Posted on 07/13/2014 2:21:40 AM PDT by WhiskeyX
The Army wants to retire its supply of 9mm handguns and replace it with a more accurate and user-friendly model that also will provide soldiers with more “knock-down” power.
Army officials say their inventory of more than 200,000 semi-automatic Beretta M9 and Sig Sauer M11 pistols has become outdated, worn out and needs to be replaced with an updated model that also offers more reliability and durability.
(Excerpt) Read more at foxnews.com ...
Any gun will do, if the shooter is capable.
Pretty much the FMJ is the biggest performance limiter. I hear the 40 or 10mm is better for FMJ while being smaller than a 45acp.
Great story...I love it!
Only if its made out of Titanium or lighter material. WAY too heavy.
“Tankers also had the grease gun which was same ammo as the 45.Made perfect sense. The only thing that will replace a 45 is another 45.Never a need for a double tap... ever.”
45 acp,,’cause shooting more than once is just silly!
Sure, it doesn’t matter how a gun fits you. That’s logical.
Since the women folk in your clan are impervious to recoil and have the arm and finger reach of an orangutan, I suggest that you get them started on a 20mm Lahti converted into a pistol.
Hmm... Just checked out .460 Rowland. I may have to convert one of my 1911’s to that then compare it to my .460 S&W Magnum.
I doubt the Army would even consider a compensated 1911. Too big for the ladies to even hold on target.
Well, I’ve only had experience with 45acp when it comes to serious pistol use but I do listen a lot. Here’s the way I understand it.
If you want to properly arm yourself, carry around an Abrams tank. If you can’t do that then carry a M2 Browning. If you can’t do that because you work inside then you need a M14 or equivalent battle rifle. If you can’t carry that then an M4. If you can’t get a hold of one of those and still need to shoot someone then only then do you get a pistol.
Usually the pistol isn’t what you want. It’s what you have to use because the situation is bad and it’s what you have.
Ease of recoil and weight of ammo does play a part and sometimes has to be balanced against sheer stopping power. Especially when limited to FMJ. Training can overcome recoil. Muscle can overcome weight of ammo. Sometimes though you don’t want to push the odds.
I’ve heard many excellent results with 40S&W. I encourage the 45acp but I completely understand why some want something else.
The FAA requires pilots use oxygen over 10,500 feet. Coloradans do aerobics at over 12,500 feet. Skiing, hiking, off road motorcycles etc. All day long. Flatlanders turn blue sitting in a chair at 12,500 feet. Perhaps that makes us less recoil sensitive.
The first pistol I ever shot was a 1911, and I loved its accuracy from the start. Until recently I would have said no 9mm could woo me away from mine. Then I shot a Kahr Arms compact 9mm. We were trying one out at the range as a possible carry gun for my wife. She shot it first and said: “Honey, you’ve got to try this!” I shot the best group ever, without ever having touched that gun before. It was incredible. The next time I have a spare $850-900 I’d be sorely tempted. It also seems to me, here in MA, that 9mm ammo is less expensive and more available than .45ACP. I just started reloading .45 for that reason. I’ve got no insight into the military’s thinking on replacing the Beretta, but it seems unlikely it will be the 1911 no matter how much I love mine!
John M Browning designed one specifically to put down the Juramentado moslem fanatics. It was called the .45 ACP COLT.
Model 1911.
Why did the USA give up the best for a ho-hum 9MM cartridge?
What ever weapons/ammo are chosen for our today’s armed forces will come a choice of pink or rainbow.
We never should have gone from the 1911 .45ACP to F’ing 9mm to start with.
I’m thinking about moving to bear country. The 460 Roland isn’t even in the same neighborhood as the 460 S&W Magnum, there are just many more loading options with the big wheel gun and the case volume allows much more powerful rounds. But it would be much more easy to carry the flat auto and a lot lighter to boot.
But if you were required to carry FMJ for self defense, a 185 grain 45 caliber projectile traveling at 1600 fps would certainly get somebody’s attention. If I remember correctly, the classic 230 grain FMJ is pushed along at about 1400 fps. 255 grain solids are pushed out at about 1200 fps, which is what I would carry in bear country.
It would make a fun carbine round too.
I have read that the reason hollow and soft point bullets were banned was because the GERMANS could not get them to work through their new Lugers so they demanded only FMJ be allowed.
An addition to my previous post:
Uniforms must also be changed for the sake of our sensitive GI’s. Cammo is so bland they can’t express themselves.
Do I really need to add the Sarc label?
I’ve read that the semi-truncated cone FMJs pack quite a punch. I don’t believe they are made anymore though I do have some “target” loads in .380 ACP.
We gave up the 1911 as a bone to NATO countries. They gave up the 7.62 for the .556 and as a compromise we agreed to adopt the 9mm.
That seems unlikely since the Hague Convention of 1899 was approved one year before the Luger was first manufacturered and placed into service.
I’m a 5’8” male. I enjoy shooting my S&W Model 29 in 44 magnum, but I cannot shoot it worth squat double action because the gun is too big for my hand. Single action brings the trigger back to where I can hold the gun properly.
My DIL is 4’11” and weighs 100 lbs. She shoots a J-frame OK, but cannot handle a larger gun.
It isn’t the recoil, but the fit.
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