RCIA depends far too much on the diocese - which is how the Church was set up millennia ago. The texts range from mediocre to atrocious. I agree with you.
Basic Protestant assumptions, which are 180 degrees removed from those of Catholicism, are never dealt with. Those three magical assertions are supposed to make everything all hunky dory. They don't. They simply, in Protestant eyes, deprive chrstianity of all the reasons Protestants think chrstianity ever existed in the first place. Hint: Not only your purgatory, but your idea of "heaven" is alien to Protestants.
Agreed, again. The Protestant view of 'heaven' is the position of seating in the celestial football stadium.
I was forced on my own to do a lot of reading to answer the questions I had, and it led to nothing but torment, as none of the answers ever made any sense. I specifically investigated the Catholic doctrine of inspiration and read that dictation was heretical, as was its counterpart on the left, "mere assistance." This makes the "true" Catholic understanding of inspiration fit into a huge spectrum of nothingness, minus the only two understandings that actually say something. So yes, I do not believe Catholics believe, or even are allowed to believe, in "dictation" of the Torah.
Oddly enough, I spoke on this to the intermediate school relious education class last spring. With the priest and deacon both there. With their approval. Of course, our bishop and I have tangled in public on the Catholic faith and the diocesan establishment. On television (heh heh heh).
And I will tell you something else: I'm sick and tired of "conservative" Catholics like yourself claiming to believe in "dictation" and yet never uttering one peep of protest when your co-religionists blatantly deny or laugh at the notion that the story of the Flood might actually be true. Where are you, MarkBsner? Over somewhere hiding in the corner, looking at your watch and pretending it didn't happen?
I don't have a lot of time for FR due to a change in career and escalating responsibilities with five kids at home. If you wish to note what you consider to be posts that contain ideas contrary to the word of God, please let me know. I have no problem confronting Catholics and have done so many times on FR. However, I do it in private, not in the public forum, for the sake of onlookers' satisfaction.
Oh really? Well, here is an article posted by a co-religionist of yours and written by another which insists that G-d did not "really" command the extermination of the Canaanites (men, women, children, and animals) because that would be mean, and since He is bound by "natural law," G-d can't do anything "mean," so therefore the books of both Deuteronomy and Joshua are in error in claiming doing so was G-d's will.
Did you even read the article? It posed it as a possibility, while acknowledging that it was in no way a definite conclusion. You and I have known each other here for a long time. I don't post speculative stuff like this. I realize that people might and do not begrudge them this; however, claiming that this article is the Gospel Truth, assuming that I actually see it, would normally get me involved.
Do you care to make a comment? Do you care to defend the integrity of the books of Deuteronomy and Joshua on that thread? No? Oh, something suddenly came up.
I will defend the integrity of Deuteronomy as what God wanted Moses to know. I will consider Joshua down a notch. God did not dictate Joshua.
Please cease these absurd and patently false claims that Catholics "believe" the Bible. At the very least don't cry and moan because I disproved your assertions to your face.
You've done no such thing. Individual Catholics such as Pelosi and Biden are as irrelevant to the Church as are the secular Jews like Carl Sagan, Woody Allen, Bill Maher and Howard Stern.
Courtesy ping to NYer.
Likewise. I know that you are disappointed in the Church. We have had conversation before on this. Believe it or not, it does distress me.
It's much deeper than that. In Fundamentalist Protestantism "heaven" is a holding area for disembodied souls awaiting the resurrection of the body and the return to a material paradise earth--the way we were actually supposed to live in the first place. So far from being the "final purpose" of our existence and something even an unfallen Adam would experience, the whole thing is a contingency. And because paradise earth is man's natural state, no purgation is required to enter either it or the heavenly "holding area;" this would make as much sense as saying Adam would have had to be purified before he could have been created! Once one accepts J*sus' vicarious damnation in one's place, there's simply no where else to go.
Oddly enough, I spoke on this to the intermediate school relious education class last spring. With the priest and deacon both there. With their approval. Of course, our bishop and I have tangled in public on the Catholic faith and the diocesan establishment. On television (heh heh heh).
You're a brave man. I still have the four letters sent to me by the late Archbishop Whelan of Hartford, Connecticut during my written correspondence with him. He was most singularly unsympathetic.
I don't have a lot of time for FR due to a change in career and escalating responsibilities with five kids at home. If you wish to note what you consider to be posts that contain ideas contrary to the word of God, please let me know. I have no problem confronting Catholics and have done so many times on FR. However, I do it in private, not in the public forum, for the sake of onlookers' satisfaction.
Mark, I'm so sorry I bit your head off. I'm just so blasted rubbed raw by the more conservative Catholics here never saying anything and claiming to never notice anything, when I can find plenty of stuff easily. And of course you don't confront people publicly, though it might do some good to simply publicly post a contrary opinion without chewing anyone out. I've been dealing with something as well during the past four months; hopefully this will be through tomorrow.
Did you even read the article? It posed it as a possibility, while acknowledging that it was in no way a definite conclusion. You and I have known each other here for a long time. I don't post speculative stuff like this. I realize that people might and do not begrudge them this; however, claiming that this article is the Gospel Truth, assuming that I actually see it, would normally get me involved.
It always struck me as peculiarly strange that the "ancient unchangeable church" produces so much "speculation" such as this while Fundamentalist Protestantism does not. Where does this itch for novelty come from? No such article would ever appear in Sword of the Lord, for example. Why are "heretical" Fundamentalist Protestants satisfied with what G-d says while the church of billions of illiterate peasants simply cannot leave things alone without doubting and questioning everything? Is there any way you can explain this to me so that I can understand it? Is the need to prove "we're not like those awful people" so great?
I will defend the integrity of Deuteronomy as what God wanted Moses to know. I will consider Joshua down a notch. God did not dictate Joshua.
I am most astounded to read that statement from a Catholic, I admit.
I know that you are disappointed in the Church. We have had conversation before on this. Believe it or not, it does distress me.
Thank you, Mark. As hard as this may be to believe, I really appreciate that.