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I just want to be clear, when you look up into the night sky and aim a telescope at Saturn, do you really believe that Saturn is exactly where you are pointing the telescope?

That's an ambiguous question because you don't describe whether you're talking about time-light-correction or which type off aberration. But all along I've said that if the sun were orbiting the earth at 2.13 degrees per 8.5 minutes, that there would be a 2.13 degree lag in the optical appearance of the sun. So since Saturn is moving, due to orbiting the sun, then light from Saturn will have the light-time-correction apparent angular displacement. But we're talking about the SUN here which is NOT orbiting the earth! And we're talking about 2.1 degrees of displacement, which is NOT light-time-correction. (light-time correction is very small and nowheres near 2.1 degrees and is unrelated to the distance from sun to earth.) You're just trying to change the topic here!

The Gyro, LRG and pendulum are essentially the same thing

Okay I had to laugh about that one. Have you ever seen either a pendulum or a LRG? Essentially the same thing? Well, yeah, I guess if you take a 747 jet plane and a bicycle to be the same thing. They move you from one place to the other. While you're moving you're not standing on the ground, and when you're standing on the ground, you're not moving. Essentially the same thing. I always knew it.

But seriously, a pendulum and a LRG are so different, even though they may be able to detect the same thing. A pendulum uses a moving mass, and measures physical deflection from its ordinary path, and the speed of the swing is irrelevant. A LRG on the other hand, has no moving parts, does not use the mass of anything but rather the speed of light and the interference thereof. I don't know how you can call a LRG with no moving parts a third body when its buried 10 feet deep. I think what you really wanted to say is "Without any instrument or means by which one can measure the rate of rotation, they are unable to measure the rate of rotation." But just because you deprive us from using any instruments which can measure rotation doesn't mean it isn't there!

and if you add them in you are adding in a third body and unnecessarily complicating the model. Generally, the best way to understand something is to keep it as simple as possible.

Yeah right, then why do you keep talking about all these other planets which are more complicated because they are orbiting the sun! I say lets keep it simple, and discuss the sun and your alledged 2.1 degrees of lag between the angle of light as it hits the earth and angle of the gravity from the sun.

Thanks,

-Jesse

So since Saturn is moving, due to orbiting the sun, then light from Saturn will have the light-time-correction apparent angular displacement. But we're talking about the SUN here which is NOT orbiting the earth! And we're talking about 2.1 degrees of displacement, which is NOT light-time-correction. (light-time correction is very small and nowheres near 2.1 degrees and is unrelated to the distance from sun to earth.) You're just trying to change the topic here!

LOL The 2.1 degrees is is exactly related to the light-time correction and the distance of the earth from the the sun. If the Sun was closer the angle would be smaller, and if the sun was further away the angle would be larger.

Okay I had to laugh about that one. Have you ever seen either a pendulum or a LRG? Essentially the same thing? Well, yeah, I guess if you take a 747 jet plane and a bicycle to be the same thing. They move you from one place to the other. While you're moving you're not standing on the ground, and when you're standing on the ground, you're not moving. Essentially the same thing. I always knew it.

Whether you are moving or not depends on your reference doesn't it? And yes the same basic principle applies to a pendulum, gyro or LRG : )

A LRG on the other hand, has no moving parts, does not use the mass of anything but rather the speed of light and the interference thereof.

Light, is the moving part in the LRG and it doesn't measure the speed of light, it measures the frequency, the speed of light is constant. A gyro doesn't measure the mass either : )

[mrjesse to LeGrande] I don't know how you can call a LRG with no moving parts a third body when its buried 10 feet deep. I think what you really wanted to say is "Without any instrument or means by which one can measure the rate of rotation, they are unable to measure the rate of rotation." But just because you deprive us from using any instruments which can measure rotation doesn't mean it isn't there!

We will soon discover that clocks, measuring rods, protractors, sextants, telescopes, and even Newton's laws are "third bodies", and thus, not allowed. We will also discover that the bodies are not really "bodies" but some magical substance that atheists like to think about that isn't made of molecules and isn't prone to rotational oblateness. Maybe the same stuff leprechauns are made of. And that the force holding these "bodies" together isn't gravity, but some magic power that can do anything LeGrande wants and can't be detected. In the end we will learn the following significant nugget of atheist wisdom: if there is no way for you to determine something, there is no way for you to determine something. And, from this, it immediately follows that the Sun revolves around the Earth, the moon is 2.1 degrees from the Sun during an eclipse, and everything is made of nothing.