“I SAY AGAIN THERE WILL BE NO ... and I repeat ... NO HOMOSEXUALS IN HEAVEN !”
I never said anything different. There will also be no LIARS in Heaven either. Do you deny this?
“You ASSUME that ‘God gave them over to a REPROBATE mind’ does not mean what it CLEARLY states.”
That’s false.
Romans 1 is a progression. We see cause and effect multiple times. It is describing the downward spiral into greater and greater evil that could be applied to an individual or group of people. Paul used the third person pronouns “they,” “them” and “their.”
Starting in verse 18, he addresses this downward spiral which describes “men who hold the truth in unrighteousness.” Then he uses these third person pronouns at least 22 times by my count, through the end of the chapter.
So do you suppose the “they” Paul describes, who hold the truth in unrighteousness, are ALL engaging in homosexual acts? Are all who become “vain in their imaginations” also turned over to homosexuality? Do all who think foolishly become homosexual and reprobate?
Do all who commit the sin of unthankfulness also engage in homosexual sex and reprobation?
Do all who disobey their parents also engage in homosexual sex?
The list of such questions is endless, and the answers are obvious. It is not me who is ASSUMING something here. It is you who has ASSUMED that ALL homosexuals are given over to a reprobate mind. You also explicitly and specifically denied that homosexuals are ever brought to repentance and salvation in post #35.
“Now let’s continue with your comment: ‘I get the impression you do not accept the CLEAR Biblical message that there are people who were formerly homosexual who have been SAVED by the transforming power of the Gospel.’ You are correct.”
Maybe you need to clarify what you said there. The way it reads to me is that you confirmed my impression that you do NOT accept that ANY FORMER homosexuals have been SAVED by the GOSPEL. Now it seems you are backtracking by pointing out that they were FORMER homosexuals, but I already stipulated that.
A reprobate person, by the definition of the Romans 1 passage is FILLED with ALL unrighteousness. They do not merely succumb to sin, they delight in it. Paul’s description is here similar to the people of Sodom or Noah’s generation who did evil and thought evil continuously.
Genesis 6:5, 11
And God saw that the WICKEDNESS of man was GREAT in the earth, and that EVERY imagination of the thoughts of his heart was ONLY EVIL CONTINUALLY... The earth also was CORRUPT before God, and the earth was FILLED with VIOLENCE.
[emphasis mine where all caps are used]
Genesis 13:13
But the men of Sodom were WICKED and SINNERS before the Lord EXCEEDINGLY.
[emphasis mine where all caps are used]
Genesis 18:20-21
And the Lord said, Because the CRY of Sodom and Gomorrah is GREAT, and because their SIN is VERY GRIEVOUS; I will go down now, and see whether they have done altogether according to the cry of it, which is come unto me; and if not, I will know.
[emphasis mine where all caps are used]
Whether it is possible for a reprobate person to ever repent I am uncertain. But I know on the authority of the scriptures that it is possible for a homosexual to repent and be saved.
Of course no homosexual can enter Heaven in a state of his or her sinfulness. Neither can anyone else whether he has engaged in that perversion or not. You act as if you have made some profound point, but it is exactly what I pointed out from the start.
A homosexual is barred from Heaven in the same exact sense that ALL men are barred from Heaven because ALL have sinned. And the only way ANY sinner can ever enter Heaven is to obtain forgiveness and grace through the cross of Christ.
As I have pointed out since I first engaged in this discussion with you (see post #20 and #24), Paul’s message continues and concludes with this very point:
“There is no difference.”
No difference in what? The way pious religious Jews and unclean, perverted Gentiles are saved! And that goes for ALL people. ALL have sinned. ALL are destined for death and God’s wrath, unless they come to Christ.
Romans 3:9-10
What then? are we BETTER [emphasis mine] than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin; As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one.
Romans 10:12-13
For there is no DIFFERENCE [emphasis mine] between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.
For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.
You twist Romans 1 to merely argue for shunning homosexuals, but Romans 1 is the beginning of a larger message based on the primacy of the Gospel of Christ and its and power to save sinners, including homosexuals.
“You also ASSUME that there will be HOMOSEXUALS IN Heaven.”
Another falsehood. Whether you are aware that your statement is false, I will leave between you and God. But He knows if you really believe what you just said. Regardless of whether it was an intentional lie, it is false.
But there will be people who prior to their salvation through Christ engaged in such perversions. These past and forgiven sins no longer define who they are.
1 Corinthians 6:11
And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.