The Lord's Supper: solemn symbolism or corporeal flesh and blood?

Thanks. You’ve had four swings. That’s a lot of gobbly gook on the Real Presence - and not convincing. Frankly, a good lawyer could try to take comments St Ignatius and desperately try to deflect by bringing in the Greeks - but wow, oh wow - do you have a losing hand:

Take note of those who hold heterodox opinions on the grace of Jesus Christ which has come to us, and see how contrary their opinions are to the mind of God… They abstain from the Eucharist and from prayer, because they do not confess that the Eucharist is the Flesh of our Savior Jesus Christ, Flesh which suffered for our sins and which the Father, in his goodness, raised up again. They who deny the gift of God are perishing in their disputes. —Letter to the Smyrnaeans, Ch 6

This isn’t even a swing - it’s a nudge that when you are in a hole, stop digging. Best,

We feed on the Bread of God too. We drink our life from His blood. We really do. Those are spiritual acts, and the "food that perishes" does not produce those acts, neither wafer nor wine.

Good post, and what is ignored is how the metaphorical view is the only one that is consistent with John in particular, and the rest of Scripture. In John we have the temple, birth and water being used of Christ as representing their spiritual counterparts but being misunderstood by the hearers as physical, and which the Lord reveals is spiritual, if not always clearly or even presently, and which requires reading more of Scripture to reveal it.

Nor is the metaphorical view some new thing, for among others, Clement of Alexandria (not that CFs are determinative) writes,

Further release from evils is the beginning of salvation. We then alone, who first have touched the confines of life, are already perfect; and we already live who are separated from death. Salvation, accordingly, is the following of Christ: For that which is in Him is life. John 1:4 "Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that hears My words, and believes in Him that sent Me, has eternal life, and comes not into condemnation, but has passed from death to life." John 5:24 Thus believing alone, and regeneration, is perfection in life; for God is never weak. For as His will is work, and this is named the world; so also His counsel is the salvation of men, and this has been called the church. He knows, therefore, whom He has called, and whom He has saved; and at one and the same time He called and saved them...

As nurses nourish new-born children on milk, so do I also by the Word, the milk of Christ, instilling into you spiritual nutriment..."Wherefore also I have given you milk to drink," he says; meaning, I have instilled into you the knowledge which, from instruction, nourishes up to life eternal. But the expression, "I have given you to drink" (ἐπότισα), is the symbol of perfect appropriation. For those who are full-grown are said to drink, babes to suck. "For my blood," says the Lord, "is true drink." John 6:55 In saying, therefore, "I have given you milk to drink," has he not indicated the knowledge of the truth, the perfect gladness in the Word, who is the milk?

And to this meaning we may secondly accommodate the expression, "I have given you milk to drink, and not given you food, for you are not yet able," regarding the meat not as something different from the milk, but the same in substance. For the very same Word is fluid and mild as milk, or solid and compact as meat. And entertaining this view, we may regard the proclamation of the Gospel, which is universally diffused, as milk; and as meat, faith, which from instruction is compacted into a foundation, which, being more substantial than hearing, is likened to meat, and assimilates to the soul itself nourishment of this kind.

Elsewhere the Lord, in the Gospel according to John, brought this out by symbols, when He said: Eat my flesh, and drink my blood; John 6:34 describing distinctly by metaphor the drinkable properties of faith and the promise, by means of which the Church, like a human being consisting of many members, is refreshed and grows, is welded together and compacted of both—of faith, which is the body, and of hope, which is the soul; as also the Lord of flesh and blood. For in reality the blood of faith is hope, in which faith is held as by a vital principle. And when hope expires, it is as if blood flowed forth; and the vitality of faith is destroyed. ” (Clement of Alexandria, The Paedagogus, Book I; http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/02091.htm)

And Augustine on "Rule for Interpreting Commands and Prohibitions." 24. If the sentence is one of command, either forbidding a crime or vice, or enjoining an act of prudence or benevolence, it is not figurative. If, however, it seems to enjoin a crime or vice, or to forbid an act of prudence or benevolence, it is figurative. "Unless you eat the flesh of the Son of man," says Christ, "and drink His blood, you have no life in you." John 6:53 This seems to enjoin a crime or a vice; it is therefore a figure, enjoining that we should have a share [communicandem] in the sufferings of our Lord, and that we should retain a sweet and profitable memory [in memoria] of the fact that His flesh was wounded and crucified for us. Augustine On Christian Doctrine (Book III, cp. 16) — http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/12023.htm

I thought I replied earlier - sorry. Yes, St Ignatius is for everyone! He is meaningful for all! If you were looking him up, I was speaking here of St Ignatius of Antioch (as opposed to St Ignatius Loyola), as he is cited on the Real Presence in some of the back and forth - I would say in answer to your question that he would be fairly comfortable in the Catholic Church now - albeit, not used to “verus populum” masses (contrary to what a lot of “progressive” Catholics believe, the evidence is pretty strong the early Church celebrated “ad orientem”. St Ignatius, of course, was the first to use the term “Catholic” to describe the church. No, I’m not saying that is the same EXACT Catholic church today - but today’s Church is fairly close to what he believed, in my opinion. The Church is the protector of faith, not individuals reading the Bible and arguing, would be the Catholic answer. This is from the Epistle to the Smyrnaeans:

8. You must all follow the lead of the bishop, as Jesus Christ followed that of the Father; follow the presbytery as you would the Apostles; reverence the deacons as you would God’s commandment. Let no one do anything touching the Church, apart from the bishop. Let that celebration of the Eucharist be considered valid which is held under the bishop or anyone to whom he has committed it. Where the bishop appears, there let the people be, just as where Jesus Christ is, there is the Catholic Church. It is not permitted without authorization from the bishop either to baptize or to hold an agape; but whatever he approves is also pleasing to God. Thus everything you do will be proof against danger and valid.

Best,

The Church is the protector of faith, not individuals reading the Bible and arguing, would be the Catholic answer.

We've heard this Catholic response many times before. Didn't make it true the first time or this time.

No, Almighty God is the protector of the Faith, and the Church Lord Jesus Christ Himself founded fortunately has members who are able to read and preach the Gospel and enabled to go with the Spirit (of the Word) of the Holy Bible and to stand in opposition to every imagination (stronghold) of men that is raised against the Truth, such as Roman Catholicism.

The continued arrogance of Catholics on FR, as opposed to living humbly before God each day, and thinly-veiled desire to control others freedom of religion, as opposed to living in liberty in Christ, reveals its devilish presence in your posts and in others who reflexively defend the (Roman) Catholic church at all costs, irrespective of what God has truly said in His written Word.

When all has been said and done, one's intellect or lack of it is not the means by which one is saved from repayment of his sin-debt and then the second death.

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