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Army passes on Beretta M9A3 evaluation
GunsDotCom ^ | 9 Jan 2015 | Max Slowik

Posted on 01/15/2015 9:47:42 AM PST by shove_it

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To: Jeff Chandler

He said hopefully... LOL, you’re a hoot. I doubt they have that foresight though. I suspect it’ll be 9mm as most (all?) of our current/potential allies use it. A better platform would nice though. The Glock or SIG DAO/DAK would be my choice but then again the military still lives back in the early 1900s where small arms are concerned. Im sure it’ll have to have a manual safety, be all metal and be hard and expensive to maintain. :(

I certainly understand youre tendency toward 357SIg. I like it myself very much with 40 S&W as a second choice then 9mm. I prefer a SIG DAK or Glock.


21 posted on 01/15/2015 10:25:44 AM PST by 556x45
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To: shove_it

A Glock in.45acp would be a better choice than any 9mm I can think of. A return to the 1911 is politically impossible.


22 posted on 01/15/2015 10:26:20 AM PST by muir_redwoods ("He is a very shallow critic who cannot see an eternal rebel in the heart of a conservative." G.K .C)
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To: CarmichaelPatriot

The only problem with the Glocks is that I’m sure the military will require some sort of manual safety.


23 posted on 01/15/2015 10:26:35 AM PST by VanShuyten ("a shadow...draped nobly in the folds of a gorgeous eloquence.")
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To: Billthedrill

I agree with the need to re-evaluate, but I think it’s time to question the need at all —how many times a sidearm has even been used by a soldier in the last forty years and the circumstances, and re-evaluate if we even need them. My guess is such instances are astronomically rare, and even in those rare instances it was used only because for that duty position/billet it was the only weapon issued/available and a carbine or shotgun would be much more effective.


24 posted on 01/15/2015 10:30:59 AM PST by LambSlave
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To: Jeff Chandler

...which brings me to another topic - I think we should consider expanding ammunition for military pistols. The U.S. isn’t a signatory to the first Hague Convention that prohibited it for reasons that seemed sound a century ago but are now a little questionable. The second Hague Convention, which the U.S. did sign, doesn’t prohibit it IIRC. Anyone who knows more about that, I’d be delighted to learn.


25 posted on 01/15/2015 10:34:41 AM PST by Billthedrill
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To: 556x45
I certainly understand youre tendency toward 357SIg.

It's a wonderful caliber. It's high velocity, high energy, relatively small and light weight, and the bottle necked design makes for more reliable chambering (in theory).

It reminds me of the Tokarev round.

26 posted on 01/15/2015 10:36:09 AM PST by Jeff Chandler (Doctrine doesn't change. The trick is to find a way around it.)
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To: shove_it

I am not a vet, so this may sound like a stupid question. How often are sidearms used in modern warfare? At what range are they effective?


27 posted on 01/15/2015 10:53:01 AM PST by neocon1984
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To: neocon1984

In a combat situation handguns are your “Oh **** I’m going to die!” weapon. And most engagements are within feet.

L


28 posted on 01/15/2015 10:59:20 AM PST by Lurker (Violence is rarely the answer. But when it is it is the only answer.)
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To: 17th Miss Regt
When Delta started moving away from its customized 1911s to Glocks in .40 and 9mm, that made it just a little more harder for 1911s to be adopted by all and sundry. Rangers (real Army Rangers in the 75th and not those with a tab) have been using 9mm Glocks, as are some Army Special Forces members. SEALs in the numbered teams (1,2,3,4,5,7,8,10) obviously use Sigs, while those in the colored teams (DEVGRU Red, Blue, Gold, Silver and Black) can use almost anything they want, but primarily use Sigs and HKs.

Now, the only units using 1911s used to be the USMC special operations units - the Force Recon Marines, who used Colt 1911s to great effect. However, when the Corps realize they were missing out on missions because Force Recon was not a part of SOCCOM, they decided to create a new Special Operations group ...and MARSOC was born. Now, this meant that there were still Force Recon (totally under the Corps), and MARSOC that could be tasked by SOCCOM. This also meant that there were a lot of people who required those Colt 1911s, and usage of that sidearm by MARSOC has been going down.

