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NEW ALAMO POLL: Who was the greatest U.S. President?
The Constitutional Alamo ^ | 06/27/10 | Michael Naragon

Posted on 06/27/2010 6:55:12 AM PDT by Publius772000

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To: napscoordinator

Reagan trounced Carter/Mondale in the 80/84 presidential elections. I was thinking more in those terms.


81 posted on 06/27/2010 3:47:03 PM PDT by smokingfrog ( - Eccl. 10:18 -)
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To: Colonel Kangaroo

Bless you. I had not the energy for yet another foray into the NeoConfederate revisionism battles.


82 posted on 06/27/2010 11:47:28 PM PDT by NucSubs ( Cognitive dissonance: Conflict or anxiety resulting from inconsistency between beliefs and actions)
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To: Texas Fossil

It’s a bit closer now... Obviously, in a subjective poll, you’ll get people’s opinions based on their experience and not necessarily based on their understanding of the big picture. I think both Washington and Reagan were great in their time periods. The difference was the Washington was absolutely vital to future generations. The jury is still out, historically speaking, on Reagan’s importance to future generations.


83 posted on 06/28/2010 7:39:02 AM PDT by Publius772000 (http://theconstitutionalalamo.com)
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To: mjp

I think that’s a bit harsh, given the circumstances with which Lincoln was dealt. Many of the powers he assumed were done so because of insurrection. You can make a case that he played a game of duplicity in regards to his views on the Confederacy—one moment he treated them like a foreign combatant, the next like a band of rebels.

In winning, however, a lot of his transgressions were essentially erased by public opinion in the North, where the history was written. Had Lincoln failed and the war effort collapsed, as it nearly did on several occasions in the North, he would necessarily be viewed differently.

To call Lincoln a Marxist is a bit anachronistic, however, as Marx’s signature work Das Kapital wasn’t published until 1876, though his ideas were circulating throughout Europe.


84 posted on 06/28/2010 7:48:23 AM PDT by Publius772000 (http://theconstitutionalalamo.com)
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To: Publius772000
Washington, the man who would not be king. Without him there would have been no others.
85 posted on 06/28/2010 7:52:07 AM PDT by HoustonCurmudgeon ("I'll try to be NICER, if you will try to be SMARTER!" ~ MNJohnnie, FReeper)
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To: Publius772000

Agreed. And we need another leader of Washington’s character, judgement and determination now.


86 posted on 06/28/2010 9:16:19 AM PDT by Texas Fossil (Government, even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one.)
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To: central_va
the USA's greatness lies in an unfettered population pursuing private interests. T. J. Jefferson fits that mold perfectly.

Awkward that TJ personally held a couple hundred people in fetters. preventing them from pursuing their private interests. With some of them very likely his own children.

87 posted on 06/28/2010 9:16:30 PM PDT by Sherman Logan
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To: Colonel Kangaroo
You don’t think Jefferson Davis suspended habeas corpus throughout the South, presided over widespread oppression and extortion of Southerners and generally ruled through a reign of terror in Dixie?

Actually, no. While I think the CSA was one of the worst causes in history for which to fight, the issues you list were not among the reasons.

I don't believe JD ever got a suspension of HC throughout the South. Too much resistance from CSA congressmen and governors. In fact, GA and NC governors, among others, quite openly and successfully defied him.

For the CSA to survive, it had to at minimum recognize that survival trumped civil rights of (white) men. It was unwilling to do so. It fell, killed as some said at the time, by a theory that states and civil rights trumped all.

There was plenty of oppression of opposing views in the Civil War south, but most of it was driven by popular or state action, not CSA.

88 posted on 06/28/2010 9:28:27 PM PDT by Sherman Logan
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To: Publius772000

To answer the poll question, I’d break it down by centuries:

18th - Washington, for his leadership in establishing an utterly new system of government.

19th - Lincoln, for successfully defending that system of government against its greatest challenge (to date).

20th - Reagan, for defeating the greatest foreign challenge against that system of government.


