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How Liquid Natural Gas May Revolutionize Shipping, And Make Goods Cheaper
International Business Times ^ | March 29 2014 | Stephen Starr

Posted on 03/31/2014 12:36:06 PM PDT by thackney

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To: thackney
Thanks for another in a long line of informative energy posts, thackney !

Having said that, allow me to be the first to offer an unsubstantiated opinion re the following:

According to studies cited by the watchdog group Transport & Environment, air pollution from shipping causes 50,000 deaths in Europe alone every year.

             

21 posted on 03/31/2014 1:40:07 PM PDT by tomkat (can hear the whirlwind comin')
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To: thackney

I would think that the gas cloud would spread over a wider area, and being heavier than air would stay close to the ground, thus being more of a danger of a huge fireball.
Gasoline and crude oil, being a liquid at room temp, would stay relatively in one place limiting the damage.................


22 posted on 03/31/2014 1:50:46 PM PDT by Red Badger (LIberal is an oxymoron......................)
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To: Red Badger
, and being heavier than air would stay close to the ground,

Methane is much lighter than air. Unless trapped inside a building it quickly dissipates. Methane gas has to be diluted down to 15% concentration before it will ignite. By the time you get significant quantities diluted that much, it is well up in the air.

Much of Gasoline vaporizes into heavier than air gases.

23 posted on 03/31/2014 1:53:02 PM PDT by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
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To: thackney

Well, then I guess it’s okay...............


24 posted on 03/31/2014 2:03:39 PM PDT by Red Badger (LIberal is an oxymoron......................)
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To: Red Badger

Hydrogen is the one to watch out for with a leak.

It is flammable over a wide range of concentrations, 4% to 75%.
It will detonate at 18% to 54% by volume.
It will detonate without being confined.
It will leak out of the tightest seams and connections.

It is mitigated somewhat by being so light. It dissipates fairly quickly.


25 posted on 03/31/2014 2:05:11 PM PDT by ltc8k6
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To: ltc8k6

Corection - It will detonate at 18% to 59% by volume.

Hydrogen also requires very little energy for ignition. It’s easy to ignite, and is flammable over a wide range of concentrations.


26 posted on 03/31/2014 2:07:35 PM PDT by ltc8k6
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To: ltc8k6

Sheesh! Correction...


27 posted on 03/31/2014 2:07:55 PM PDT by ltc8k6
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To: ltc8k6
Re: Hydrogen


28 posted on 03/31/2014 2:11:05 PM PDT by Disambiguator
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To: thackney; RayChuang88

~LNG won’t even ignite, it has to be warmed to a vapor first. The methane vapor has to be diluted down to 15% concentration with air before it will ignite.~

Indeed, they are an explosion hazards in case of any minor fuel leak. I wouldn’t ever used one on high seas because of storms, waves etc.
Another thing is a price issue. LNG is not cheap at all and for that reason is not ever competitive with pipeline delivered gas in Europe.
It can’t beat oil as a boat fuel in that department as well.
Sounds like another green blunder.


29 posted on 03/31/2014 2:14:30 PM PDT by wetphoenix
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To: wetphoenix
Indeed, they are an explosion hazards in case of any minor fuel leak. I wouldn’t ever used one on high seas because of storms, waves etc.

I guess the decades of LNG carriers, running on LNG vaporized, have just all been lucky.

Another thing is a price issue. LNG is not cheap at all and for that reason is not ever competitive with pipeline delivered gas in Europe.

You imagine cost = equals price? LNG is already being imported into Europe. It is economic to convert to LNG, Transport and Vaporize. Pipelines don't provide enough gas to Europe and Asia to meet their demands.

30 posted on 03/31/2014 2:40:17 PM PDT by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
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To: wetphoenix
Indeed, they are an explosion hazards in case of any minor fuel leak. I wouldn’t ever used one on high seas because of storms, waves etc. Another thing is a price issue. LNG is not cheap at all and for that reason is not ever competitive with pipeline delivered gas in Europe. It can’t beat oil as a boat fuel in that department as well. Sounds like another green blunder.

Welcome to FR and spend some time reading basic engineering before posting. Having an opinion devoid of reality is the realm of liberalism.

I have a homework assignment for you. All the information is available with google. Why is a standard automobile fuel tank more dangerous than LNG?

There is really nothing you posted that has any truth to it, but I will endeavour to direct you in the right direction. Do you have a clue of what Gazprom charges per therm?
31 posted on 03/31/2014 3:35:02 PM PDT by PA Engineer (Liberate America from the Occupation Media.)
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To: wetphoenix
Indeed, they are an explosion hazards in case of any minor fuel leak

You are misinformed. The LNG trade has been running for fifty years. In fact the first contract was for LNG from Algeria to the UK in 1964. During which time not a single LNG carrier has been lost. The worst accident was in a Japanese port when a Kaverner- Moss type carrier ran aground and ripped 600 ft of its hull. The vessel was off-loaded to a sister ship without further incident. The only fire aboard an LNG vessel was a lightning strike on a vent stack which was quickly put out.

LNG vessels use the boil-off from the cargo tanks in their own boilers so this technology of dual fired ships boilers is long established.

In addition these carriers have methane detectors all over them and purging systems which remove air from void spaces around the cargo tanks.

32 posted on 03/31/2014 4:36:32 PM PDT by Timocrat (Ingnorantia non excusat)
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To: PA Engineer; thackney; Timocrat

Thank you for a hint guys. I did some research and it seems like you are right and my earlier opinion was based on biased interview.


33 posted on 04/01/2014 9:53:27 PM PDT by wetphoenix
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