Posted on 08/10/2014 3:22:06 PM PDT by Morgana
“I suggest all of you consider how many were surrounding the cop as well as those that witnessed said scene. . This is a neighborhood of feral Affies. They live in a different culture, they lie, they cheat, they steal, and they attack in mass.”
And I bet you’ll be the first person to attack if anyone makes such a blanket statement of cops.
As for different culture? You just described cops. They live in a culture of mutual protection when one screws up. Never forget they found no wrongdoing in the Dorner hunt shootings, or the kid holding a Wii.
I fully understand that we have to keep the police on a tight leash given all the power we give them, still it’s odd that there’s nothing about their side of the story - not even a no comment.
I’m as leery of the “ ghetto community “ as the cops.
I disagree with you. There is little difference between being at home or on the street when there is a split second to make the decision to use force in self defense. The analogies demonstrate that lethal force can be justifiable when the victim or attacker is not armed. It wasn’t meant as a comparison of a cop on the street or a grandmother in her house, but the instant response of self defense.
You are out of line for implying I am a racist. My opinion has nothing to do with his color and everything to do with his own behavior as being a proud gangbanger in the picture his family provided to the press. It is likely that the unknown “male” he was walking with was also a gangbanger, no? And you will take his word as gospel?
Speaking of gospel, how can you possible put any faith into a CBS story? If you read other articles, you’ll see there is a lot of conflicting info coming from the family about what he was doing there or even where he was living. The family at one point said he was visiting his grandmother after going to the store, another article said he was living with her for the summer?
Regarding the police covering themselves, the shooting was by a young cop alone on a urban street, a member of the Furgusen P.D. They immediately turned the investigation over to the St. Louis County P.D.
I’m just saying that there is a lot of reason to suspend judgment on this case until more info is out rather than be knee-jerk “anti-cop”.
Stick with the case at hand. If not, review the trayvon case. Ask why OJ walked free when the evidence was overwhelming?
Thank you for your erudite explanation of why multiple shots might be needed when using lethal force. My quip was more a result of cop shootings that have occurred near where I live. In one instance a cop emptied his firearm into a car full of kids while the mother drove away, and in another a group of cops, thugs really, emptied their assault weapons into man who was camping on public property. The man didn’t have a firearm. The cops knew him to be a mentally disturbed individual, and he was standing well away from where the cops had gathered. He did have a knife, but was waving it in the air, not in an attacking posture. These types of incidents are not uncommon these days.
You are absolutely right. My last firearms training was more than 40 years ago in boot camp. Since then I limit my shooting to what it takes to work up hunting loads, and sight in rifles. My handguns go along to punch paper and cans, and add variety to a day at the range, which is a favorite spot in Carson forest.
Good shooting.
“must be a slow night on the “high school teacher has sex with student” front.”
Don’t hold your breath. The teacher has not been arrested....yet.
“Stick with the case at hand. If not, review the trayvon case. Ask why OJ walked free when the evidence was overwhelming?”
The case at hand, is LE willingness to cover the crimes of their own. As long as that Blue Line remains, a police investigation of their own is meaningless.
“I disagree with you. There is little difference between being at home or on the street when there is a split second to make the decision to use force in self defense.”
In your own home, you have automatic presumption of hostile intent by an intruder. On the street, it isn’t so clear cut. Sorry, but the two are not the same. Yes, deadly force can be justified against an unarmed person while on the street. But the bar for justifying it is far higher. It is not as automatic as in your home at 2AM
“You are out of line for implying I am a racist.”
your words. “And why would you believe these people anyways?”
You might as well have used neo-nazi aka neoliberalnot’s term of “Affie.” FYI, I’m white as Irish and sick of a lot of reverse racism. But I’m not blind to a statement clearly based on race.
I have little doubt he is going to be portrayed as a saint by his family. I also have little doubt that the cops will vilify him.
He may not be a saint, but there is little doubt that there has been a rise in cops shooting people without cause. Most of the time, no one can prove they are lying. Once in a while, like the knife shooting incident, they are caught in their lies.
