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To: Penn4God
From the story

“It came down to zoning and proper permitting,” said Vicki Hill, the chief assistant city prosecutor. “Any time you are holding a gathering of people continuously as he does — we have concerns about people being able to exit the facility properly in case there is a fire — and that’s really all this comes down to.”

“He built a structure that he said wasn’t a church — that is in fact — a church,” she said. “It’s a church.”

And the courts agreed — noting in a Jan. 4, 2010 ruling: “The state is not saying the Salmans can’t run a church or have worship services at the location. But the state is saying that if they do so, they must do it properly and in accord with fire and zoning codes.”

He has 4 acres, so it sounds like he has the room to accomodate the people - he is just not abiding by the zoning rules.

5 posted on 07/06/2012 8:30:53 PM PDT by Hodar (A man can fail many times, but he isn't a failure until he begins to blame somebody else.- Burroughs)
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To: Hodar

Michael Salman · Western Theological Seminary
“I would like everyone to notice the statement of the Assistant Chief Prosecutor for the City. As long as we were using the building as a Gameroom we are O.K. It is when we start using it to host worship with our friends it is wrong. I would like everyone else to notice that the building was built in 2009 and we were told by the city in 2007 that even a Bible Study in a living room is a “Church”. To the city any religious gathering like a Passover Supper, Bible Study or any other religious gathering on a property makes the property a “Church.” I dare someone to ask Mrs. Hill what is the definition of a “Church”? We never hid the fact that we worship at my home and that we do what every other Christian does on Sunday and the inside of the building even looks like Christians gather in it. The fact is the City has no right to prohibit what my wife and I who gather privately with my family and friends unless they can show that our guest have caused a neighborhood nuisance, by traffic, parking or noise. They had no right since 2007 to tell me to stop having bible studies in my home and they had no right by the Fire Department to break up our Passover Supper with my family and friends. Please share!”


6 posted on 07/06/2012 8:32:24 PM PDT by Penn4God (Secularism = acid that burns through everything it touches.)
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To: Hodar

So what would happen if he just had a picnic for a few of his friends and they read the Bible while they were all gathered together. Our church has neighborhood prayer groups all over our city in private homes on a weekly basis. I also host a monthly girls night out at my home. Our group has grown to 26 so there are always lots of cars. Lots of our neighbors host weekly bridge game nights and books clubs. Don’t understand what the big deal is. And we have an HOA.


14 posted on 07/06/2012 8:56:04 PM PDT by Grams A (The Sun will rise in the East in the morning and God is still on his throne.)
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To: Hodar
He has 4 acres, so it sounds like he has the room to accomodate the people - he is just not abiding by the zoning rules.

Looked at AZ's Constitution; it's not very favorable to him as some other state's are (TN & NM come to mind).

Art II, Section 12.
The liberty of conscience secured by the provisions of this constitution shall not be so construed as to excuse acts of licentiousness, or justify practices inconsistent with the peace and safety of the state. No public money or property shall be appropriated for or applied to any religious worship, exercise, or instruction, or to the support of any religious establishment. No religious qualification shall be required for any public office or employment, nor shall any person be incompetent as a witness or juror in consequence of his opinion on matters of religion, nor be questioned touching his religious belief in any court of justice to affect the weight of his testimony.

22 posted on 07/06/2012 9:30:42 PM PDT by OneWingedShark (Q: Why am I here? A: To do Justly, to love mercy, and to walk humbly with my God.)
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To: Hodar
According to Phoenix New Times, the property is 1.5 acres, not 4, and he's been hosting 40 people. I could see that creating issues with neighbors.

If parking is really the issue, he could have sidestepped it easily by working something out with a nearby business to allow worshipers to park in their parking lot on Sunday morning, and have two or three cars shuttle people over.

50 posted on 07/07/2012 5:19:05 AM PDT by PapaBear3625 (If I can't be persuasive, I at least hope to be fun.)
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