (Can you tell I'm angry?)
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To: ducttape45

You cannot reason with 0bamazombies. Their brains are fried from drinking too much 0bama Kool-Aid. All you can do is pray for them and hope they don’t take The Mark.


45 posted on 01/18/2013 9:14:12 AM PST by SVTCobra03 (You can never have enough friends, horsepower or ammunition.)
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To: ducttape45

Forget the daughter. You’re wasting your time.

If she is to learn, it will be by her own life experiences. There ain’t much you’re gonna do to make her change...


46 posted on 01/18/2013 9:19:44 AM PST by Road Glide
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To: MissMagnolia; ducttape45
On your main FR page, look at the topics up top and you’ll see FreeperED - click on it to see the kinds of posts there. I think this is more appropriate for what you wrote than General/Chat for instance.

Apples and oranges - FReeper Ed is a topic and General/Chat is a forum. (That topic is available only for articles in the News/Activism forum.)

47 posted on 01/18/2013 9:24:24 AM PST by JustSayNoToNannies ("The Lord has removed His judgments against you" - Zep. 3:15)
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To: JustSayNoToNannies; ducttape45

Thanks for straightening me out JustSayNoToNannies! Sorry for the misinformation, ducttape45! ... still a FReeperEd ‘topic’ in my opinion. :-)


48 posted on 01/18/2013 9:37:14 AM PST by MissMagnolia (You see, truth always resides wherever brave men still have ammunition. I pick truth. (John Ransom))
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To: I want the USA back
Ok, let's look at your response in light of the scripture.

You said, "Good is that which is in keeping with our human nature. Evil is that which is in opposition to it." But is that really biblical? Let's break it down.

First, you said "Good is that which is in keeping with our human nature." The Bible directly contradicts that in many places.

1. Genesis 6:5 says, "And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually."

2. Genesis 8:21 says, "And the LORD smelled a sweet savour; and the LORD said in his heart, I will not again curse the ground any more for man's sake; for the imagination of man's heart is evil from his youth; neither will I again smite any more every thing living, as I have done."

3. Psalms 34:14 says, "Depart from evil, and do good; seek peace, and pursue it." Psalms 37:27 says, "Depart from evil, and do good; and dwell for evermore." To ask someone to depart from evil would have to imply that he was there in the first place.

4. Ecclesiastes 8:11 says, "Because sentence against an evil work is not executed speedily, therefore the heart of the sons of men is fully set in them to do evil."

5. Again in Ecclesiastes 9:3 it says, "This is an evil among all things that are done under the sun, that there is one event unto all: yea, also the heart of the sons of men is full of evil, and madness is in their heart while they live, and after that they go to the dead."

Lastly on this first point, the words of Our Savior Jesus when He rebuked the religious hypocrites of his day, from Matthew 12:34 where He says, "O generation of vipers, how can ye, being evil, speak good things? for out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaketh."

Going back to my original post, the only way this condition can be changed, truly changed, is through repentance and faith in Jesus Christ.

John 3:5-7 says, “Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.”

On to the second point you raised, "Evil is that which is in opposition to it (our human nature)." Here we have an equation: Evil = opposition to human nature. Is that biblical?

Again, let's go to God's Word.

John 3:16-21 says this, "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved. He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved. But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.

Can you see what I'm getting at in this passage. Evil is whatever is contrary to "the light." Basically, our equation now looks like this: Evil ≠ Light. So basically, evil is whatever is opposed to the light, Jesus Christ.

Lastly, "the problem." The problem has many manifestations, but the root cause is always the same, and it's same thing that befell Lucifer; "pride." From "pride" comes "sin," and from "sin" we have the problems we have today.

Whew, man, I tell you what, I felt a "preach" come upon me last night and it still hasn't abated. Don't know how much more of this I can take!

49 posted on 01/18/2013 9:41:04 AM PST by ducttape45 (Can you tell I'm angry?)
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To: 7thson

If it indeed started back in the 1800’s, then you have a valid point. But at least it was held in check (for the most part) until the 1960’s.


50 posted on 01/18/2013 9:44:13 AM PST by ducttape45 (Can you tell I'm angry?)
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