Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article


1 posted on 06/25/2015 7:00:52 PM PDT by Morgana
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies ]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-2021-29 next last
To: Morgana

You do great stuff on the pro-Life front.

I can’t commend you enough, Morgana, for the articles you post.

I don’t know why you want to fall in to the my denomination is better than yours trap.


2 posted on 06/25/2015 7:06:57 PM PDT by ifinnegan
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: Morgana
2.) History- The Roman Catholic Church is the oldest and original Christian Church, therefore, the beliefs and teachings of the Church were directly passed onto the leaders of the Catholic Church by the apostles. The Catholic Church began with the teachings of Jesus Christ, around 1st Century AD in the province of Judea of the Roman Empire. The Catholic Church is the continuation of the early Christian community established by Jesus and no modern Christian Church can make that claim. By the end of the 2nd century, bishops began congregating in regional synods and to correct doctrinal and policy issues and by the time the 3rd century came around, the Bishop of Rome (Pope) served as the decisive authority, kind of like a court of appeals, for problems and issues the bishops could not resolve. This is identical to the Bible’s teaching. In Exodus 18 we see where the children of Israel brought their disputes to Moses and Moses settled those disputes. However, it also shows where leaders appointed by Moses also worked to settle disputes.

In fact, early Church doctrines often contradict what the Papists, centuries later, claimed to be the "true" and inherited doctrine they claim they always believed in. In fact, even what the Catholics believed a hundred or so years ago is different from what they believe today. Just see photos of John Paul II kissing Korans, or Pope Francis and his gaggle of pro-homosexual Cardinals, and you will let go of this myth of Roman continuity.

On top of that, the authority that Catholics invest in their Pope is much more recent-- historically speaking-- than they let on. For one thing, the Church Fathers aren't even universal in their interpretation of Peter as the Rock. Many interpret the rock, as Protestants do, of Jesus Christ Himself. And in practice, men like Augustine argued that doctrinal matters was to be settled by majority opinion of the Church, with all those churches that have some Apostolic connection having the stronger "vote." But in the event that all the Apostolic churches were on one side of an issue, and the rest of the Christian world was on the other, Augustine held that the Christian was at liberty to believe as he pleased.

It is easy to sit there and make up a bunch of "reasons" why the Catholic Religion is the "true" one, but it wilts under any degree of actual analysis.

3 posted on 06/25/2015 7:12:29 PM PDT by Greetings_Puny_Humans (I mostly come out at night... mostly.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: Morgana
The devilish, rabid, violent anti-Semite Martin Luther's own publications are pretty much all a fellow (even a non-Christian like me)needs to know about the buffet "church." Surely not MY Church, says the... Says the... Alas, I am not saved, therefore my opinions are invalid to the blessed minions of the interpretive deity or deities - the blessed mortal rebreathers who reject the First Commandment, read their own writing and know it to be True.
4 posted on 06/25/2015 7:13:59 PM PDT by golux
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: Morgana

Oh please, you are not winning converts by posting stuff like this.
I heard this crap from my Catholic relatives since I was a child.

My Pentecostal Mom married a Catholic. I wasn’t raised Catholic and his relatives told me, I was a bastard who was going to hell. This began when I was 5. It made me afraid.

I’ve heard enough of this crap to last me a lifetime.


5 posted on 06/25/2015 7:16:49 PM PDT by bimboeruption ("Occupy till I come" ~ OPORD issued by CIC Jesus Christ)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: Morgana
The Catholic Church gave Christians the Bible- The first official list of books contained is what is the Bible was done at the Council of Hippo in 393 and then again in Carthage in 397 and 419. However, the Council of Trent in 1556 was the first time the Church infallibly defined these books as ‘inspired’ because it was questioned by Reformers.

In fact, the Romanists did so in contradiction to St. Jerome-- who actually did the Latin translations and understood why the Jews rejected those books as canonical-- and much church tradition, even held by Roman Bishops, that the Apocrypha were not inspired, but only called "scripture" in the sense of being useful for edification, not doctrine. This was even noted in Biblical translations themselves for centuries, approved by Rome, distinguishing the Apocrypha from the regular canon. This is just another example of arbitrary Roman decisions which really was only decided because "they were questioned by the Reformers." Had it not been questioned, the Papists might never have made the decision.

