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To: imardmd1
the Greek verb "harpadzo" meaning "to snatch away":

Is the snatching away present in, or absent from, this passage ?

I also notice that the Apostle to the Gentiles previously told (not wrote) them about "these things" when he was with them. I also read further down that he instructs them to hold the traditions they were taught by word or by epistle. The rapture is a modern teaching that was not part of the tradition of the one holy catholic apostolic church.

Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him, That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand. Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God. Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things?

...

Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle. Now our Lord Jesus Christ himself, and God, even our Father, which hath loved us, and hath given us everlasting consolation and good hope through grace, Comfort your hearts, and stablish you in every good word and work.


Second Thessalonians, Catholic chapter two, Protestant verses one to five,
Second Thessalonians, Catholic chapter two, Protestant verses fifteen to seventeen,
as authorized, but not authored, by King James

136 posted on 05/23/2017 7:39:00 PM PDT by af_vet_1981 (The bus came by and I got on, That's when it all began.)
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To: af_vet_1981; metmom
Let me answer your Post #136 in two parts.

========= Part I ==========

I wrote:

the Greek verb "harpadzo" meaning "to snatch away":

Expanding on this, it is the sense of removing something or someone suddenly and forcefully that the word "harpadzo" confers to an action. Several words or phrases in English can describe the action, and are chosen by the translator to be consistent with the context. First, those words are the ones defining the Greek word:

==========

Strong's Number G0726

ἁρπάζω
harpazō
har-pad'-zo

Strong's Definition:
From a derivative of G138; to seize (in various applications): -
catch (away, up), pluck, pull, take (by force).

Thayer Definition:
1) to seize, carry off by force
2) to seize on, claim for one’s self eagerly
3) to snatch out or away
Part of Speech: verb
============

Then, the verses in which harpadzo is used, followed by the Latin equivalent from the Vulgate Bible, then thirdly by the English as in the Authorized Version are as follows: Mt. 11:12, αρπαζουσιν ; rapiunt ; to (violently) take by force
Mt. 13:19, αρπαζει ; rapit ; to catch away
Jn. 6:15; αρπαζειν ; raperent ; to take by force
Jn. 19:12; αρπαζει ; rapit ; to (suddenly) catch
Jn. 10:28; αρπασει ; rapiet ; to pluck out
Jn. 10:29; αρπαζειν ; rapere (infinitive form) ; to pluck out
Acts 8:39; ηρπασεν ; rapuit ; to catch away
Acts 23:10; αρπασαι ; rapere ; to take by force
2 Cor. 12:2; αρπαγεντα ; raptum ; to be caught up
2 Cor. 12:4; ηρπαγη ; raptus ; to catch up, or be caught up
1 Thess 4:7; αρπαγησομεθα ; rapiemur ; to be caught up
Jude 1:23; αρπαζοντες ; rapientes ; to (suddenly) pull out
Rev. 12:5; ηρπασθη ; raptus ; to be caught up, to catch up
===========

harpadzo is found 33 times in the Septuagint, the Old Testament of the Greek Bible.
============

The meaning of the Latin verb "rapere" in terms of English word use:

Source: "William Whitaker's Words" (University of Notre Dame)

rap.ere ; V 3 1 PRES ACTIVE INF 0 X
rap.ere ; V 3 1 PRES PASSIVE IMP 2 S
rapio, rapere, rapui, raptus V [XXXAX]

drag off; snatch; destroy; seize, carry off; pillage; hurry;

Source: "Online Latin Dictionary"

rapio = verb form first person present active; rapere = infinitive

1 to drag off
2 to snatch
3 to destroy
4 to seize, to carry off
5 to pillage
6 to hurry

===========

Source: "Latdict"

rapio, rapere, rapui, raptus

verb
conjugation: 3rd conjugation
Definitions:
1. destroy
2. drag off
3. hurry
4. pillage
5. seize, carry off
6. snatch
Age: In use throughout the ages/unknown
Area: All or none
Geography: All or none
Frequency: Very frequent, in all Elementry Latin books, top 1000+ words
Source: General, unknown or too common to say
=========

Now, as far as expressing what the "rapture"--a theological concept and event, the pertinent definition from the Webster's New International Dictionary (Unabridged) 1981 is:

3 a : a carrying of a person to heaven
3 b : Christ's raising up of his true church and its members to a realm above
the earth where the whole company will enjoy celestial bliss with its Lord

(Note: This event we are discussing is not some kind of emotional or ecstatic overwhelming feeling, like some religious people seem to experience. That would be another kind of rapture, not the one described in 1 Thessalonians 4/l17.)
========

You say:

The rapture is a modern teaching that was not part of the tradition of the one holy catholic apostolic church.

The teaching is not modern. It is so obviously verbal and literal to the Thessalonians, and from then on to anyone possessing the Scriptures, that it cannot p[ossibly be considered a "modern" teaching. It is true that the RCC denomination has withheld information from its constituents so that they are quite ignorant of the event in which the saved of Christ will all be called out of this temporal dimension at some point in time, and each true believer rejoined to his/her own spiritual body for all time and eternity.

Also obviously, this is known to the lexicographers of the English language, isn't it? If you have not been spiritually taught in this doctrine, your teachers are without excuse (Rom. 1:16-20).

======= end of Part I =======

156 posted on 05/24/2017 9:14:31 AM PDT by imardmd1 (Fiat Lux)
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