The cops were amazingly silent on this one, though I see now they are making claims. Unsurprisingly, their claims require we take them at their word.
But cops have no word worth taking. They long since tossed aside any concept of truth. Time and again, they are caught lying.
“Regarding the police covering themselves, the shooting was by a young cop alone on a urban street, a member of the Furgusen P.D. They immediately turned the investigation over to the St. Louis County P.D.”
Yes, cops investigating cops. You trust they’d be as hard hitting as on anyone else? History suggests otherwise.
As for anti-cop, I only wish I didn’t have ample evidence to justify it. But I do. If cops don’t like that, they have only themselves to blame.
“I fully understand that we have to keep the police on a tight leash given all the power we give them, still it’s odd that there’s nothing about their side of the story - not even a no comment.
I’m as leery of the “ ghetto community “ as the cops.”
The silence isn’t odd at all, if they have something to hide and need to get the story straight. And they finally did come out with their own claims of a fight over the cop’s gun. Of course, that requires trusting their word is good. But LE history is clear, their word isn’t good.
We are talking about the profession that invented the throw down gun.
This other article has more info and includes a photo of the poor innocent victim flashing a gang sign.
Oh no! A GANG sign!
You are still out of line implying I am a racist. If it was a group of white neo-nazis claiming their friend was innocent and the cop was shooting to murder for no reason, I would have also asked why would you believe these people?
I’m curious... why are you always on the cop threads and consistently taking the side against the police no matter how implausible the story is against them? Yes, there is a percentage of bad cops out there, along with bad doctors, bad priests, bad accountants, etc.... Why do you have such an issue with police and always assume they are crooked?
Not necessarily. If the “unarmed” person has a measurable advantage (size, fitness level, health, etc.) over the armed person, then it may be considered a “clean shoot” if it happens at close-quarters. For example, in the Zimmerman case, Trayvon Martin was younger and stronger than George Zimmerman, giving him an enormous advantage in a close-quarters fight.
I’m not saying that the same thing applies in this situation; I would expect a police officer to have plenty of means at his disposal for subduing an unarmed teenager without resorting to deadly force. I’m just saying that it’s not a clear-cut as “unarmed = murder.”
There's nothing about that photo that surprises me.
“When the first shot comes at them they will rethink what they do.”
Do you think it’s “overdue?”
Thank you for taking a bit of commentary in good faith. I wasn’t intending to imply any broad conclusions about this or any other incident, I merely wished to take a moment to point out some of the unfortunate realities of a shooting that most people haven’t thought of (and hopefully will never HAVE to think of).
It’s easy for persons unfamiliar with the details involved in such events to draw spurious conclusions from limited information, or to place undue weight on some facts. Your post provided me with both context and motivation to point out some, as I said, unfortunate realities. Given some of the very heated and personally directed replies you’ve been receiving in this thread, I’d say it’s to your good credit that you took my comments in their intended informative and impersonal spirit.
I agree that there are, have been, and will be incidents where officers misused force — from negligence as well as malfeasance. Unfortunately, there are also times where legitimate use of force can be misconstrued by members of the public unfamiliar with the details of an individual case or the wider technical details involved in such incidents in general. I don’t have enough information about this incident to decide which of those categories it falls into.
You have a good day.
” I’m curious... why are you always on the
cop threads and consistently taking the
side against the police no matter how
implausible the story is against them?
Yes, there is a percentage of bad cops out
there, along with bad doctors, bad priests,
bad accountants, etc”
“Always” is a stretch. Inplausible? Only if you are unwilling to question a cops version of events. As for why? I can rattle of a long list of their offenses, without bothering to look at a list.
Their chief offense? Their acceptance of the worst among them. I can look past the individual criminals and rotten cops. But I don’t look past their lack of action against such cops.
And I can’t remember the last time I saw a cop who didn’t have a Bufford T Justice attitude problem. They care about no ones dignity. I’ve seen a few who can’t even grasp all the reasons MUST control how they talk to the public.
I am a citizen who obeys laws. No criminal history.
I should not have to fear a police encounter. And I should not have to endure attitude problems from the bully pulpit of a badge.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.