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To: MamaTexan

“Well you’ve certainly got me on the Roman history part, but I was speaking more on the conceptual origins of the terms as they immigrated from England.”
The terms are Latin and are common to everyplace and every society which at one time was subject to and the inheritor of Latin custom and law. The North American Colonies inherited some of their customary law and statutory law from English, French, Dutch, German, Spanish, and Swedish colonies and communities incorporated tinto the United States, while much of the common-law and statutory law was original to the American Colonial and later State and Federal courts and governments. Although Vattel was an important contributor of the natural law concepts, he was by no means the only source of the natural law concepts. No small part of the natural law concepts arrived in America along with the first English, French, Dutch, Swedish, and German colonists and their first colonial charters. The United Provinces of the Netherlands of the Dutch republic were a notable inspiration for these earliest colonists. The Dutch even to this day do not have a national citizenship, relying instead upon municipal forms of citizenship. The concepts behind jus soli and jus sanguinis were applied with varying specifics by ancient Rome and ancient Greece just as they were by the later societies of England, the rest of Britain and Europe, and America. It is because these are man-made and unnatural laws that they are subject to so many variatons in specifics and applications.

So-called natural law too has been the subject of many schools of thought and application over the millenia from Plato and Aristotle to the Framers of the Constitution of the United States. The differences in opinion and application, however, was reduced to a simple and easy to understand application by the reliance of the Framers of the Constitution upon legal commentators as Vattel, Blackstone, Coke, and others in their efforts to implement their intent to exclude any person whose allegiance at birth could potentially compromise loyalty to the sovereign People of the United States to the exclusion of all other sovereigns. Due to the nature of fealty and feudal law with respect to jus soli and jus sanguinis, there is but one possible definition which accomplishes the intent of the Framers. The legal doctrine of jus sanguinis, being a law in the civil code, can and often does authorize the granting of citizenship to a person born outside the allegiance of the sovereign and the soil of the nation granting the citizenship, which is contrary to the intent of the Framers, whereas true natural born citizenship does not permit by its very definition the possibility of conflicting allegiances and loyalties. at birth.


385 posted on 05/09/2012 2:27:40 PM PDT by WhiskeyX
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To: WhiskeyX
The legal doctrine of jus sanguinis, being a law in the civil code, can and often does authorize the granting of citizenship to a person born outside the allegiance of the sovereign and the soil of the nation granting the citizenship, which is contrary to the intent of the Framers, whereas true natural born citizenship does not permit by its very definition the possibility of conflicting allegiances and loyalties. at birth.

Yes, the Framers were very specific about the Presidential qualifications.

The rest of your post contained some interesting information. I'd only researched the law of nations concept as written by Vattel, Pufendorf, and Grotius.

387 posted on 05/09/2012 2:35:57 PM PDT by MamaTexan (I am a ~Person~ as created by the Law of Nature, not a 'person' as created by the laws of Man)
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To: WhiskeyX
The legal doctrine of jus sanguinis, being a law in the civil code, can and often does authorize the granting of citizenship to a person born outside the allegiance of the sovereign and the soil of the nation granting the citizenship, which is contrary to the intent of the Framers, whereas true natural born citizenship does not permit by its very definition the possibility of conflicting allegiances and loyalties. at birth.

Yes, the Framers were very specific about the Presidential qualifications.

The rest of your post contained some interesting information. I'd only researched the law of nations concept as written by Vattel, Pufendorf, and Grotius.

388 posted on 05/09/2012 2:36:09 PM PDT by MamaTexan (I am a ~Person~ as created by the Law of Nature, not a 'person' as created by the laws of Man)
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