The Ancient Mass in the “House Churches” was not as Informal as Many Think

Archdiocese of Washington ^ | 8/19/2014 | Msgr. Charles Pope

[LearsFool]

God's instructions to the Jews regarding worship were to be obeyed because He is God. (I know you already knew that. :-)

One reason for that specificity was that the tabernacle, the temple, and the worship would foreshadow, in their physicality, the heavenly things which would come with the Messiah:

"...who serve the copy and shadow of the heavenly things, as Moses was divinely instructed when he was about to make the tabernacle. For He said, 'See that you make all things according to the pattern shown you on the mountain.'" - Hebrews 8:5

If Moses had not followed that pattern God had shown him, if he had substituted some ideas of his own, that would've marred and distorted "the copy and shadow of the heavenly things." And so we find another reason why it was vital to follow God's instructions on worship, rather than inventing their own - as was done by those Ezekiel was shown, which things God called abominations. (Read all of Ezek. 8 to see more...incense, icons, etc.)

(Consider also the sin of Aaron's sons Nadab and Abihu, Korah and his followers, King Saul's sacrifices and Samuel's rebuke, Jereboam's golden calves at Dan and Bethel, etc.)

Hebrews explains in much detail how that copy and shadow represented the heavenly things we now possess. And you'll recall Jesus' conversation with the Samaritan woman at the well:

"The woman said to Him, 'Sir, I perceive that You are a prophet. Our fathers worshiped on this mountain, and you Jews say that in Jerusalem is the place where one ought to worship.' Jesus said to her, 'Woman, believe Me, the hour is coming when you will neither on this mountain, nor in Jerusalem, worship the Father. You worship what you do not know; we know what we worship, for salvation is of the Jews. But the hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth; for the Father is seeking such to worship Him. God is Spirit, and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truth.'" - John 4

God's instructions on worship changed with Jesus' institution of the new covenant. And just as those under the old covenant, we are to obey them because He is God.

I hope I've explained that well enough - even if you disagree. If I haven't, please let me know and I'll try again.

[LearsFool]

.....And what is it I do ask?

If you're asking what the abomination was, it's what Ezekiel describes in the verse cited. There are other abominations described in the rest of Ezek. 8.

Or did I misunderstand your question?

[Mrs. Don-o]

There are detailed instruction for public worship in the OT, with pages and pages about the proper architecture, furnishings, curtains, tapestries, embroidered and bejewelled priestly vestments, carved and ornamented walls and doors, statues of cherubim, golden vessels for the altar, beautiful candlesticks, incense, chanting, etc. This imagery reappears, in a somewhat huger scale,in the visions of Heaven found in Daniel, Ezechiel, and Revelation of St. John.

It appears that truly liturgical worship is approved in Heaven.

[EC1]

No, my friend, I sort of get it. Thank you for taking the time to respond.

Going to have to think about it for a while though. These things - though they be a matter of life and death - can be taken slowly.

[LearsFool]

Though I sometimes long for the ornamentality and beauty of physical things (as the Jews had), I’m content with the heavenly things God has granted His children in this life (i.e. Jesus’ priesthood and intercession, etc.), and to wait on Him to bring me into the full enjoyment of the promised heavenly things after this life is over. (The physical things seem so shabby in comparison, don’t they?)

So I’ll suppress my shallow desires for dim copies of the physical kind, and instead follow Jesus when He says to “worship in spirit and in truth.”

[Biggirl]

What is seen in the liturgy is simply a preview of what will take place in Heaven.

[Biggirl]

It is okay to ask questions.

[Biggirl]

Post 23 God does give us hints how worship will take place in Heaven and also that we see on earth is simply a preview.

[Mrs. Don-o]

I think you may be leaning toward a false dichotomy: an idea that these two things --- public liturgical worship, and worship "in spirit and in truth" --- exclude each other.

Actually, there are a number of ways to pray, beautiful and sincere and God-pleasing ways, taught by precept and by example in the Bible.

The Psalms illustrate this: some grandly liturgical, some intensely private and personal (and yet sung in public, with instructions for the musicians).

