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To: annalex
“If the Turks were not stopped at Vienna, the liberation of the Balkans would not be feasible, and that was Catholic West that stopped them.”

Where does that come from? We were left to the tender mercies of the Turks. We liberated much of Greece in the Greek War of Independence. Various other uprisings of local peoples liberated certain other ares until the Balkan Wars of 1912-1913 when we, contrary to the efforts of the West, we ran the Turks out of Europe.

“The sack of Constantinople was indeed a disaster, but so was the deliberate on the part of Byzantium failure of the Florentine Union, which was the proximate cause of the fall of the City.”

So, had we as the Laos tou Theou, agreed, as so many of our miserable hierarchs did, to grovel before the feet of the Bishop of Rome, all would have been well? I heard one of your more arrogant cardinals make that claim at a meeting of Orthodox and Latin hierarchs and laity. He was hooted down and left red faced. His remarks are often trotted out when talks get going on reunion.

27 posted on 09/10/2014 12:27:54 PM PDT by Kolokotronis (Christ is Risen, and you, o death, are annihilated)
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To: Kolokotronis
Where does that come from?

The basic information is here: Battle of Vienna .

In the aftermath, Hungary and Transylvania were liberated and the Turks no longer were a threat to Western and Central Europe. Russia achieved dominance over its southern borders as well, and in 19 c. liberated Bulgaria. This is what I mean by Catholic West and Russia stopping the Turkish expansion. That Turkey still commands Constantinople and its European territories is unfortunate, but if the victory at the gate of Vienna did not occur, Turkey would still be a major player in Europe, with the Italian, Hungarian, Austrian and Romanian nations lowered to the condition of Bosnia and Albania. Certainly the collapse of the Turkish rule in Greece would not have occurred, regardless of the bravery of the Greeks.

had we as the Laos tou Theou, agreed, as so many of our miserable hierarchs did, to grovel before the feet of the Bishop of Rome, all would have been well?

The pivot between the "mitres" and the "turbans" was not invented by "our arrogant cardinals"; that was the conscious choice of the ruling class of Byzantium. They chose the turbans. What the status of Constantinople would have been if the Florentine Union had held, we do not know, but again, Catholic countries such as Austria and Hungary fought off the aggression, and Orthodox Greece that refused the union did not.

28 posted on 09/10/2014 1:25:50 PM PDT by annalex (fear them not)
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