Why Islam Needs a Reformation

Wall Street Journal ^ | March 20 , 2015 | Ayaan Hirsi Ali

[TalBlack]

How does anyone reform a “religion” that was started by man with a sword?

[Mrs. Don-o]

Oh no, K-51, I beg our pardon, I didn't mean that at all. I am not saying that Muslims are no better or worse than Protestants, or that they have any equivalence on a moral or spiritual level.

I just meant that Muslims are not susceptible to "Reformation" because they are already devoted to "sola korana." There's no "reforming" people who insist that they're already reformed" -- that every possible question has already been settled by a text. And their barbaric text is unfortunately buttressed by the even worse hadith, plus 1400 years of koranic jurisprudence all tending toward the same end: terror and oppression.

They follow Mohammad. We (Protestants and Catholics) follow Jesus. Jesus is as opposite to Muhammad as it is possible to be. Therefore, a really zealous person who follows Jesus' example gets better and better, whereas a really zealous Muslim who follows Muhammad's example gets worse and worse.

I think we'd be in substantial agreement on that.

Please forgive me for not expressing that clearly to begin with.

[SeekAndFind]

RE: Why Islam Needs a Reformation

The only problem with the above advise is this:

The Christian Reformation was an attempt to return to BIBLICAL Christianity ( i.e. SOLA SCRIPTURA, scripture as the guide to Christian faith and practice ).

Now, imagine an Islamic “reformation” modeled on the Christian one... that would entail -— a return to QURANIC Islam ( The Quran as the guide to Muslim faith and practice ).

Does the author even realize what she is recommending?

Did she bother to even read and understand what the QURAN teaches about women, Jihad, war, government, etc.?

[caww]

....”Reformed Christianity is still Christianity; its source is the same as Roman Catholic Christianity.”....

Well actually it’s not. But that’s another argument for another day.

You cannot separate Islam from Mohammedanism.....they are one in the same.

So as I said...and isn’t beside the point...Islam cannot be reformed.

[El Cid]

Islam is not capable of reformation. The koran is written in such a way that they cannot remove one or two things without destroying the whole

I agree. I keep hearing that 'Islam needs a Reformation' - and this just wrong. Islam cannot be reformed. The entire root is corrupt and evil. Islam is based on the Koran. The Koran instructs its followers that having failed to convert the infidels - they are to be killed or enslaved. The only way to 'reform' Islam is to say that it can't be based on the Koran. In which case it is no longer Islam.

[kosciusko51]

Mrs. Don-o

Thank you for clarifying. And I agree with what you are saying about the moslems.

As you know, there have been a verbal sparring between the Catholics and Protestants. And there has been a lot of cheap shots coming from both sides. Your comment looked a lot like some of those cheap shots, but I was hoping that you were not joining in. I’m glad you are not.

Grace and Peace,
K51

[kosciusko51]

PS: My apologies for thinking you would make a cheap shot like that.

[JoeFromSidney]

The Reformation was not over the violent content of Catholicism. Even so, the passions stirred over issues of great consequence lead, at least in part, to wars lasting the better part of 2 centuries, and cultural friction to the present day, half a millennium later.

I agree. Given that experience I wouldn't wish a reformation on any religion.

[Mrs. Don-o]

K-51, I know that I sometimes punch that blasted "Send" key before my mind has finished with its discerning and editing function. I should never, never, never do that. I am sorry for my hastiness and carelessness, and do appreciate (really) your bringing it to my attention.

And in such a forgiving way.

Thank you.

[kosciusko51]

Christians don’t take the Bible literally.

Depends on the context. However, we take the Bible seriously.

[DesertRhino]

“I also don’t consider the stoning of women to be valid, but someone could point it out in the Bible.”

old testament crap. Jesus had something to say about stoning that supersedes the old.

[9thLife]

another in the long line of idiotic ideas that gets rotation in the media.

[pacific_waters]

One of the dumbest articles I have ever read. How do you reform a religion that says it the final word of God and any attempt to change it is blasphemy or apostasy.

[Forward the Light Brigade]

Angel Gabril dictated Koran. Their have been reforms in the past-— The modern problems come from Anti-Imperialist groups and violence that dated to late 19th Century. Yes, it will be reformed and I guess the reforms will come from Egypt. How come men and women pray apart? Mohammed prayed next to his beloved wife? How much is just tribalism of the 7th Century with no regard to Islam. Mohammed never spoke of Veils, or Burkas—His wives never wore them? Islam must go back to her roots-—.