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To: CynicalBear
how about considering what God said on the matter?

It is gratuitously offensive to suggest that I have NOT considered what God said on the matter. This sort of cloaked personal attack is rapidly growing old.

You see, we do not think of the sayings of Jesus as a new and demanding law which requires literal observance at the expense of the act itself. Those Protestants who speak most loudly of throwing off the old Law immediately adopt a new one, and use it as a basis to insult those with whom they disagree. Ashes on the forehead are not the issue in what Jesus says.

Jesus described the act of the Pharisee in terms of his motive and expectation. He disfigures his face to garner praise. He receives the praise he seeks and so has his reward.

But it is ridiculous to suggest that because one person marks his face for a bad reason, no one could possibly mark his face for a good reason. Some people maim themselves because they are very mentally ill. Others because they think it an act of piety which will earn merit. But YOUR argument is because SOME people maim themselves for bad reasons, therefore to remove a gangrenous leg would be bad. This is because your argument relies on externals, not unlike the arguments of Muslims. Even in court we are not so superficial and we distinguish between degrees of culpable homicide and even acknowledge that some homicide incurs no guilt. BECAUSE we see that "the object specifies the act," and therefore two different acts can both end up with a dead person at our feet.

But the reasoning trotted out every Lent -- because dissing Catholics is more important to Protestants than praising God and victory in a bogus argument is more valuable the learning the Truth in an honest discussion -- is - "OOH! Pharisees! Disfigured faces. Catholics (and many others) Disfigured faces! So Catholics are Pharisees!"

We are told Jesus and the twelve didn't always wash before they ate. The Pharisees did. I'm guessing most non-Catholics in the US wash their hands before meals. Therefore, according to the organon of this argument, non-Catholics are Pharisees, for they both wash before meals.

Squares have straight sides! Octagons have straight sides! Therefore Squares are Octagons!

You couldn't pay me enough to deal with this.

80 posted on 02/19/2015 9:18:22 AM PST by Mad Dawg (In te, Domine, speravi: non confundar in aeternum.)
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To: Mad Dawg
"But when you fast, put oil on your head and wash your face, 18 so that it will not be obvious to others that you are fasting, but only to your Father, who is unseen; and your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you."

But......suit yourself.

82 posted on 02/19/2015 9:25:12 AM PST by CynicalBear (For I decided to know nothing among you except Jesus)
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To: Mad Dawg
>>we do not think of the sayings of Jesus as a new and demanding law which requires literal observance at the expense of the act itself<<

Jesus didn't say it was a law. He only pointed out the results of doing it one way or the other. Choose the result you want.

84 posted on 02/19/2015 9:27:47 AM PST by CynicalBear (For I decided to know nothing among you except Jesus)
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To: Mad Dawg; CynicalBear
But the reasoning trotted out every Lent -- because dissing Catholics is more important to Protestants than praising God and victory in a bogus argument is more valuable the learning the Truth in an honest discussion -- is - "OOH! Pharisees! Disfigured faces. Catholics (and many others) Disfigured faces! So Catholics are Pharisees!"

We are told Jesus and the twelve didn't always wash before they ate. The Pharisees did. I'm guessing most non-Catholics in the US wash their hands before meals. Therefore, according to the organon of this argument, non-Catholics are Pharisees, for they both wash before meals.

I must say I'm surprised by your visceral reaction to this thread. You don't seem to mind the multitude of Roman Catholic pro-Lent threads - many that DO diss non-Catholics for not observing the time like Catholics do - but pipe up when someone explains why they don't. No one is demeaning the observance of Lent - contrary to the accusing rants - but giving some objective history behind it and defending the reasons why some Christians do not observe it. I marvel that some Catholics here operate with such hair trigger reactors to anything that could possibly imply criticism of their religion that they cannot recognize or respect differing views even when they are expressed in terms that are far from attacking others' contrary beliefs. THAT attitude is common here.

That many Catholics make light of what was probably initially intended to be a solemn time of self reflection and repentance in preparation for the celebration of the resurrection is undeniable. I recall giving up bubblegum as a child. Mom just informed me she was giving up ice cream for Lent. Does anyone really think one day a week without meat is any kind of sacrifice in America? Eating seafood is a treat for most families!

There are genuine times Christians fast and pray - and Scripture never forbids such. But what Jesus denounced was the making a show of ones actions. Sackcloth and ashes, I'm sure, meant a lot more hundreds of years ago and REAL fasting entailed a genuine, personal cost. Walking around at work with a black smudge on ones forehead at work on Ash Wednesday, though, isn't an indicator of what is in a person's heart. Jesus' teaching was that fasting is good but it should be between you and God. It's no one else's business.

90 posted on 02/19/2015 1:17:00 PM PST by boatbums (God is ready to assume full responsibility for the life wholly yielded to Him.)
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