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To: cloudmountain
You are just repeating what the history books say about a 13th century nation. The ROMAN empire is far, far more relevant than the Mongolian empire. At least, when one thinks of the Roman Empire's influence on us today.

Actually, I have no clue what the history books say. History as taught in school was so horrible that it was all I could do to pass the class; without history to pull down my grades, my GPA would have been closer to 3.7 than 3.5. So everything I said about the Mongolian third empire is what I learned in the museums over there. And I think I did not explain well the lesson I took away from that. The lesson was not about the Mongolian Khan empire so much as it was about our own future.

We are at a crossroads here. We have been a nation for nearly 250 years. Our media is set on destroying America, and subversive elements (e.g. Soviet plants in schools, universities, the media, etc., throughout the 1900s) have made sure that people do not receive proper educations, that they receive a steady diet of propaganda exactly as described in the novel 1984. They have conditioned a large part of the population to have no critical thinking skills whatsoever, and to substitute the state for God. The situation is so dire now that we are on the verge of electing Hillary--a woman who is motivated by unmitigated greed and lust for power, who has a history of working to destroy America and who has openly said that if elected, she will import even more jihadists (many of whom she created with her Middle East policies) and uneducated third worlders whose only "contribution" would be to increase her political power, while becoming a burden to the minority of us who still work. I am terrified that she might win the election; I do not think the country we know as America will survive.

Now compare our situation to Mongolian history. Their last empire spanned almost an entire continent, from the Pacific coast of Asia into central Europe. They invented the postal system and passports. Their empire was a model of tolerance between people of different ethnicities and religions. In other words, they achieved greatness. And who are the Mongolians now? They certainly do not have the greatness of their ancestors. They are not a first world country by any measure (although they are working to reach that level). They are a diminished people who want everyone to know how great they were, because they cannot talk about their current greatness--it doesn't exist.

The lesson is not about the Mongolians. It is about us, as we face this crossroad in history. If Hillary wins this election, I fear that America is lost. So, then, what is our future? Hundreds of years from now, will our descendants be showcasing the great glorious past of America, because their present is so meager? Is the present condition of Mongolia our future? Will we end up suffering hundreds of years of subjugation to some other power (like the Chinese, who have a history of brutality), only to emerge afterwards as a shadow of what we once were?

The Mongolians RE-ELECTED commies in 1990...so much for THEIR choice of governments. Communism is godless, you recall.

They elected communists because they remember Communism as a time when everyone had jobs. Unemployment right now is quite high. During the Communist era, the government made sure the nomads all had animals and were able to continue their lifestyle. Nowadays, all it takes is one rough winter (common in Mongolia, where it begins snowing in October) for a rich nomad family to lose their herd and become poor overnight. When that happens, they move into the city hoping to find a job--but the only skill they have is raising animals, and they end up in the ger district, where all the poor people live. Despite their nostalgia for the Soviet era, it is easy to see that the Soviets never improved their infrastructure (other than building power plants for the city, which are old and polluting); they had no paved roads or indoor plumbing during the Soviet era. But they had jobs. Now, they are struggling to develop. Their current system of democracy is riddled with corruption and cronyism. If the only political systems you have known were Communism (where everyone was equal and had a job) or a corrupt democracy (where corruption runs rampant and how well you do depends on who you know in high places), which would you think is a better system? People who do not have a long history of democracy and no history of having a republic cannot be expected to understand these systems of government, much less implement them effectively. (This, btw, is why we have not had success in the Middle East--the best we can do there is make sure the dictators are benign.)

But, then most Mongolians are Buddhist.

I do not know much about Buddhism, but I did visit many monasteries during my tour. My tour guide explained about the different gods, and clearly, bringing me to visit the monasteries gave her many opportunities to pray. Also, during the tour, we often pulled over to the side of the road to these piles of stones called owas; the custom is to throw more stones on the piles or other gifts and to pray. These prayer mounds are ubiquitous. I couldn't help but compare to religious practice in our own country. How many people stop driving several times a day to get out of their cars and pray? Their religion is an integral part of daily life, much more so than I have ever seen in the US.

If you love it so much, go live there. If it's such a marvelous place, go live there. You sound intelligent; you can learn their language and find a place for yourself over there.

Going to live in another country is not that easy, or I would have done it decades ago. I learned eons ago, when I lived in Europe for a few years, that I absolutely love being an American overseas. But now, as I approach retirement, I realize that I made the wrong life decisions along the way and steered myself away from life as an expat. Perhaps, after I retire, I will have more time to visit the world. Every people I have visited is different, and I always want to learn more about them.

15 posted on 10/17/2016 4:38:21 AM PDT by exDemMom (Current visual of the hole the US continues to dig itself into: http://www.usdebtclock.org/)
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To: exDemMom
Actually, I have no clue what the history books say. History as taught in school was so horrible that it was all I could do to pass the class; without history to pull down my grades, my GPA would have been closer to 3.7 than 3.5. So everything I said about the Mongolian third empire is what I learned in the museums over there. And I think I did not explain well the lesson I took away from that. The lesson was not about the Mongolian Khan empire so much as it was about our own future.

