[IronJack]

The other fallacy in this whole "untrained civilians in a firefight" scenario is the assumption that the killers are somehow better trained than their would-be victims. From what I've seen, they're usually a bunch of crazed zealots who spray and pray (to Allah) before blowing themselves up. These are not finely honed assassins, but mere mass murderers who intentionally choose crowded venues to maximize the damage their lack of sophistication would otherwise limit.

A couple of "victims" who go to the range once or twice a month could easily be better equipped to counter their murderous intentions than the murderers are to carry them out.

[OldMissileer]

These are not finely honed assassins, but mere mass murderers who intentionally choose crowded venues to maximize the damage their lack of sophistication would otherwise limit.

It was about a year or so ago some cowardly assassin started shooting in a mall and when he saw a citizen with a sidearm coming at him he blew his own brains out.