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To: Steelfish

OK, you gave it the old college try. Good.

Here is my final response...

“First, God’s Word is Written and Unwritten (John 21:25).”

John 21:25 simply says Christ did a lot more. It doesn’t say this is known to believers. It says he did stuff not recorded in John’s Gospel.

“The Church existed BEFORE the books in the Bible were sorted out as God’s Word”

2/3 were sorted before Christ appeared on earth.
1/3 were debated for a few centuries.

“and were done so under infallible Petrine authority in AD 382 in the Synod of Rome.”

It is the infallible part that is incorrect.

“This infallible authority did not evaporate eleven centuries later with the Reformation.”

Petrine authority never was given and never existed. Yes, I understand Catholics believe it. Hundreds of millions do not.

“Second this interpretative Word of God draws it’s meaning from both the written and unwritten words and acts of Christ. John 21:25 makes this clear as crystal.”

No. What is unwritten is unknown today, unless you can trace it to before 100 ad. Obviously you cannot, or would have posted it along with the list of pauline traditions I’m waiting for.

“Third the sacred oral tradition is a deposit of faith given to the Apostles and their successors- the early Church fathers and successors to Peter.”

No one knows what it is and there is not evidence from before 100 ad of some of the most widely held (and cherished) beliefs, including praying to departed saints.

“Fourth, only the Catholic Church can infallibly set forth and interpret God’s Word, or else we’ll have the heresies of Joel Osteen and Billy Graham, and Jim Jones, Cleflo Dollar and the rest….”

Well, no. Again, you believe it. The Catholic Church has never even published a commentary telling us what every verse means. I suspect Billy Graham has been used to lead more people to Christ than any Catholic you’ve ever met. We will know someday.I don’t confuse heretics like your other two (one cultist, one apparently self-centered, self-aggrandizer Jonesing for a jet. You don’t help your argument when you do that.

“Fifth, there are enough and more scriptural references on inter-cessionary prayer”

We agree that Christians are to pray. That was never in dispute. None of those verses though says Christians should pray to physically dead Christians or Jews.

Even the verse in Revelation doesn’t say if the saints who prayed were the ones under the alter (already physically dead) or on earth. More importantly, those carrying the prayers are never identified as being prayed to.

Best to you.

Ping me when you find the missing list of Pauline Traditions! :-)

I’ll ping you if I find Scriptural evidence for snake handling beyond that one verse.


55 posted on 03/17/2015 7:50:16 PM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion ( "Forward lies the crown, and onward is the goal.")
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To: aMorePerfectUnion

Sorry, I need to add this rejoinder.

“It is the infallible part that is incorrect.”

The entire NT canonical text were sorted out by the early Church fathers under Petrine authority. Is the 2/3rd you are referring to?

So for ELEVEN centuries, saints and martyrs of the Church, to say nothing of theologians whose works to this day are studied in the theological departments of major colleges and universities, all got it wrong including the recent droves of Protestant theologians who after a lifetime of study and research converted to Catholicism? And this Church misled generations of followers despite the assurances of Christ that the gates of hell shall never prevail against the Church he founded?

So what is it you know that these others missed out that you happen to know?


56 posted on 03/17/2015 9:50:57 PM PDT by Steelfish
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