The 1911 works great and is an amazing firearm (better than my $2,941 Glock 19 ....weird story on that), but chances of them ever being adopted widely are next to zero. Same goes for adoption of the .45.

29 posted on 01/15/2015 11:00:56 AM PST by spetznaz (Nuclear-tipped Ballistic Missiles: The Ultimate Phallic Symbol)
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To: shove_it
If you want a new cheap pistol, there's always the ugly Hi-Point in .45

http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/product/7-G34512

30 posted on 01/15/2015 11:08:45 AM PST by captain_dave
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To: 2CAVTrooper
Given the amount of use pistols see in combat, they could go to a Bond without significant harm:


31 posted on 01/15/2015 11:09:07 AM PST by Mr Rogers (Can you remember what America was like in 2004?)
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To: spetznaz
...my $2,941 Glock 19 ....weird story on that...

C'mon, give.

32 posted on 01/15/2015 11:12:09 AM PST by Talisker (One who commands, must obey.)
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To: shove_it

I once tried to get a product through the military approval system. By the time it was ready every general had to have their say and sprinkle pee all over the design. It was useless and I stopped wasting my time.

Now, with Obama’s all gay all the time military, it will need to approve the all tranny general staff. Who knows what they come up wit.


33 posted on 01/15/2015 11:17:03 AM PST by Organic Panic
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To: Talisker

Getting a license in my country (and a license is required to legally own a firearm) is a long and difficult process, and once (if) someone gets it then one has to purchase the firearm from one of a smattering of legalised shops. This means the pricing power is strongly in the hands of the dealers, and that is how 550 Dollar Glocks end up costing just under three grand. As for rounds, getting quality rounds is next to impossible and most licensed people have to do with S&B and Fiocchi JHPs from Europe. Not bad rounds (and I believe Trayvon Martin was done in with a 115gr S&B), but nowhere near the likes of a Federal HST, Winchester Ranger T or Speed Gold Dot. I was fortunate enough to (somehow ...) come across some Ranger Bonded, but that’s another story I would be foolish to get into. Anyways, the price of those S&Bs ...even the FMJ for practice ...is over a Dollar per round!


34 posted on 01/15/2015 11:50:13 AM PST by spetznaz (Nuclear-tipped Ballistic Missiles: The Ultimate Phallic Symbol)
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To: spetznaz
Speed Gold Dot = Speer Gold Dot.

Anyways, getting my license was one of the happiest days of my life, and even with the prices of ammo (and everything else) I am happy to be able to protect myself and my fellow citizens.

35 posted on 01/15/2015 11:53:43 AM PST by spetznaz (Nuclear-tipped Ballistic Missiles: The Ultimate Phallic Symbol)
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To: muir_redwoods

Shame about the politics of the 1911. First pistol I was allowed to use. Father required me to know the weapon. When I could field strip and reassemble it blindfold on the kitchen table, we finally went to the range. That chunk of steel will always have a special place in my heart.


36 posted on 01/15/2015 12:25:20 PM PST by Barkeep99
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To: shove_it
I'm astounded they declined to even evaluate the platform.

This pistol in .40cal (Model 96)would be a jewel.

37 posted on 01/15/2015 12:49:13 PM PST by Mariner (First the GOP must die. Everything else comes after that.)
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To: Jeff Chandler

All those calibers won’t go thru body armor. 9mm is a common round found all over the world. They should go with Glocks.


38 posted on 01/16/2015 2:19:50 AM PST by USAF80
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To: Mariner

Loads of females in uniforms that won’t be able to handle .40 cal. I’ve shot .40s and they are too hot for me and I’m a big guy.

The FN 57 would be controllable, has a high capacity mag and has good penetrating power but there is the issue about special ammo and costs.


39 posted on 01/16/2015 2:26:19 AM PST by USAF80
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