It's a shame you feel that way about history as it tells us WHO we are and WHY we are the way we are.
I don't really focus on "our" future as a country as only God knows what that will be. WE do the best we can and let our good Lord worry about the future of His human creations. This life is a blink of an eye fast and this time is for us to worship our Maker. We do that by loving Him and loving others.
BTW: I minored in history in college, especially U.S. history. I had a FABULOUS instructor and loved every minute of it.

=============================================

We are at a crossroads here. We have been a nation for nearly 250 years. Our media is set on destroying America, and subversive elements (e.g. Soviet plants in schools, universities, the media, etc., throughout the 1900s) have made sure that people do not receive proper educations, that they receive a steady diet of propaganda exactly as described in the novel 1984. They have conditioned a large part of the population to have no critical thinking skills whatsoever, and to substitute the state for God. The situation is so dire now that we are on the verge of electing Hillary--a woman who is motivated by unmitigated greed and lust for power, who has a history of working to destroy America and who has openly said that if elected, she will import even more jihadists (many of whom she created with her Middle East policies) and uneducated third worlders whose only "contribution" would be to increase her political power, while becoming a burden to the minority of us who still work. I am terrified that she might win the election; I do not think the country we know as America will survive.

No crossroads with this election. She is just ONE person and she can't do much with our system of government.
Plus she has to deal with CONGRESS. THAT is a bigger deal because they make the laws.
I believe every word you say about Shrillary but you really are giving her too much credit. I remember WELL the exact same rhetoric when Bill Clinton was running. The anti-Clinton pundits said that the world would end. It didn't.
Clinton was a giant SLEAZE-bucket but our world didn't end.

=============================================

They elected communists because they remember Communism as a time when everyone had jobs. Unemployment right now is quite high. During the Communist era, the government made sure the nomads all had animals and were able to continue their lifestyle. Nowadays, all it takes is one rough winter (common in Mongolia, where it begins snowing in October) for a rich nomad family to lose their herd and become poor overnight. When that happens, they move into the city hoping to find a job--but the only skill they have is raising animals, and they end up in the ger district, where all the poor people live. Despite their nostalgia for the Soviet era, it is easy to see that the Soviets never improved their infrastructure (other than building power plants for the city, which are old and polluting); they had no paved roads or indoor plumbing during the Soviet era. But they had jobs. Now, they are struggling to develop. Their current system of democracy is riddled with corruption and cronyism. If the only political systems you have known were Communism (where everyone was equal and had a job) or a corrupt democracy (where corruption runs rampant and how well you do depends on who you know in high places), which would you think is a better system? People who do not have a long history of democracy and no history of having a republic cannot be expected to understand these systems of government, much less implement them effectively. (This, btw, is why we have not had success in the Middle East--the best we can do there is make sure the dictators are benign.)

The Mongolians weren't too bright to bring back the communists on the nostalgia thinking. Not smart at all. But, it's THEIR country and they can vote for whomever they want.

As for the middle east, my husband and I LIVED and WORKED in the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia for five YEARS. One reason to go there , besides the HUGE salaries ARAMCO paid, was to travel. It was FABULOUS and I learned about the middle east.
When we returned home we realized that trying to explain the middle east to Americans was impossible. The media here fill the pages and airwaves with nothing but anti-middle east things. This country is DEEPLY entailed with the Saudi Kingdom because of the petroleum and natural gas that we NEED to run our comfortable lives.
According to the geologists the Saudi government has another 200 years of petroleum and natural gas, so we won't be leaving there soon.

=============================================

Going to live in another country is not that easy, or I would have done it decades ago. I learned eons ago, when I lived in Europe for a few years, that I absolutely love being an American overseas. But now, as I approach retirement, I realize that I made the wrong life decisions along the way and steered myself away from life as an expat. Perhaps, after I retire, I will have more time to visit the world. Every people I have visited is different, and I always want to learn more about them.

Sorry about your wrong decisions. My husband and I made the right decisions. Well, HE made the BIG decisions because he was so smart! [My sister introduced us as they worked together. She picked me a GOOD one.]

We had an argument once over there. Apparently I had the habit of NOT closing kitchen drawers and it annoyed him. One day he started in on me about it, scolding me.
However, he didn't let me answer. HE continued the argument doing BOTH SIDES, HIS AND MINE. I listened carefully to make sure that he got MY side right...and he did.
At the end I just had to LAUGH! I said: "Hah! You don't even need me to ARGUE anymore."
After that I always closed kitchen drawers and SMILED every time, remembering our "argument" about it.

I retired and LOST my desire to travel. I can't even THINK about packing (I take only carry-ons now, the sizes that the pilots and flight attendants carry), taxis to the airport, waiting, security checks, waiting, the flight, more taxis, hotels, restaurants...and reverse to come home.
Maybe I'll feel like traveling again someday...but I LOVE my home and city and life!

Start planning your trips now! :o)

21 posted on 10/17/2016 6:18:12 PM PDT by cloudmountain
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To: exDemMom

I did great in history, but still, Mongolia under Communism was hardly discussed and the time frame where I was on that course was the winter 2010 semester, a few years ago. The details weren’t gotten into. Now maybe I could have found the option for one of the papers, but it didn’t appear common. I couldn’t extrapolate and say that my course reflects on what the history courses in general cover. But it just appeared that way.


25 posted on 10/18/2016 4:27:09 AM PDT by Morpheus2009
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