Posted on 02/25/2012 6:12:30 PM PST by Deo volente
Gas prices climbed higher Saturday, continuing to march ever-closer to the all-time average local high of $4.60 per gallon set in 2008.
Jitters over the standoff in Iran's nuclear program have led to surging oil prices and unstable markets worldwide. Locally, a big refinery fire also hiked prices for motorists, with no end in sight.
(Excerpt) Read more at ocregister.com ...
That there has been wild money “printing” as well as massive deficit spending is true, but blaming the equally wild recent increase in the retail price of gasoline upon this is not at all accurate.
The dollar has been relatively stable vis-a-vis other currencies for over two years.
I’ve been under the impression that refinery capacity has been a problem, but that has been refuted on this thread.
That leaves sabre-rattling in Iran. Speculative excess in anticipation of a blockade at the Straits of Hormuz is the only explanation. Once the threat has been neutralized, there will be a price decline on par with that of 08 - 09. The demand is just not there, not here, not in Europe, not in Asia. We’re in worse economic shape, globally, than we were then. Domestic production has increased to the point that we’re a net exporter for the first time in, what, thirty, forty years?
Believe me, I will gladly pay $10 a gallon until November if it ensures the demise of the Magic Communist Negro.
The other problem California has different gasoline blends than the rest of the nation because of “air quality” rules.
Since we’re now a net exporter of refined gasoline, I wonder if it’s simply more profitable to ship it where the cost of gasoline to, say, European consumers, is much greater?
I wonder how the average American would react to a dozen refineries suddenly going offline for six months, resulting in the price of gasoline doubling?
Not production, only refining. We still import a huge amount of oil. We are a net exporter of refined products only.
Who the (blank) CARES what Europe does, or "thinks" of us? If they are so stupid as to tolerate $7 per gallon gas, more power to them, but we are not Europe. We're not nearly as densely populated as they are. THEY need trains and have them. We don't need passenger trains, and they're simply not practical for our population. High speed rail? Has nobody even asked how that would be possible? You can't legally plow through cities at 150 mph in a train. You have to go 30mph for safety regulations. And who the hell wants to go to Fresno in the first place, let alone on a train?
If Obama were a republican, you'd never hear the end of jokes about his intelligence.
$7 per gallon gas= astronomical costs for everything, for everyone. Poor and minorities hit hardest.
So basically it’s all speculative at this time?
???
The price of oil is high. Just like jewelry is expensive now due to the price of gold, the price of gasoline is driven by the world oil price.
The WTI to Cushing is the price quoted often for oil. But that is about $20 cheaper than most of the oil used in many of our refineries.
WTI is currently bottlenecked. There are multiple projects in the works to eliminate that, but it takes time.
There’s no way the majority of people will hold President Obama responsible for high gas prices.
They’ve been programed by the MSM to blame it on President Bush.
Just bought a used 2011 Hyundai elantra today. 40 mpg up to 47 on the highway. I have to drive 60 miles a day to work. The pick-up at 14 mpg finally was just too much. Plus the pick-up is 14 years old and I was going to have to get something a little newer anyway. Hope it is not a lemon. Dang I hate driving a car. I have drove a pick-up and a standard since I was 15. Sigh.
I can’t help but believe that the huge falloff in apparent demand recently is due to some problem in the metrics used.
What gives? The economy is taking a dive, but not that much of one.
Food prices are also going through the roof at my local supermarket. It’s astonishing how expensive some things are now. A 14.5 ox box of cereal (7 small ‘servings’) is $4.69. A 12 oz package of Bologna is selling for $5.49.
Even the cheap brands of beer go for $7.99 a six-pack.
I’m going to check out the Grocery Warehouse, where prices are lower and most of the customers speak Spanish.
You’re right, people are agitated. I’ve noticed that lately. More road rage, too.
Be careful out there.
No, there is measureable less product being sold.
The Elantra is supposed to be a pretty decent car. You probably have some kind of Warranty on it, even if it’s used.
I’m still driving my Civic with 154,000 miles. Runs great. Gets about 30 mpg.
How brutal is that?
Then throw in all the other taxes, sky high every rising food costs, rent, insurance etc., etc.
They are done.
What ever happened to the good ole days
when there were “GAS WARS”?