89 posted on 06/28/2010 9:32:36 PM PDT by Sherman Logan
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To: Sherman Logan
Awkward that TJ personally held a couple hundred people in fetters. preventing them from pursuing their private interests. With some of them very likely his own children.

Ok, clearly Thomas Jefferson is just part of "white" history and unworthy of any discussion. Please educate me on the greatest President, or does that require that you HAVE an opinion, and no just another yapping FR little dog.

90 posted on 06/29/2010 3:04:50 AM PDT by central_va (I won't be reconstructed, and I do not give a damn.)
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To: Sherman Logan
19th - Lincoln, for successfully defending that system of government against its greatest challenge (to date).

State-ist crap. The North was on the offense. Nobody characterizes the South as on the offensive. Nice try. Does anyone doubt the good ole US of A could of survived/thrived without 11 stars in the blue field. No one doubts that. You main lined the kool aid. Lincoln was a cold hearted butcher that jumped on the abolitionist bandwagon in mid war when he was running out of Irish immigrants to throw into his useless war slaugther machine. Around 1862, his cleaver need fresh meat so he got "religion" and armed the black man. Nice guy.

Lincoln rots in hell.

91 posted on 06/29/2010 3:36:42 AM PDT by central_va (I won't be reconstructed, and I do not give a damn.)
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To: central_va
If you are going to post that Thomas Jefferson was one of the greatest Americans because he "perfectly" fit the mold of promoting freedom pursued by unfettered individuals, you should not be surprised that someone points out that his perfection in this regard is more than a little debatable.

TJ quite obviously only believed in unfettered freedom for some, despite his amazing rhetoric about "all men are created equal."

You are perfectly free to believe TJ our greatest president despite his blatant hypocrisy, but others have the right to believe this hypocrisy seriously damages his status as a great man.

Washington also held slaves, but spent the last decade or so of his life putting his affairs in order, with great effort, so they could all be freed on his death.

TJ chose instead to lead a life of great luxury and died deeply in debt, forcing his creditors to sell his slaves to reimburse themselves, probably separating families in the process.

For this reason, among many others, I consider Washington a much greater President, and man, than Jefferson.

92 posted on 06/29/2010 6:33:13 AM PDT by Sherman Logan
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To: Sherman Logan
I believe you are correct. I was sloppy with my assertion. What I was trying to get at was the inappropriateness of crying about Lincoln's "oppressions" while pretending not to see weight of governmental coercions at all levels in Dixie. Going to reb prison on the whim of local reb bosses W.H. Tibbs and Captain Brown in Cleveland, Tennessee is as much of a loss of freedom as if it had occurred under a central regime.

And there were occasions where Jeff himself did call for and approve of large scale arrests of the suspected such as the East Tennessee bridge burning case. Reb lovers cry about a suspected bridge burner being detained in Maryland by the federals, but ignore the hanging of suspected bridge burners in Tennessee by the Confederates. In Jeff Davis's slavery empire, dissent was often fatal.

93 posted on 06/29/2010 9:10:03 AM PDT by Colonel Kangaroo
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To: Colonel Kangaroo

You are also quite correct. There were numerous incidents involving mobs and vigilantes in the South attacking Unionists or suspected Unionists, with little of the same virulence occurring in the North, outside of the border war between MO and KS.

I didn’t mean to imply that southerners always respected the rights of dissenters, simply that Jeff Davis himself didn’t do much trampling on rights. Of white people, that is. The CSA was the embodiment of trampling on rights of black people.


94 posted on 06/29/2010 12:32:52 PM PDT by Sherman Logan
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To: All

.

George Washington was the greatest president, without a doubt.

George Washington
The father of our country

A Man of Character, a man of God and possibly the greatest American of them all.

Washington’s greatness is not just that he led the Revolutionary Army to victory in an apparently hopeless seven-year war against the mightiest military power in the world. It’s not just that he presided over the convention that wrote our enduring Constitution which is the fountainhead of our freedom. It’s not just that he was uniquely unanimously elected to two terms as our first President. It’s not just that he made our young republic a reality when he declined a third term as President and transferred the reins of power to our second President.