You have Jesus going off my himself to pray in the mountains; also praying in the Temple and carefully observing the Temple Holy Days.

You have contemplative prayer ("Be still and know that I am God") and you have prophetic rants against the Almighty (Jeremiah: "You duped me! And I let myself be duped!")

Yes, agreed, you are thinking rightly when you say "I’ll suppress my shallow desires for dim copies of the physical kind," but nobody should think that liturgical prayer is shallow or dim.

It IS physical --- and spiritual --- just as WE are physical and spiritual. God does not scorn our senses, our yearning for the "taste and see." He creaed these yearnngs. He became incarnate to fulfill them. And liturgical prayer --- just like prayer n your closet that makes your knees ache --- is prayer incarnate.

[Mrs. Don-o]

I like how you communicate.

[Springfield Reformer]

Context, context, context:

(KJV)Ezekiel 8:15-17
Then said he unto me, Hast thou seen this , O son of man? turn thee yet again, and thou shalt see greater abominations than these. [16] And he brought me into the inner court of the Lord’s house, and, behold, at the door of the temple of the Lord , between the porch and the altar, were about five and twenty men, with their backs toward the temple of the Lord , and their faces toward the east; and they worshipped the sun toward the east. [17] Then he said unto me, Hast thou seen this , O son of man? Is it a light thing to the house of Judah that they commit the abominations which they commit here? for they have filled the land with violence, and have returned to provoke me to anger: and, lo, they put the branch to their nose.

So we see here God is exposing false worship occurring right in the heart of the true temple. They prayed to the east because in truth they worshipped the sun. This passage is not a good one to justify directional prayer.

I suspect the facility at Dura, if indeed it suggests praying to the east, was coming under the influence of pagan practices. One cannot assume that the late-appearing practices of one house church were normative from the beginning, or even normative for all Christians of that later period. Only God knows all the worship offered to Him in the name of Jesus during that period. No doubt much of it was done in secret, nondescript settings of which we have no known physical record today.

Which is why it is impossible to establish a norm apart from Scripture. We know what we were explicitly told to do to worship God as Christians. Building a liturgical layer on top of that, involving practices clearly more aligned with pagan beliefs than Christian, is a bridge too far. It is a danger to the soul. We have no right to assume we can add to God’s directives for worship. Consider what happened to Nadab and Abihu, who offered “strange fire” to God. No matter how sincere their offering might have been, it was not according to the word God had given, and so was rejected by God. That’s a risk I’m not willing to take.

Peace,

SR

[Kenny Bunk]

With Christians being crucified, beheaded, tortured, and sold into slavery around the Muslim world, it is good to see Monsignor focused so firmly on research of the early Church's ceremonial practices.

Perhaps he would be so kind as to favour us next with a learned monograph on the Filioque Clause?

If I may quote a Roman friend:
Bravissimo caro Monsignore, ma che cazzo fai?

[Zionist Conspirator]

I do always wonder if this almost obsession with facing east in all the Abrahamic religions came out of Egypt or Sumeria - both of whom reverenced the rising sun. Or is it something deeper?

Only chrstians face east as a matter of principal. Moslems face Mecca and Jews face Jerusalem. Both just happen to be east of here.

[Biggirl]

Thank-you and God Bless!

[Biggirl]

BINGO! We have a winner!

Can you please cite in English what the Latin saying means. Thank-you and God Bless.

At a time when we are seeing the world go crazy, articles like this one give me confort.

[Biggirl]

Plus also it would not surprise me if Msgr. Pope may have had over the years done by maybe leading pilgrimage tours to the lands made famous by the Bible and it may have helped him as well.

[Biggirl]

Rather, to correct you, we should all thank God for the gift of the sun and sunrises.

[Kenny Bunk]

Biggie, I refuse to translate everyday expressions which should be known by every educated person (of a somewhat raffish nature.)

Real Romans, BTW, speak neither Latin nor Italian unless necessary, but Rugantino, their very pungent dialect.

[Biggirl]

Did a translation:

“Bravissimo dear lord, what the h*** are you doing?”

[Salvation]

This reminds me of some of what St. Justin Martyr has written. The entire Mass was thee — well almost all of it.