Wish those days were back!
We are exporting fuel due to economics. Self-imposed economics.
With demand down, the oil companies have shut down their most inefficient refineries. For the most part, they were in the Northeast.
The result left the Gulf Coast long on refined products, the Northeast short.
Normally, that would be solved by shipping the Gulf Coast's excess production to the Northeast. However, there is no pipeline capacity available to handle the task -- environmentalists having stalled expansion of the pipelines serving this route.
How about shipping it by tanker then? Too expensive. Because US law mandates that all shipments between US ports must be handled by US flag ships and fully unionized crews.
It's actually less expensive to a.) export the excess refined products from the Gulf Coast to Caribbean markets and then b.) provide the Northeast with refined products shipped from Nigeria.
A significant expansion of Colonial’s main gasoline pipeline, originating in Houston and connecting Gulf Coast refineries with markets across Colonial’s system, has been approved by the company’s Board of Directors.
http://www.colpipe.com/press_release/pr_114.asp
December 21, 2011
A 100,000 BPD capacity increase to the mainline serving the Northeast was put into operation earlier this year. This line begins in Greensboro and serves the Philadelphia, New, Jersey and New York markets.
A 75,000 BPD capacity increase to the distillate mainline is under way, with 20,000 BPD accomplished and 55,000 BPD due online by mid-2012. This line originates in Houston and terminates in Greensboro.
- - - -
Now combine that with a falling demand.
but I think we have plenty of oil....we're just being suckered and there isn't a damn thing to do about it except pay them their dirty money...
Another example (the list is countless) of government regulations killing business and the economy.
We’re drowning in red tape and government control, and Obama represents more of it. Exponentially more.
Where there’s a will there’s a way, but many will just throw up their hands and fall into the ever-expanding safety net, which benefits Obama.
Those who continue to work in low paying positions while attempting to remains self sufficient will end up on scooters, which is something I’ve witnessed here over the past couple of years. They’ll end up in combined households, whether that’s renting rooms out in their own houses or ending up doing so in someone else’s. And they’ll end up relying on private charity in the form of church food banks and aid societies, when monetary emergencies strike. That will happen more and more.
It can’t continue for long, in other words. Something will give. Whether it’s favorable to the existing trajectory or a rejection of it, that’s the big question.
I would take the falling sale of gasoline a better indication of the real strength of the economy than the media and government reports.
Ya know, every time the GOP wants to drill [like in 2008], we hear from the DEMs:
"Oh, it'll take three years to get the oil into production" ...
Or, if we want to build more nuclear plants:
"Oh, it'll take ten years for them to come on-line" ...
WELL, if we HAD started drilling in 2008 AND we HAD started building more nuclear plants in 2002 - WE WOULD HAVE THEM BY NOW !!!
BTW - MORE than 60% of France's electric power is nuclear - about the ONLY THING the Frogz got right ...
“More road rage, too.
Be careful out there.”
You, too. I noticed the road rage at full steam a week ago, when I went out for something at night. I ended up taking a back way, but at that, saw three accidents.
Hey Boop
You are not listing...
Obama told us to put more air in your tires to get better gas mileage.
Demand didn’t decline that much with the first wave of the financial crisis in 08 - 09. People were terrified then, at least here they were. It’s not as bad this time. Maybe we’ve just been ground down and are accustomed to it by now, while much of the rest of the country is getting its first taste of what we went through then? It just doesn’t stand to reason, to me.
While it sounded almost flippant and dismissive at the time (and was), overinflating your tires actually does increase fuel mileage. Careful though, wet traction is negatively impacted, the car can feel darty and less stable, and braking distance can be increased. If you really get carried away, risk of blowout is increased and irregular tire wear becomes a problem.
“Something’s very wrong here. We’re being fleeced.”
YES, WE ARE, by Obama’s monetary policy, that has pumped so much liquidity (Printed Dollars) in to the markets in the last few months, that it has SIGNIFICANTLY DEVALUED THE DOLLAR, vs other currencies, especially oil-based ones, like the Canadian Dollar.
$1 Canadian now equals $1.001 US Dollars.
In 2008, it was around $.80 US Dollars.
We get around 24% of ALL of our oil from Canada.
