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To: editor-surveyor
>>> You appear to believe that it is impossible to keep Torah, is that so?

It is possible to keep the Torah, but not to perfection... which IS the standard for holiness.

Recall the rich man who approached Jesus and asked what he needed to do to gain eternal life:

Mat 19:16
And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life? And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments. He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself. The young man saith unto him, All these things have I kept from my youth up: what lack I yet? Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me. But when the young man heard that saying, he went away sorrowful: for he had great possessions.

You see, the rich man THOUGHT he was perfect.
Jesus showed him that he actually was not.
The rich man was unwilling to part with his possessions.
The rich man was relying upon his own righteousness.
Keep reading in that same passage... you will see that
salvation is a gift of God that cannot be earned with deeds or righteousness.

>>> Nobody here has said that we are saved by keeping his commandments; we have old sins that have to be forgiven to be saved, but he who keeps on sinning (transgressing Torah) after learning Yeshua's Way will not be saved. Hebrews 6 is no joke, nor is Matthew 7:23, nor Romans 2.

Actually, you did say it. You said that those who are righteous get the pass. However, in reference to past versus future sins, it does not make sense that Christs sacrifice on the cross would apply to only those sins committed up to the time of conversion, because the believer would then be held to a higher standard than the unbeliever... without the benefit of incorruptibility which we don't receive until the death of our corrupted body. In as far as consequences go which you referenced in Hebrews 6, etc., "death" in scripture does not always refer to eternal damnation. It often refers to physical destruction of the body. If I continue in sin, even after God warns me to stop, He most certainly will end my time on earth even though my place in heaven is secure.
153 posted on 11/18/2014 5:26:16 PM PST by Safrguns (PM me if you like to play Minecraft!)
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To: Safrguns; editor-surveyor
...However, in reference to past versus future sins, it does not make sense that Christs sacrifice on the cross would apply to only those sins committed up to the time of conversion, because the believer would then be held to a higher standard than the unbeliever...

Paul says it best in his letter to Rome... and proves the OBVIOUS error and presumptions of E-S

Romans 7: 13 Did that which is good, then, become death to me? By no means! Nevertheless, in order that sin might be recognized as sin, it used what is good to bring about my death, so that through the commandment sin might become utterly sinful.

14 We know that the law is spiritual; but I am unspiritual, sold as a slave to sin. 15 I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. 16 And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. 17 As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. 18 For I know that good itself does not dwell in me, that is, in my sinful nature.[c] For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. 19 For I do not do the good I want to do, but the evil I do not want to do—this I keep on doing. 20 Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.

21 So I find this law at work: Although I want to do good, evil is right there with me. 22 For in my inner being I delight in God’s law; 23 but I see another law at work in me, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within me. 24 What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body that is subject to death? 25 Thanks be to God, who delivers me through Jesus Christ our Lord!

So then, I myself in my mind am a slave to God’s law, but in my sinful nature a slave to the law of sin.

8: 1 Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus, 2 because through Christ Jesus the law of the Spirit who gives life has set you free from the law of sin and death. 3 For what the law was powerless to do because it was weakened by the flesh, God did by sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh to be a sin offering. And so he condemned sin in the flesh, 4 in order that the righteous requirement of the law might be fully met in us, who do not live according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. ...

154 posted on 11/18/2014 5:34:01 PM PST by WVKayaker (Impeachment is the Constitution's answer for a derelict, incompetent president! -Sarah Palin 7/26/14)
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