[pgkdan]

He's absolutely correct. Easy for me to say in hindsight, given that at the time I was fully onboard is overthrowing Saddam and the Ba'athists. But who can deny that this region of the world will never accept Western style democracy? These countries need a strong secular leader to keep the islamists under control. It may not be pretty but it's necessary.

Look at Iran pre and post revolution. Can anyone deny that Iran functioned better under the Shah? That Iran was a better neighbor and a productive state under the Shah? Even Assad in Syria is preferable to the caliphate! At least under Saddam and Assad Christians were free to worship as they pleased and participate in the general society.

[SeekAndFind]

RE: . But who can deny that this region of the world will never accept Western style democracy? These countries need a strong secular leader to keep the islamists under control. It may not be pretty but it’s necessary.

OK, here’s hindsight. Iraq was quite stable between 2008 and 2011 after the surge.

They did not have a good, strong, incorruptible leader and that was the problem. BUT .... LEAVING IRAQ WAS A HUGE PROBLEM.

WE SHOULD NOT HAVE LEFT.

We are still in Japan, Germany and South Korea over 5 decades now. What makes people think that we can simply end the war by retreating in Iraq?