Why Evangelicals are Returning to Rome

CIC ^ | April 2008 | Bob DeWaay

[Petronski]

Christ founded the Catholic Church. Sola scriptura and sola fide, however, were made up by a rebellious, egotistical German monk.

[LiteKeeper]

sola Scriptura Dittos!

[swmobuffalo]

“Christ founded the Catholic Church.”

No scriptural basis for “Catholic Church”. However there is plenty for catholic church as in “pertaining to the whole Christian body or church.”

First one founded by man, second one founded by Christ.

[fishtank]

That “through Mary” phrase really torques me.

Full disclosure, I was born and raised RCC.

[fishtank]

One small reason for this is evangelical orgs like the Navigators hiring people like Brennan Manning to be their chief (false) teacher.

[fishtank]

Hmmm.

Do you know what convinced me to leave the RCC?

- Reading what the apostle Peter had to say about the Word, Christ, and being born again.

[Petronski]

Catholic Church founded by Christ, many people left it thinking they had a better idea, His Catholic Church remains.

[Petronski]

You are free to believe whatever error you want.

[mike182d]

What I find amusing is how the obvious issue is being missed entirely.

Shouldn't the larger issue for the author be that when Protestants research the first thousand years of Christianity, they do not find any trace of their core beliefs?

Wouldn't those closest to Christ, His death, and Resurrection be in a better position to interpret what Christ meant than a man sixteen hundred years after the fact? Or even a contemporary "bible-believing" church two thousand years after the fact?

Why, when Evangelicals search the "ancient" Church, do they find beliefs that contradict their own? If an evangelical "church" is the "true church" of Christ, shouldn't they find validation of their beliefs in the first thousand years of Christianity?

[mike182d]

Hmmm.
Do you know what convinced me to leave the RCC?
- Reading what the apostle Peter had to say about the Word, Christ, and being born again.

Your leaving out a part of the story:

When you realized that it was by the authority of the Catholic Church that the very letter of Peter you refer to was included into Sacred Scripture, because neither God, nor Jesus Christ, gave any directive to do so.

[swmobuffalo]

“His Catholic Church remains”

No, unfortunately it doesn’t. What remains is men’s ideas about what Christ said.

[mike182d]

Full disclosure, I was born and raised RCC.

With the incarnation, Jesus Christ came to us through Mary. An omnipotent God has no need of a "natural birth" to make Himself incarnate. And yet, He chose to enter this world through Mary's womb.

God does not do things arbitrarily, and because it was part of His divine plan that Christ come to us through Mary, looking to Mary should help us better understand our journey to Christ.

[mike182d]

No, unfortunately it doesn’t. What remains is men’s ideas about what Christ said.

Every Bishop, including the Pope - the Bishop of Rome - can trace his lineage to one of the original Apostles.

Is there another church that can claim this?

[Petronski]

What remains is men’s ideas about what Christ said.

For the moment, let's leave Luther, Cauvin and Zwingli out of it.

[mike182d]

First one founded by man, second one founded by Christ.

Which man founded the Catholic Church?

[fishtank]

Fine.

Jesus was born of Mary.

But I don’t need to follow her, or pray to her, or to ‘believe’ in her.

She was a sinner who needed a Savior.

[mike182d]

The Episcopal Bishop of Pennsylvania (name unrecalled) publicly stated, “the Bible was written by humans, it can be rewritten by humans.” - or words to that effect. There is a lot of theological garbage being thrown around these days.

First, I agree that this is garbage, but there is something worth questioning here:

When did God or Jesus Christ tell the Apostles to write down an account of His life and include it into sacred scripture? When did God or Jesus Christ provide a list of what text and which letters ought to be added to the existing Hebrew canon?

Scripture obviously didn't float down from heaven. So, it was obviously written by men to some extent. On what grounds are we to believe these particular men over, say, the Gnostics who wrote the Gospel of Thomas?

[lastchance]

I think only those who are convinced that what the Catholic Church teaches is true should become Catholic. I honestly am dismayed that so many godly Protestants are being abandonded by their denominations. And yes I consider it abandonment when a faithful Christian is told that the Holy Spirit is doing a new thing and God now blesses homosexual behavior. Or that cow farts are a matter for Easter reflection. Or that Jesus is a vehicle to the divine. Or Baptism shall be in the name of the Creator, Redeemer and Sustainer. It stinks and it is heartbreaking for so many non Catholics to see their denominations becoming liberal social clubs.

I pray that all Protestants can find a church home where the Reformed traditions they hold so dear are preached and practiced. Where the only one glorified is the Triune God.

[swmobuffalo]

“Every Bishop, including the Pope - the Bishop of Rome - can trace his lineage to one of the original Apostles.”

1Ti 1:4 Neither give heed to fables and endless genealogies, which minister questions, rather than godly edifying which is in faith: so do.

And I would imagine that the original Apostles are rolling in their graves given what their “descendents” have elaborated on.

[mike182d]

But I don’t need to follow her, or pray to her, or to ‘believe’ in her.

No one said you had to. But if your pursuit is knowledge of Christ, who knows more about a child, or has a more intimate relationship with them, than their mother?