And as for the "oral tradition" thing. I once remember a Papist telling me that even when the Church Fathers-- as early as the 1st and 2nd century-- are quoting word from word from the scripture, and even say words like "reading" or "scripture," that really they were talking about oral tradition!

The only thing that church councils did was determine what the Church was already reading. Before that time, the scripture was heavily in use. Some of my best evidence for destroying infidels who claim that the scripture was not actually written for 200 or 300 years, is by quoting Ignatius, Polycarp or Irenaeus, who quote, between themselves, the majority of the New Testament, if not all of it.

6 posted on 06/25/2015 7:21:08 PM PDT by Greetings_Puny_Humans (I mostly come out at night... mostly.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: Morgana

“Me thinkest thou doth protest too much!”


7 posted on 06/25/2015 7:25:14 PM PDT by JesusIsLord
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: Morgana

And now that the pope declared global warming is real, the earth will heat up.


9 posted on 06/25/2015 7:28:38 PM PDT by Basket_of_Deplorables (Cruz2Victory!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: Morgana
4.) The Sacraments are Biblical- The Apostles were given the power to ‘forgive sins’ in John 20:23, Peter taught in I Peter 3:21 that ‘baptism now saves you’, ‘anointing the sick with oil was shown in James 5:14-15, laying on of hands in Acts 8:17 and 2 Timothy 1:6, marriage in the Lord in I Corinthians 7:39 and Jesus stated numerous times that the disciples should participate in the breaking of bread (Eucharist) by stating ‘he who eats my flesh has eternal life’.

Was Cornelius saved before or after he was baptized?

Those individuals who repented at Pentecost….saved before or after baptism?

We’ve about beat John 6 to death explaining it is not a literal meaning to “eat the bread and drink the blood”.

If so, how many blind and lame catholics do we see when Jesus gave the command to gouge out the eye and cut off the hand if they cause you to sin? Why aren’t they doing that? To date, no catholic has answered.

10 posted on 06/25/2015 7:29:24 PM PDT by ealgeone
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: Morgana
The Catholic Church remained the only Christian Church until the East-West Schism of 1054, which caused medieval Christianity to split and become two separate branches.

From the first century onward, Christianity spread through the Middle East from Syria to India, into Ethiopia, the British Isles, etc. Not all of these Christians were under the authority of the Bishop of Rome.

13 posted on 06/25/2015 7:32:33 PM PDT by Fiji Hill
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: Morgana

The Roman Catholic Church recognizes the co-equal claims of the eastern churches to apostolic lineage. Therefore, it is merely one of several equally old churches, each with connections to the apostles and therefore to Jesus.

The Roman Catholic Church accepts the determinations of several church councils with participants from churches not then or later part of the Roman Catholic Church. Prior to its establishment as the official church of the Roman Empire, things were, shall we say, fluid. BTW the first of the Christian churches to become the established church of a state entity was the Armenian Church.

The Roman Catholic Church severed its relation with the other Christian Churches when it was made the official church of the Roman Empire by Constantine. The original fluidity changed. At a later time, the Greek or Byzantine or Eastern Orthodox Church was split from Rome with the division of the Roman Empire into two parts. The Greek Orthodox Church is today a member of the World COuncil of Churches, and therefore in league with the many of the original eastern churches, many of the Protestant churches, and the Old Catholics.

It was not long following the first assertion of infallibility by the Roman Catholic Church that the Protestants revolted, and western Christianity was torn asunder.

It was not long following the first assertion of infallibility of the Pope that the so-called Old Catholics left.

Now, with regard to the translation of the Bible, the work of St. Jerome is truly awesome. For centuries previous, the Roman Catholic Church used other Latin translations. These were considered suspect. Jerome’s re-translated the Bible from the Greek texts into the Latin, and also made original translations from the Hebrew into the Latin. These remained definitive through the 16th century.

Since then, new translations based on original texts and better informed by our knowledge of Biblical Hebrew and Jewish idioms have been made by various Biblical scholars, including by the Roman Catholics and other Christians and Jews, often working together.

In terms of what the Bible says, it commands us to be unified in the faith and tells us, further, that when Jesus returns God’s Name will be One. The latter can be interpreted to mean that, until Jesus returns, God’s Name will not be One. I think this means we should be tolerant of each other.


15 posted on 06/25/2015 7:40:24 PM PDT by Redmen4ever
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: Morgana

If you accept Vatican 2, you think your church is alive.