But hey, as long as the Ponzi Scheme lasts past the Novenber election, it’s all good. Right?
Yeah, great, put more air in the tires, haha, but you end up paying in the end because of tire damage.
And president dumbass probably thinks that worn out tires are OK, as long as we use less gas. No petroleum used in tire production I guess.
“You can’t legally plow through cities at 150 mph in a train. You have to go 30mph for safety regulations. And who the hell wants to go to Fresno in the first place, let alone on a train?”
Where on earth did you ever get such an idea?
Amtrak runs 100mph, 125mph, and faster right through urban areas.
I’m retired now, but I used to run passenger trains through the outlying areas of Boston (Readville area) at 100mph. They’re going that fast now, or faster, with the Acela service.
They don’t waste any time through densely-populated New Jersey, either.
Coming into New Carrolton (MD, just out of DC), they’re at 100 (or even a bit faster).
Where did you ever get such an idea?
I was reading about the Ford Shale deposits in South Texas.
Seems there is one county sitting on the shale area....4 years ago started drilling (horizontal and fracking)...now supports 12,000 high paying jobs as is shipping 100,000 barrels of oil a day.
Standard recommended tire pressure in the United States is on the low side due to our preference for a smoother ride. Tires can typically be inflated at least 10 psi above manufacturer recommendation without abnormal wear or other adverse effects, and it does reduce rolling resistance, thereby increasing gas mileage. Going higher than that does start getting into the problem territory you describe.
I guess you’re not aware of railroad speed limits? How can that be?
I traveled by Amtrak quite often throughout the US and became aware of the speed limits. Not only can the feds regulate the speed, but state and local entities have a say in them also.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_limits_in_the_United_States_(rail)
In the United States, the Federal Railroad Administration has developed a system of classification for track quality.[6][7] The class of a section of track determines the maximum possible running speed limits and the ability to run passenger trains.
Track type Freight train Passenger
Excepted [us 1] <10 mph (16 km/h) not allowed
Class 1 10 mph (16 km/h) 15 mph (24 km/h)
Class 2 25 mph (40 km/h) 30 mph (48 km/h)
Class 3 40 mph (64 km/h) 60 mph (97 km/h)
Class 4 [us 2] 60 mph (97 km/h) 80 mph (129 km/h)
Class 5 [us 3] 80 mph (129 km/h) 90 mph (145 km/h)
Class 6 110 mph (177 km/h)
Class 7 [us 4] 125 mph (201 km/h)
Class 8 [us 5] 160 mph (257 km/h)
Class 9 [us 6] 200 mph (322 km/h)
Do you remember what brought down gas prices the last time we went through this BS.
The President (NOT the pResident) was going to open our strategic oil reserves and look what happened...
gas prices came down!
Do you think Obummer has the zalls to do this (think again)... a G20 conference was held today in Mexico City and our clueless tax cheater Geithner stated that the US is considering this option, but don’t count on it!
My grandpa was a lifer brakeman for Burlington Northern, later full conductor for Amtrak. Never heard of 125 mph, ever.
Not saying wrong, just never seen it, or heard of it.
http://www.allgov.com/ViewNews/US_Oil_Exports_Reach_Record_Highs__Thats_Right__Exports_110905
Funny how politician after politician keeps talking about the necessity to drill for more oil in the U.S., be it in Alaska or in the Gulf of Mexico or on public lands—considering that America has been breaking records this year for exports of petroleum.
‘Set them up at home.’
NOT AT HOME, UNLESS THERE’S A SOUNDPROOF OFFICE!
Not for dad’s sake, but for the family!
Homes are for busy kids, babies and moms while dad is at another location.
I have seen first hand dad requiring mom to keep the kids quiet while he attempts to talk on the phone, hoping the crying baby or barking dog won’t ‘give him away.’
This is unfair and nuts!
There could be other styles of inexpensive cluster offices or something in every town.
Bet there is already.
Keep the house a home, and the office, the office.
Huh? How many moms with babies and barking dogs wouldn’t like dad working at home? And why the need not to have dad’s location given away?
PS
And dad coming out of the home office all blustery and irritated at everyone because of a deal gone wrong, or whatever.
I’ve seen the creeping tendency of folks working at home, and the atmosphere is not acceptable, IMO.
