Posted on 12/16/2014 3:17:08 PM PST by Garfunkel Oates
From the article:
"The Rev. Franklin Graham says Christians should never deny Jesus Christ in order to spare their lives from slaughter by terrorists, such as ISIS, and further asserts that doing so would be a betrayal against martyrs who stood strong for their faith, despite persecution.
"Christians have been martyred going all the way back to the Romans when they fed them to the lions. We would be betraying every person who stood for their faith, who stood for Jesus Christ, if we turn our back on Jesus Christ. … I think we take a stand for our faith," Graham said on Fox News' "The Kelly File" when host Megyn Kelly asked if Christians should lie in order to save their lives when confronted with death at the hands of Islamic terrorists."
“Everyone knows there are things and situations more precious than life, and there are things and situations worse than death.”
Mencius
I may not have the courage if I am put to the test, but I will not make excuses for myself if I prove a coward. God forgive me if I do!
You are mistaken. The Bible says if you deny Christ before men, he will deny you before his father in heaven.
They will likely get me in the end—but not while betraying the Lord. I hope to be surrounded by piles of hot brass and the bloody corpses of my enemies.
Graham is correct.
A Christian doesn’t plan ahead of time to go against God’s word as part of a strategy.
Is it true that some give in to fear? Yes.
Is it true that this is not the unforgiveable sin? Yes.
But we never plan on giving in.
There will come a day when willingly denying Christ and receiving the mark of the Beast WILL be an unforgiveable affront. In the meantime, we don’t train our young to be fickle about their relationship with Jesus.
You can be coy. Jesus was... “Jesus is not the prophet of God!” (Messiah yes, prophet no.)
“Let’s say ISIS captures you and your choice is denounce God until you get rescued or die? I think God would be ok with you telling some stinking Muslims what they want to hear so you can survive to see your family, He knows what is in your heart.”
Well, for a Christian, death is not a penalty to be avoided, it’s a reward. Especially if you have the opportunity to die in that situation, taking a stand for the name of Christ. You are guaranteed a great reward for that deed.
Yes, I’m sure God would understand if someone’s love for their family, or feelings of responsibility towards them would not let them make that decision. He did forgive Peter, after all. However, that is the more worldly choice to make in that situation.
Some reeking Muslim asking you if you believe in Christ is the same thing as if Old Hob himself were asking.
I’d like to think I’d pass the test that Peter failed.
He did OK though. They made him Pope.
Of course, he was crucified upside down in the end.
‘Quo Vadis?’
You don’t know until you are put in the spot. I pray it never happens.
No guarantee the same would happen to someone who's fallen into the hands of Muslims, but should it ever happen to me, I hope I would have the strength to say "No!"
“Jesus is not so neurotic or self-important that he would sponsor death so that his followers would not renounce him by mouth, if not in their hearts, to save their lives.”
Well, really there is no “death” at the hands of the men of this world for Christians. Remember, we are told not to fear them that can only harm our bodies? We are only to fear the one that has power over our soul?
If Christ would have us deny Him to save our (earthly) lives, I think we would see more positive examples of that in the New Testament, as the apostles had many opportunities to demonstrate it for us. Instead, we have the opposite. There is one apostle who does just that to save himself, and Christ rebukes him for it. Then, all the other apostles and disciples make the wiser choice.
“He rejects their demand. They spare him because of his strong faith.”
The muslims probably would not spare you for that, but they may respect you for it. There were two ISIS captives recently that were held together. One of them submitted to the ISIS demands to convert to Islam, and the other refused, and stood fast in his Christianity. Afterwards, the muslims denigrated the convert and abused him more, while saying that the Christian was the upright man.
Graham should be even more insistent. There is no Once Saved Always Saved. We must persevere in the faith to be finally saved. Do not be deceived into imagining you will have eternal life if you deny Jesus is LORD and Christ to save your sorry life by apostatizing to Islam. Do not be one of the fearful. Have faith and persevere. Fare thee well.
24 Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me. 25 For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it. 26 For what is a man profited, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul? 27 For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.
10 Fear none of those things which thou shalt suffer: behold, the devil shall cast some of you into prison, that ye may be tried; and ye shall have tribulation ten days: be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life. 11 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; He that overcometh shall not be hurt of the second death.
5 He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels. 6 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.
8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
Where’d you get off to? This is your thread.
Sure, coyness, and even outright dishonesty, is not condemned by God if it is for a good cause. Take the example of Abraham lying about his relationship to Sarah in an attempt to protect her in the Old Testament.
However, what is the “good cause” in denying Christ? Perhaps if you can save others’ lives by doing so, I can see that. However, if it is only to save yourself, then I think that is a sin of selfishness and worldliness.
“I would maintain that once someone is truly saved and “in Christ” that they cannot be “unsaved”.”
That may be so, but only Christ knows if they were ever truly saved in the first place.
I would leave the subject of this thread ... in that same category, then ... :-) ...
“Every believer in Lord Jesus Christ, born again of the Spirit, knows for certain he/she has been saved”
And a great many unbelievers will say they know for certain just the same. Yet, when the day comes, Christ will say “I never knew you.”
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