Does Global Warming Actually Increase Antarctic Sea Ice?

Discovery News ^ | July 31, 2015 | BY PATRICK J. KIGER

[Oldeconomybuyer]

People who insist that climate change isn’t happening often try to disprove it by pointing to what they see as contradictory phenomena. One of their most visually compelling arguments has centered upon Antarctic sea ice, which expanded to reach record levels in 2014. If the planet really is warming, they ask, then shouldn’t the ice in the southern ocean be melting?

But now, in a new, not-yet-published paper, James Hansen, former director of the NASA Goddard Institute for Space Studies, and colleagues push back even harder. They argue that the increase in Antarctic sea ice not only doesn’t refute climate change, but actually is caused by warming.

“Our climate model exposes amplifying feedbacks in the Southern Ocean that slow Antarctic bottom water formation and increase ocean temperature near ice shelf grounding lines, while cooling the surface ocean and increasing sea ice cover and water column stability,” the scientists argue in the abstract for the paper, which is undergoing review for publication in the journal Atmospheric Chemistry and Physics.

Here’s that scenario in simpler terms. While sea ice has been increasing, we know from analyzing satellite data that the ice covering the land mass of Antarctica has been melting rapidly.

Hansen told the Washington Post that the Antarctic ice expansion trend will continue, along with ice sheet melt. But that acceleration actually will be a sign that climate change is worsening.

“It will be clearer, give us a few more years,” Hansen told the Post.

[Lazamataz]

They don’t even bother having a slight brush with reality any more.

[VanDeKoik]

Globull warming was supposed to get rid of the ice.

Ice stays around.

Globull warming is responsible for the ice!!!!!11!!1!!

[ChildOfThe60s]

Just like not having sex causes pregnancy.

[Fledermaus]

I know this for a FACT: Global Warming decreases the IQ of retarded libs even lower than known possible.

[Boogieman]

“It will be clearer, give us a few more years,”

Why not take 50? Get back to us then, no hurry.

[palmer]

2: Man creates just 3.4% of that 0.04% (The rest is natural)

We have seen a rise from 280 to 400 ppm. The only way that could have happened is lots of CO2 venting from the crust or lots of warming in the ocean. We have had neither of those. Another possibility is a lot of vegetation loss but that has happened either.

The other problem with the "it's natural" theory is that the annual wiggle is obviously natural:

If that is natural, the year over year rise is probably not.

yet these LIARS ignore their own findings that show that ppm were much higher thousands of years ago (if you believe in long earth ages)

They don't ignore anything. There have been natural rises similar to the present rise as recently as 8 or 9000 years ago. But those were about 1/2 the present rise and had natural explanations.

[Fledermaus]

All the logic confuses them.

[dila813]

“a new, not-yet-published paper, James Hansen”

hmmm, isn’t he hanging himself by his on petard?

[palmer]

Any loss of ice or snow is from sublimation, indicating a solar cause.

Somewhat. But there is sublimation in the dead of winter with no sun due to dry air. The problem is Antarctica is too cold for snow, many parts in the middle get an inch or two per season. Global warming could change that to produce a lot more snow but that is centuries in the future if ever.

[VeniVidiVici]

Of course it does! Hanson the freaking fascist

[Lazamataz]

With all due respect, it is not that Global Warming propagandists might be insane. It is that they aren’t even in the same ZIPCODE as sane. They don’t even know sane EXISTS. They saw a movie about sanity and rushed out of the theater. They will not get on an elevator if there are more than one sane persons on it. Global Warming propagandists are a buoy of insanity in the Great Insane Sea. Sanity has never even violated their airspace. They, alone, account for 17% of America’s GDP of insanity. Veni, Vidi, Krazy: They came, they saw, they got insane. They tend to their insanity like a stadium tends to its playing-field grass. Global Warming propagandists often ask their wife if their insanity makes their butt look big. They spoon with their insanity at night, and whisper sweet loving coos into its ear. They once ordered a Baskin-Robbins ice cream cone in the flavor ‘Chocolate Insanity’, and told them to hold the Chocolate.

[uglybiker]

Well of course it does!

And it's all the fault of angry, bitter-clinging, American white male conservatives driving gas-guzzling SUVs!

I know it's true because my college professor told me so!

[Sacajaweau]

Then that would mean global warming is a good thing...cuz more ice is a good thing. Can’t break that logic no matter how hard you try.

