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To: metmom

-— The church is not an entity which can speak for itself, as in a being. It’s an assembly of believers and is visible only in that people who make it up are visible.——

So when Jesus commanded us to take disputes “to the church,” which “assembly of believers” did He mean?

How could he be speaking of any “assembly of believers,” if they taught contradictory doctrines?

The only logical possibility is that He was referring to the Church that He founded, “the pillar and foundation of truth,” the Church that the gates of hell would not prevail against.

Clearly, if during His public ministry He instructed His followers to take their disagreements to the Church, His Church was existant —it was built. It enjoyed authoritative teaching authority. And it must still exist.

And It must teach inerrant doctrine, since God is truth.


280 posted on 02/09/2012 8:13:27 AM PST by St_Thomas_Aquinas
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To: St_Thomas_Aquinas
How could he be speaking of any “assembly of believers,” if they taught contradictory doctrines?

Whatever the local assembly of believers is.

Because they use the same Scripture.

Matthew 18:15-17 15 “If your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault, between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother. 16 But if he does not listen, take one or two others along with you, that every charge may be established by the evidence of two or three witnesses. 17 If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church. And if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector.

And what might doctrinal differences have to do with dealing with a person who sins against you?

What is and is not sin is pretty well spelled out in Scripture.

What Jesus is simply doing here is giving the procedure for settling issues of sin, when someone has sinned against another. The person offended is responsible to approach the one who offended him and try to make it right.

If that doesn't work, then they are to get two or three witnesses.

The step after that is to go to the local assembly to try for reconciliation.

Why would doctrinal issues between churches enter into it? How would they be relevant?

281 posted on 02/09/2012 3:44:30 PM PST by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
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To: St_Thomas_Aquinas
Clearly, if during His public ministry He instructed His followers to take their disagreements to the Church, His Church was existant —it was built.

That's just an assumption, an opinion.

It enjoyed authoritative teaching authority.

No it didn't because Jesus was still walking the planet at that time and HE was the authoritative teacher.

When He left, He gave believers the Holy Spirit as the authoritative teacher, and Scripture was available.

The church had no power, however, until the day of Pentecost as the Holy Spirit had not come yet, so the church could not have had authoritative teaching privileges.

And it must still exist.

Of course the body of Christ still exists. Where ever there are believers there is the church.

And It must teach inerrant doctrine, since God is truth.

Only Scripture is inerrant. Any one person or groups interpretation of Scripture for doctrine cannot be inerrant because God is beyond our comprehension. To claim that one's doctrine is inerrant is to lock God in a church box.

282 posted on 02/09/2012 3:52:52 PM PST by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
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