Congratulations to those who achieve a near-perfect work/home situation. We’ll probably hear of a few soon . . .
People start raising cain.
My hubby has worked at home for years now and it’s been a blessing. No wasted hours spent in traffic, no gas expenses, wear and tear on cars, wardrobe, lunches, etc.
So many folks work from home now that no one pays attention or cares about a barking dog or crying baby. The dog and the babies are far better off with dad/mom AT HOME all day rather than a few frantic, exhausted hours in the evening.
You’re probably right - some would like those conditions, and some would not.
Giving dad’s location away?
There is a level of professionalism expected with many occupations, and crying babies and barking dogs just don’t have a place during those transactions.
Guess I’m called old fashioned.
I’m serious, tho, about having some sort of inexpensive ‘cluster’ offices - sharing a receptionist, for instance. This would keep people near home.
Happening as we speak, I’ll bet.
Sure, that already happens primarily for consultants and the like, usually for the address and occasional in-person meeting. For non-phone talkers: Starbucks.
There are now actually more women than men in the workforce, and how many of the men are married parents with kids under, say, age 4, at home? Probably not too many. And probably even fewer of these prospective home professional workers live far enough out in the boonies that a barking dog isn’t a burden on a whole neighborhood, let alone whoever else is on the other end of the phone.
The percent of men who wouldn’t prefer to at least sometimes work from home if possible? That, in contrast, would be quite high and the vast majority of those would already have some sort of dedicated office or desk space set up for that.
Further, the percent of those men with stay-at-home moms and babies who don’t have a large enough house to have an office space far enough from potential baby noise? Minuscule.
Meanwhile, I’ve been talking by phone with professional men from such firms as IBM while they are “working from home today” (which is quite often every day) for decades. Not an issue if you are a genuine professional.
Wouldn’t some of that capacity increase be offset by the increased demand in the NE created by the recemt shut down of some older refineries in NJ / Philly?
I don’t have babies, they are now 14 and just turned 18 (about to head to college come August) and DH has been working from home quite a bit over the last few months, mainly because his office has become a zoo but that is another story. I don’t mind for a day or two at a time but add that up with the weekends and I’m like go to work P-L-E-A-S-E . . . cuts into my routine. LOL
If people in the US start feeling pain this summer when food costs soar at least Obama will be further out the door. In that sense $5-6 per gallon is good, maybe conservatives should drive more and help it along. The system needs to be taken down, disruption should not belong solely to the left.
Let’s consider, where cheap energy can improve lives the US people are generally afraid of nuclear, want to stop using ugly coal, chase away drilling from all over the continent, won’t build refineries because they are dirty, etc, etc. General voter sentiment? “Oil is dirty, factories too, all should be banned.”
When the average USA voter cares less about who wins the big game today than how they will eat, then change will come.
“I guess you’re not aware of railroad speed limits? How can that be?
I traveled by Amtrak quite often throughout the US and became aware of the speed limits. Not only can the feds regulate the speed, but state and local entities have a say in them also.”
I’m quite aware of RR speed limits. I was a railroad locomotive engineman for 32+ years. I daresay that in all your train travels, you have but a drop in the ocean of time I spent running locomotives.
Yes, some towns can request that a railroad lower the speeds through certain areas, but in the end, it’s pretty much the railroad’s call as to whether they’ll comply.
I can only think of one example in the territory in which I worked (from New York to Boston, from New Haven to Springfield, MA, both sides of the Hudson from NY/NJ to Albany, through the Southern Tier of NY, etc.), and that was after a bad accident at a grade crossing in Wallingford, Connecticut. I don’t know for sure if the town tried to compel Amtrak to reduce speeds through there (numerous grade crossings within a short distance), or whether the railroad decided to do that on their own. They did lower speeds there.
But in other places, they RAISED speeds. I’m thinking through the Bronx, the south end of Boston, etc. In most places the tracks are fenced off, but that still doesn’t prevent trespassers from getting in.
The FRA classification for track speed has NOTHING to do with where the tracks are — and everything to do with how the track is constructed. That’s why they can do 100-125 just a few miles outside of Boston South Station — because it’s high-speed track with concrete ties and appropriate signaling.
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