[Bob434]

[[I think some of the proponents of global warming are sincere in their beliefs.]]

They have been deceived- They may be sincere, but they are worshipping a false god

[[There are a great multitude of climate factors and no one understands the relations among them.]]

There are some things that are understood- like the fact that climates change first, and then many decades later, CO2 rises, and we know that the amount of CO2 In the atmosphere due to man is so small that it can’t possibly capture enough escaping heat, then back radiate it in large enough quantities to affect anything- Man’s contribution of CO2 to the atmosphere is just 0.00137% of the atmosphere- that’s not even 2/1000’s of a % of the atmosphere. the rest of the atmosphere has no CO2 in it 99.9983% of the atmosphere has no CO2 in it (produced by man)-

that means the majority of heat escaping the earth blows right on out into space- only a fraction of a percent of the heat escaping the earth gets captured- and only a fraction of that fraction gets back radiated-

To put this in perspective- That would be like standing in a stadium, lighting a match, blowing it out immediately, and claiming it just caused catastrophic temperature changes/climate change’ inside that stadium

Or pouring slightly warmer water into the ocean at 0.00137% of the volume of the ocean, and claiming it just caused catastrophic warming In the ocean.

There are other pretty indisputable points to be made, but can’t think now- (sunspots driving climate changes- ice core samples showing CO2 was higher In the past with no help from man of course etc)

[[The political and economic ramifications of CO2 reductions are massive and also not clearly in view.]]

The economic impact will be in the trillions, perhaps tens of trillions, perhaps even hundreds of trillions- I personally believe Carbon taxes and fines are going to be the vehicle through which the Anti-Christ uses it to make people comply when the people become so poor because of these taxes and fines, that they have no real choice but to comply- This is going to be a world-wide issue- a one world government is going to be in control of enforcing it, and I think that it will be used to financially cripple people and make them dependent on the government for everything-

But that’s a different topic- But you are right- it’s going to be a HUGE financial burden on the world

[Bob434]

[[We have seen a rise from 280 to 400 ppm. The only way that could have happened is lots of CO2 venting from the crust or lots of warming in the ocean.]]

Psssst- it was that high and perhaps higher many 1000’s of years ago

[[There have been natural rises similar to the present rise as recently as 8 or 9000 years ago. But those were about 1/2 the present rise and had natural explanations.]]

Go back further- they were just as high-

[[We have seen a rise from 280 to 400 ppm. The only way that could have happened is lots of CO2 venting from the crust or lots of warming in the ocean.]]

no sir- Warming happens first which then releases CO2- We know there has been warming, then many decades later we see the CO2 rising- just as it always has all through the ages-

We’ve been round and round with this- and you still keep making the claim that it can’t happen naturally- The oceans and vegetation aren’t the only sources-

[shotgun]

Ugh....everyone knows that dry ice is carbon dioxide, and carbon dioxide is causing global warming and therefore it stands to reason that the more carbon dioxide, the more dry ice!

Thanks you and I will now accept my Nobel prize for global science.

[Former Proud Canadian]

The full quote:

The keyword here is blackwhite. Like so many Newspeak words, this word has two mutually contradictory meanings. Applied to an opponent, it means the habit of impudently claiming that black is white, in contradiction of the plain facts. Applied to a Party member, it means a loyal willingness to say that black is white when Party discipline demands this. But it means also the ability to believe that black is white, and more, to know that black is white, and to forget that one has ever believed the contrary. This demands a continuous alteration of the past, made possible by the system of thought which really embraces all the rest, and which is known in Newspeak as doublethink. Doublethink is basically the power of holding two contradictory beliefs in one's mind simultaneously, and accepting both of them.

There are so many examples of this in contemporary American liberal thought that it is frightening.

I can hardly wait until the Newspeak dictionary comes out.

[West Texas Chuck]

I’ve heard that all the people on the planet could stand in Texas, in a 3’x3’ square of land. Now, Texas is a mighty place, but I don’t think that would like cause the earth to spin out of control and crash into the sun. Oklahoma probably would though.

So there, AGW=BS.

[vpintheak]

Cold caused by heat! Ice is made from intense heat sunlight!
Squawk! Squawk!

[West Texas Chuck]

Right on! Models should have nice legs, not be involved in science.