If you reject Vatican 2, you accept that your church is dead.


What do I mean by this? For example, Vatican 2 peddles the lie that Allah and Yahweh are the same.

Wrong.


Therefore, Rome is bankrupt spiritually.


16 posted on 06/25/2015 7:40:39 PM PDT by fishtank (The denial of original sin is the root of liberalism.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: Morgana

And the Commie Pope is speaking God’s truth.

Right.


17 posted on 06/25/2015 7:42:49 PM PDT by Arm_Bears (Biology is biology. Everything else is imagination.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: Morgana

19 posted on 06/25/2015 7:45:43 PM PDT by fishtank (The denial of original sin is the root of liberalism.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: Morgana

The Catholic denomination, is one that almost always votes pro-abortion democrat.


22 posted on 06/25/2015 8:26:47 PM PDT by ansel12 (Trump- I identify as Democrat-- favorite president?-Clinton-- your veep? "Oprah my first choice".)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: Morgana

The simple message of Christ...convoluted and twisted over centuries by men who thought they were Gods.


23 posted on 06/25/2015 8:41:01 PM PDT by Dallas59 (Only a fool stumbles on things behind him.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: Morgana

1.) Authority-.... The Authority of the New Testament Church is the Word of God...Jesus is the foundation of the New Testament Church... “For ‘no other’ foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ” (1st Corinthians 3:11). Jesus is the Authority of the New Testament Church.
....
The Bible is the believers FINAL AUTHORITY on all matters. This is the insurmountable difference between Christianity and all other religious beliefs, teachings, dogmas and philosophies...additionally The Church is a group of “called out believers” regardlessless of their denomination or church affliation (Matthew 18:20)

2.) History- Though stated by catholics thatThe Roman Catholic Church is the oldest church the Islamic faith has lasted for centuries as well...therefore the argument for years is mute....Additionally the beliefs and teachings of the Church were written down for us as the Spirit of God moved the authors of the Bible to write....which is why the Bible is the ultimate authority and guide for life now and everlasting.

3.) The Jews gave Christians the first five Books of the Bible .. ‘The first’ official’list of books contained is what is the Bible ....cathlicism did not.....The process of writing and recognizing the New Testament books began long before the Roman Catholic Church even existed. The night before the Lord was crucified, He told His disciples that they, empowered by the Holy Spirit, would bear witness to His life and teaching:..John 15:26,27 tells us...”When the Helper comes, whom I will send to you from the Father, that is the Spirit of truth, who proceeds from the Father, He will bear witness of Me, and you will bear witness also, because you have been with Me from the beginning. ..... the role that church councils played in the process is often overstated by Roman Catholics.
The first councils to have addressed the question as to which books were inspired and were rightfully part of the Bible appear to have been the North African Councils of Hippo (393) and Carthage (397). The list of books accepted by the Council of Hippo ‘no longer exists’..... The Council of Carthage, however, is believed to have repeated the same list and its decree on the matter is extant.
Both councils were regional synods. They were not universal or ecumenical councils. About 50 bishops from the provinces of Africa attended each. These councils did not have authority to speak for the whole fourth-century church....It is also important to note that by the time these councils addressed the matter at the close of the fourth century, the canon or list of books recognized as forming the New Testament was well established.
important to notice is that the New Testament canon was not demarcated by the arbitrary decree of any Church Council. When at last a Church Council, the Synod of Carthage in A.D. 397, listed the twenty-seven books of the New Testament, it did not confer upon them any authority which they did not already possess, but simply recorded their previously established canonicity. iv

Furthermore, the decision reached by these councils has never been universally accepted. The controversy centers around writings referred to by Roman Catholic scholars as the deuterocanonicals and by Protestant scholars as the Apocrypha. In that non-Catholics have never accepted the decision of the councils to accept the Apocrypha as part of the Bible, it can hardly be argued that were it not for the Roman Catholic Church no one would know with certainty which books belong in the Bible.

