Gunmaker Remington filing for bankruptcy

NY Post ^ | 2/12/18 | Richard Morgan

[Fai Mao]

Remington Outdoor announced plans to file for bankruptcy on Monday, succumbing to a “Trump slump” that whacked sales by 30 percent in its most recent quarter.

https://nypost.com/2018/02/12/gunmaker-remington-filing-for-bankruptcy/

[Squantos]

Agree !!!

I like they’re purchase of the Rhorbaugh design pistols ..... I have the original in 9mm and remington’s version RM380 in .380....... both very small and work well. Have thousands of rounds through em with no problems. Only thing smaller and as reliable are Seecamp’s .32 and 380’s .

That said ......

Remingtons quality control is crap these days ...... I can put old and new next to each other and the fit, finish and attention to detail is clearly evident to even the untrained eye. My old Remingtons and Marlins are head and shoulders above the products coming out of they’re factory these days.

Dont spend on Remington products anymore ...... nada zilch nuthin ! They created they’re own woes and demise. Sad.

[Pollster1]

I like my Remington 700 - an absolutely wonderful bolt action rifle. It is the second most accurate rifle I own, completely reliable, and sturdy. However, other than their big-bore bolt actions and the 870 shotgun (my top home-defense choice), it’s hard to find a Remington option that is competitive. They should be a smaller company and give up on their marginal products.

[Bonemaker]

Dirty shame what happened to the old line top quality firearms companies...Winchester, Marlin, S&W, Colt, Marlin etc.Greed and stupidity.

[WinMod70]

I used to be huge fan of the 180 gr bronze points until be and buddy went halves on several hundred. They varied so much in weight than we had to weigh them all and sort them in groups of 20-30 to get anything close to consistent results. That was 25-30 years ago, since then I switched to factory loads for deer. Federal Premium Nosler Accubonds have proved up to the task.

[wastoute]

How do you screw up the R51 when you are handed the Para 14+1 to START with? I just don’t get it.

[snoringbear]

“They could have and should have left (again, to use the example) Bushmaster alone to continue in the marketplace. But they didn’t, they started micromanaging and needlessly consolidating their new purchase into what they already had.” No argument here. A reality of the gun market is that for the most part their products are multigenerational meaning that with rare exception guns are rarely used to the point of being worn out. And, consequently they’re usually passed on to the next generation. Example, I have guns that I inherited from my father and a shotgun from my grandfather. So, gun manufacturers in order to grow the business must grow their customer base (i.e. women) or introduce new products, preferably both. Your Bushmaster example is a good one. I wasn’t aware that it was bought by Remington. I’m getting on up there in years and now have all the guns my wife will allow me to buy so I don’t keep up with current events in the gun business 😏.

[Spktyr]

Searching YouTube for “Remington 870 Jam Fix” may make you rethink getting or recommending any vaguely recent 870. Add to that the flood of 870 clones from Turkey and China (where the clones are actually *better* than the Remington product!) and you can see why they have a problem in that department.

As for the bolt actions - there’s a whole new generation of CNC’d bolt guns from many different makers that equal the 700’s performance for a much lower price. Remington’s own historic attempts to make the 700 action cheaper (7, 710) have not done at all well.

[Spktyr]

You screw up the magazine design, you screw up the magazine construction (union workers doing a sloppy job building the new revised magazines per R51 forums) and you design the R51 revival using the discredited Pederson locking system that relies on the “Blish hesitation effect” that doesn’t exist.

The new R51 is a throwback to the original R51, not built off the Para design.

[Spktyr]

"I’m getting on up there in years and now have all the guns my wife will allow me to buy so I don’t keep up with current events in the gun business 😏." See the last paragraph in my post number 4 - they were attempting to cater to people who found themselves in your situation. Already had what they wanted/needed, not buying anything else.

[OKSooner]

"Remington shot themselves in the foot with piss-poor management for years spending more on mergers and acquisitions than on basic manufacturing quality control. The pinnacle of which was the Remington R51 disaster. "

Yeah, the R51 deal had to have been the worst thing, but don't discount the Marlin takeover, like the whiz kids at the holding company (still Cerberus, or did they sell to someone else?) couldn't be content ruining just one gun company. It's like they had a board meeting and said "Okay, we now own another company that's occupied a niche since when, back in the 19th century, what can we do to ruin it now? Okay, let's close their factory and move all their manufacturing to Ilion, New York where no one knows how to make what they make..."

If one didn't know better, one would think it was deliberate.

[wastoute]

I thought I read that Remington BOUGHT Para. So my question remains, when you start with something that works, well, Pa Kettle comes to mind.

[OKSooner]

Time for Ruger to bring out some new shotguns, it would appear.

[Spktyr]

They did buy Para - but they didn’t build the R51 off of the Para product or off any 1911 design. They built the new R51 as a redesigned version of the original Remington Model 51.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Remington_Model_51

The Para stuff went into the R1 line instead, and they (reportedly) had Para build the R51 to a design handed down from the head office.

[Spktyr]

I don’t think that’s what happened. I think what happened is they saw the market shifting and tried to bring in other companies whose products would fill the gaping holes in the modern Remington lineup, then they mismanaged them.

If Remington hadn’t acquired these other companies, they wouldn’t have lasted this long. The bolt rifle is emphatically a second or third class citizen in the modern firearms sale arena and pump guns are drifting that way as well. Remington had *no* modern sporting rifles, modern carry pistols, modern combat shotguns or really anything modern.

[ThunderSleeps]

I think you're right. It would seem to require extremely poor management to go into bankruptcy just one year into an industry slowdown. Even harder to fathom when you're coming off an 8 year long boom. Almost inconceivable when demand (and prices) for something you make - ie. ammunition - remains high.

Hopefully bankruptcy will mean swapping out the obviously incompetent management.

[Squantos]

R51 based on a Para Ordnance ? I did not know that . I’ve got a few Paras but never have seen the R51 ..... will have to go compare em. Thanks for the info.

[henkster]

My 870 is also my go-to home defense shotgun, and I love my 700; it is the most accurate rifle I own. Best of all, both of them are left-handed. They are very well built and reliable. However, they are also over 30 years old. I bought the 870 shortly after landing my first real job; it was after the car but before the TV. The 700 was added about two years later.

I don’t have any recent experience with Remington other than buying their deer slugs as practice ammo. But I do like them for manufacturing left-hand guns at a not too outrageous price.

[Spktyr]

It isn’t. See post 33.

[Presbyterian Reporter]

Remington must have foolishly spent their money during the Obama Boom Years.

Remington was also likely expecting Hillary to win so they would potentially have 8 years of Hillary Boom Sales.

[PROCON]

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