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To: redleghunter; CynicalBear
I really wish that posts, along with the Bible, were read as they say, NOT as the reader WANTS them to say. The gospel of the kingdom: what is given to do in order that a person is declared righteous before God?

The gospel of the grace of God: what is given to do in order that a person is declared righteous before God?

Did Abraham have to believe that Christ died for his sins, was buried and rose again the third day to be declared righteous before God? What about Moses? Or David? Or John the Baptist? Or Matt. Mark Luke John, the little flock of believers, or the hearers of Peter's Pentecost sermon? Were they told what was given by God to do in order to be declared righteous before Him? Where were they told this?

And finally, what about us, now, in this age of the grace of God. Are we told what to do in order to be declared righteous before God? Where are we told this?

Faith is ALWAYS counted for righteousness. Always has been, always will be. But faith in WHAT? Did God demand the same faith from David that He demanded from Abraham? IF he did, then David had a son that God required to be sacrificed. And on and on. Faith will do what God tells you He is requiring of you. And it's always counted for our righteousness, both BEFORE the Cross, although they did not know that their displays of faith all pointed to Christ, and AFTER the Cross. The believers of Israel ALL did was God demanded of them. In order to enter the Kingdom, not the body of Christ. I'm sorry you just cannot see, red.

569 posted on 05/27/2015 1:35:36 PM PDT by smvoice (I would explain it better, but I only know a few words...)
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To: redleghunter; CynicalBear

redleghunter, I cannot help you. That is obvious. You seem unable to even see how important the point is that Peter and the 11 were promised by Christ that they would sit on twelve thrones judging the twelve tribes of Israel when He returns and sets up His kingdom, while Paul was promised nothing of the sort, although YOU claim they all had the same message. It should strike you as odd that this is so. And should send you on a journey through God’s word, if for no other reason than to try to prove me wrong. But you’re ignoring the elephants I’m placing in the room and focusing on the dust bunnies in the corner. This is how I began to understand dispensationalism: by trying to prove someone wrong, I studied and I studied and I found out that I had been wrong, not that person. And I thank God daily for it. I will not be blown around by every wind of doctrine that comes along and I can show you Scripture by Scripture why that is so. I don’t have to make pretzels out of Scriptures in order to “try” to make them fit together and make sense. Example: “Repent and be baptized for the remission of sins.” Was baptism required for the remission sins?


571 posted on 05/27/2015 1:50:57 PM PDT by smvoice (I would explain it better, but I only know a few words...)
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To: smvoice

I’m amazed that people equate different dispensations with different requirements for salvation.


572 posted on 05/27/2015 1:53:43 PM PDT by CynicalBear (For I decided to know nothing among you except Jesus)
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To: smvoice; redleghunter; CynicalBear
Did Abraham have to believe that Christ died for his sins, was buried and rose again the third day to be declared righteous before God? What about Moses? Or David? Or John the Baptist? Or Matt. Mark Luke John, the little flock of believers, or the hearers of Peter's Pentecost sermon? Were they told what was given by God to do in order to be declared righteous before Him? Where were they told this?

I think Jesus told the Apostles the answer to this question.

Matt. 16:18...on this rock I will build My church, and the gates of Hades shall not prevail against it.

During the period Jesus was buried he proclaimed victory to those in Abraham's Bosom (paradise) and the gates of Hades could not stop Him.

Eph. 4:9 Now this, "He ascended"-what does it mean but that He also first decended into the lower parts of the earth?

IOW, prior to the cross those that had faith were in Abraham's Bosom. When Jesus proclaimed victory that faith was perfected in Him.

583 posted on 05/27/2015 5:56:40 PM PDT by wmfights (a stranger in a hostile and foreign land that used to be my home)
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To: smvoice; CynicalBear
The believers of Israel ALL did was God demanded of them. In order to enter the Kingdom, not the body of Christ. I'm sorry you just cannot see, red.

By your comments above, should I conclude that you don't see the Jewish believers in Acts 2 and 3 as part of the church? Put another way: were the Jews and diaspora Jews present on Pentecost, who were pricked in the heart, were they born again washed in the Blood of Jesus Christ believers? Or were they justified by kingdom program?

620 posted on 05/28/2015 9:54:00 AM PDT by redleghunter (1 Peter 1:3-5)
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