Washington’s greatness was based on his leadership and character, so acknowledged by the many other great men of his time. Washington is the hero we need today because he is an extraordinary example of a President whose character was above reproach and whom adulation did not corrupt. In Daniel Webster’s words: “America has furnished to the world the character of Washington, and if our American institutions had done nothing else, that alone would have entitled them to the respect of mankind.”

When sensational journalists of his and succeeding generations scraped the countryside for revelations, they did not find even one tale of a tryst behind a haystack or a plundering escapade with the boys. Item-by-item scrutiny of his cash-book and ledger, which were the disclosure records of his generation, do not reveal even one entry that hints of a financial or moral impropriety. His spotless reputation has stood the test of time.

No investigative reporter ever discovered any misdeeds of the kinds that tarnished the reputations of later Presidents. Washington did not have any secret life of womanizing, cheating, building a personal fortune through control of government television licenses, talking in profanities, lying to his supporters as well as his enemies, keeping close friendships with traitors or men of deviant behavior, betraying his campaign promises, making secret deals with foreign countries, accepting campaign donations that smelled of bribery, conspiring to involve our country in war, or stuffing the ballot box to win elections.

Washington never would have accepted the popular line that the personal lives of public officials are none of the public’s business. With Washington, what you saw was what you got; the public man and the private man were one and the same. Representative Richard Henry Lee’s eulogy correctly stated: “The purity of his private character gave effulgence to his public virtues.”

Washington wanted our nation to be bound by the same rules of honor and honesty that should bind individuals. In his Farewell Address he reminded us: “I hold the maxim no less applicable to public than to private affairs that honesty is always the best policy.”

The famous story about not telling a lie about chopping down the cherry tree has been demoted in modern times to apocryphal status, but we have the record that, as a schoolboy, Washington wrote in his copybook, “Labor to keep alive in your breast that little spark of celestial fire — conscience.”

With almost no formal education, Washington educated himself by reading. He was not an eloquent speaker, having no special flair with words or his generation’s equivalent of the 20th century sound-bite. Nevertheless, all the college-educated Founding Fathers acknowledged him as their leader.

Washington earned the loyalty of the men who served with him not from stirring their emotions but because of his reliable integrity, incorruptible judgment, and persevering zeal. He certainly didn’t retain their enthusiasm for the American cause because of a succession of military victories — he lost more battles than he won. His leadership and commanding presence enabled him to lead his ragged, ill-clothed, underpaid troops through defeats and retreats toward an improbable victory.

Washington’s total dedication to the duty assigned to him of winning our War of Independence gave him personal peace of mind. His will and self-discipline were his rod and staff; he could persevere in the war against England because he was not at war with himself.

Washington’s code of living was built on the principles of conduct he regarded as the code of gentlemen, laboriously handwritten as a teenager in his 110 Rules of Civility and Decent Behavior. The gentleman’s code was not founded on love and compassion, but on honesty, duty, truth, respect for others, courtesy, and justice, which demanded that he do his utmost and in return receive what he had earned. What he was, he made himself by will, effort, self-discipline, ambition, and perseverance.

There is a sculpture of Washington on horseback at the battle of Monmouth in 1778. It captures a moment during the Revolution when his leadership was put to its severest test. Finding his advance troops in full retreat because of a traitorous officer, Washington galloped through his frightened regiments and saved the day by turning them around and leading them forward to attack the British.

Late in life, Washington himself told an old friend his own explanation of his remarkable success in accomplishing what seemed impossible in the American Revolution. He said he “always had walked on a straight line.” As a youth, he acquired a positive love of the right, and he developed an iron will to do always what is right and honorable.

Today, when there seem to be so few heroes, George Washington is a man for all seasons. He had the strength he needed for the long and dangerous journeys of his incredible life because he always walked that “straight line.”

http://www.eagleforum.org/psr/2002/may02/psrmay02.shtml

.


95 posted on 07/03/2010 11:47:11 PM PDT by patriot08 (TEXAS GAL- born and bred and proud of it!)
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