4.) The Sacraments..... the Lord instituted ‘only two sacraments’ baptism and the Lord’s Supper given to His body of believers ecorded in the Bible...Jesus made no command or even mention of the remaining sacraments practiced by the Catholic Church...those are man made.. the sacraments are never tied to our salvation in any way (except that they may follow salvation). Consequently, since the Catholic church’s teaching on sacraments is inconsistent with Scripture, this demonstrates that the doctrine of magisterium is also false
....Scripture is also very clear that these two sacraments are symbolic, ‘visible signs of an inward grace’.. rather just as the Jews had been commanded to celebrate Passover ‘as a remembrance’ of the day the Lord passed over their first born while still in Egypt....These sacraments themselves do not confer grace; ‘they represent the grace already made’ available to believers. Consequently, sacraments bear no relationship to our salvation. , Just as being baptized does not make one a Christian....The thief on the cross was not baptized nor did he participate in communion, yet the Lord said he would be with Him in Paradise that day.

5.) Sola Scriptura simply stated, is that the Scriptures and the Scriptures alone ‘are sufficien’t to function as the the “rule of faith” for the body of believers which is the church.. All that one must believe to be a Christian is found in Scripture and in no other source. That which is not found in Scripture is not binding upon the Christian conscience....Further..Scripture authority comes God-breathed revelation. Their authority is not dependent upon man, Church or council. The Scriptures are self-consistent, self-interpreting, and self-authenticating. The Christian Church looks at the Scriptures as the only and sufficient rule of faith and the Church is ‘always subject to the Word’....As is written in Timothy 3:16-17, ....”All Scripture is God-breathed, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for instruction, for training in righteousness, in order that the man of God might be complete, fully equipped for every good work.”..Traditions are not God-breathed and, hence, are subject to examination on the part of the higher authority of Scripture.
The Church is not left without the voice of God. Therefore, when the Church listens to Scripture, she is hearing her Lord speaking to her. The authority of the Church then, in teaching, and rebuking, and instructing, is derived, despite Roman Catholic claims to the contrary, from Scripture itself. the Roman position is contradicted by that of the Apostle. ... no other ‘rule of faith’ is necessary so that the man of God is equipped for every good work. No other rule of faith, that is, than the Scriptures.


24 posted on 06/25/2015 8:44:42 PM PDT by caww
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: Morgana

1.) Authority — Only Christ has the authority

2.) History — The proof is here; a lot of people don’t want to accept it.

3.) The Catholic Church gave Christians the Bible— another thing some people don’t want to accept.

4.) The Sacraments are Biblical — everything from Reconciliation/Confession to Eucharist to Anointing of the Sick. Where did Christ work his first miracle? At a wedding, thus giving it sacramental status.

5.) Sola Scriptura is not supported in the Bible — WooHoo!


27 posted on 06/25/2015 9:13:07 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: Morgana
Gospel Mt 7:21-29

Jesus said to his disciples: “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the Kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father in heaven. Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name? Did we not drive out demons in your name? Did we not do mighty deeds in your name?’ Then I will declare to them solemnly, ‘I never knew you. Depart from me, you evildoers.’

“Everyone who listens to these words of mine and acts on them will be like a wise man who built his house on rock. The rain fell, the floods came, and the winds blew and buffeted the house. But it did not collapse; it had been set solidly on rock. And everyone who listens to these words of mine but does not act on them will be like a fool who built his house on sand. The rain fell, the floods came, and the winds blew and buffeted the house. And it collapsed and was completely ruined.”

When Jesus finished these words, the crowds were astonished at his teaching, for he taught them as one having authority, and not as their scribes.

31 posted on 06/25/2015 9:18:42 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: Morgana

The head of the true church is Jesus Christ - anyone else is an impostor.


34 posted on 06/25/2015 9:42:53 PM PDT by impactplayer
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: Morgana
Morgana, I would think that confirmation of the Holy Spirit as to the truth of the Catholic Church would be first on the list. Sadly, it didn't even make the list.

I firmly believe that if one prays to God, asking for direction on which Christian church to join, God will direct him to the church in which he will be of greatest service to his family and fellow men. And...He will know because the Holy Spirit will unmistakably confirm his decision, not only once, but repeatedly throughout his life. In case, there is something almost daily that happens that I **know** I am in the church that Heavenly Father wants for me and His kingdom.

If you have specifically prayed to your Father in Heaven about your decision to be Roman Catholic, and the Holy Spirit has confirmed this decision in your heart, not only once but repeatedly, then this is where you should be.

35 posted on 06/25/2015 9:46:01 PM PDT by wintertime (Stop treating government teachers like they are reincarnated Mother Teresas!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-2021-29 next last

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson