Afghan vice president assassinated

MSNBC .com ^ | 07/06/02 | Unknown

[cake_crumb]

Nope. No plotting or scheming going on amongst the Afghanis.

This begs the questions: Where all all the "unnamed witnesses?" Where are the heartrending quotes so full of quivering outrage? "My heart burns with anger" and all that?

The "silence" is deafening...

[self_evident]

IMHO Al Quaeda has cells/bases in many countries beside Afghanistan. Do we "occupy" them all?

Actually, thats not a bad arguement. I've certainly supported what we have done so far. But logic would seem to suggest that we focus on the source (Saudi, Egypt, Yemen) or the target (United States) rather than the intermediate staging areas, since those are the easiest to replace.

[BlessedBeGod]

but no, we're saying "attack the u.s. and we'll build you a new country and give you a whole lot of money."

It's called fighting a politically correct war. And that political correctness will continue to get us killed.

[lilsparky]

The military leader of the Northern Alliance was assassinated two days before 9/11.

[cake_crumb]

"An Islamic Democracy isn't out of the question, an alliance with the West isn't out of the question, but it is up to them. Their choice could result in another 10 years of conflict or some degree of prosperity"

All those mini-dictator wannabes, the warlords, will do everything in their power to make sure the new government fails. The warlords, as well as the regular, full time terrorists, NEED anarchy in order to thrive and prosper.

[tomkat]

you might wanna consider that after you're alive another ten or fifteen years,
this ol' world, and it's problems, are gonna look one helluva lot different to ya...

[ecomcon]

The purpose is to make sure you don’t have to go back in 3 - 5 - 10 years and deal with the same problem again..

The reason it is all doomed to repetition is that we haven't defined the problem properly. Nothing will change unless and until Islam is destroyed, root and trunk.

All available means should be put to that end; not only militarily, but more importantly, mass information and re-education. We must show them that Islam is a violent fraud. Take away the motive, and you take away the will. That way, we won't have to kill them all.

[w1andsodidwe]

Let them have Afghanistan. I don't care whether or not Afghani women wear silly costumes, I don't care if they can read or have professional lives...not my issue.

I believe this kind of attitude is just what lead to the Taliban and Al Quaeda getting a foothold there.

[NerdDad]

the precedent must be set: attack the u.s. and you will pay a terrible price. attack the u.s. and those around you will pay a terrible price

Well put! Unfortunately, the US is still fighting an "honorable" war inside the confines or the rules or war as Western society has established. The people we are fighting against have no such honor. They do not believe in the Geneva Convention. They have only one rule of war: The infidel--whether man, woman or child-must convert to Islam or be killed. There is no separation between combatant and innocent in their war.

Part of the problem is that the US is terrified or upsetting the "those around you" part of the equation. We are not independent enough of the resources we buy from them to be able to deal with them in the manner needed. That will come.

Another part of the problem is that the US has so many traitors within its own borders. No, I'm not going to make this about immigration--though it could be--I'm talking about the press. In my father's wars, the press was helpful in shaping the opinion of the American public to help the war effort. Now, the press does everything in its power to undercut that effort. I fear that not even an attack of apocalyptic proportion against us will bring those opinion shapers back into the fold.

I readily admit that my bloodthirst created in September has not been quenched. We need to be concentrating on more butt-kicking. Afghanistan, regardless of its form of government, is merely a pimple on that butt. Try as we might, we cannot extricate ourselves from this war. The press be damned, this war is coming to us. It will become very personal. The traitors, those in the press and the ones who should never have been allowed in this country, will be dealt with on a very personal level then. And we will win.

[NerdDad]

the precedent must be set: attack the u.s. and you will pay a terrible price. attack the u.s. and those around you will pay a terrible price

Well put! Unfortunately, the US is still fighting an "honorable" war inside the confines or the rules or war as Western society has established. The people we are fighting against have no such honor. They do not believe in the Geneva Convention. They have only one rule of war: The infidel--whether man, woman or child-must convert to Islam or be killed. There is no separation between combatant and innocent in their war.

Part of the problem is that the US is terrified or upsetting the "those around you" part of the equation. We are not independent enough of the resources we buy from them to be able to deal with them in the manner needed. That will come.

Another part of the problem is that the US has so many traitors within its own borders. No, I'm not going to make this about immigration--though it could be--I'm talking about the press. In my father's wars, the press was helpful in shaping the opinion of the American public to help the war effort. Now, the press does everything in its power to undercut that effort. I fear that not even an attack of apocalyptic proportion against us will bring those opinion shapers back into the fold.

I readily admit that my bloodthirst created in September has not been quenched. We need to be concentrating on more butt-kicking. Afghanistan, regardless of its form of government, is merely a pimple on that butt. Try as we might, we cannot extricate ourselves from this war. The press be damned, this war is coming to us. It will become very personal. The traitors, those in the press and the ones who should never have been allowed in this country, will be dealt with on a very personal level then. And we will win.

[NerdDad]

Apologies for the double post. I got an error message the first time.

[Rebelbase]

The violence and religious domination of Afghan tribal cultures is to ingrained to be changed into a healthy, functional democracy in our lifetimes.

The minute we pull out of the country, all hell will break loose again.

[Excuse_My_Bellicosity]

Looks like our latest nation-building project is going well.

[NittanyLion]

I believe this kind of attitude is just what lead to the Taliban and Al Quaeda getting a foothold there.

So in the 2000 campaign, when Pres. Bush stated he was against nation-building, I take it you disagreed?

[cake_crumb]

"Looks like our latest nation-building project is going well"

WE aren't nation building. We dumped that straight into the laps of our more wimpering "allies"

[Mad_Tom_Rackham]

Although it may be Al-Qaeda, it’s possibly tribal. Afganistan isn’t unified as a country and has a lot of back-biting rivalry. They need to find their own ‘King Arthur’ to unify them. If they can’t - pull out and leave them to kill each other.

Well put.

[Redleg Duke]

We are forgetting our purpose in Afghan. We did not go there to build democracy, nor should we bother attempting such. We went there to kill people. Let's keep that in mind."

You sound like one of them, not one of us.

[Trust but Verify]

You're the one who proposed bringing troops home from the war to protect our borders.

[varon]

Irrelevant argument. Al Qaeda doesn't have the run of the nations and their territory as they did in Afghanistan.

Irrelevent response. AlQaeda doesn't need to have the "run of the nations and their territories" to launch attacks. All they need are mobile bases and cells and means of communications.

Using your logic, the dismantling of the Taliban regime and dispersing of the AlQaeda in Afgahnistan was the death knell for terrorrism. Guess again.

[w1andsodidwe]

So in the 2000 campaign, when Pres. Bush stated he was against nation-building, I take it you disagreed?

I believe that the world situation has changed considerably since then. It is real easy to take a quote out of a campaign and beat it to death.

That said of course, I don't believe in going into a country and imposing our will upon them for no reason. However, maybe you forgot. We were attacked by a group supported by the former government in this country.

Our survival depends upon removing the former government. It would have been shocking for the President to take no action just because of a stand he took during the campaign.

I can see that you are one of those people who will hold his feet to the fire no matter what. No compromise, never, ever. How sad that you are not able to move you stance as the world situation changes. Or maybe you are someone just looking for a reason to oppose the President and by god you have found it. How sad.